Electric Fan Conversion

[boostdemon]

By: Dave Barton

Description: This page will outline a simple and inexpensive primary electric fan conversion for the Volvo 240 and 740. While there are many options for your Volvo when it comes to keeping cool, this one is presented at face value with no specific claims, other than my own experiences.

http://www.turbobricks.com/mods.php?content=art0008

[Jordan]

I am ready to do this conversion, and I think I've found a good candidate. I dont like buying used if I can help it, so I've found this.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/14-INCH-ELECTRIC-COOLING-FAN-PRO-SERIES-14-INCH-FAN_W0QQitemZ8026867023QQcategoryZ33600QQrdZ1QQcmd ZViewItem

I am just worried with the drain it will put on my alternator... will it be able to handle it? I am going to be running Sirius Satellite radio, and a 52x4 watt CD deck.

[AJS]

What alt do you have? What condition is it in? Did you ask them the current draw of that fan? what fuse is fitted to the deck? 10amp?

[Jordan]

i have the stock Volvo Turbo alternator i was having some grounding issues with it, whenever it grounded it would charge fantastically. I JUST finished the wiring harness and put on a spanking new ground wire so it should be up to the task. its a 12V fan so i would think that it takes 12 Volts. i have NO idea about the fuse, i was going to ask about that when the fan came, or search i remember someone talking about them going to best buy and buying fuses for it.

[240Psycho]

in this article there is no mention of a electrical relay or switch to turn on the fan at a certain temperature.

These relay/fan thermastat kits can be bought for $60 at a local auto zone or Discount, these are adjustable and come with a relay and all the wiring to hook it up, however i have had an electric fan on my car since 2003 and it has failed me 3 times, 2 used GM fans and one brand new Imperial Fan and 2 relay kits have gone out on me.

-one thing to note is to use a big relay, such as a 30 or 40 amp relay(at least) for your fan. these can be picked up cheap at junkyards out of volvos just remember to get the 5 pronged relays or 4 with 87A missing(this prong gets power all the time until the relay clicks)

Here is a diagram of the relay of how it should all go together:
http://www.aaroncake.net/rx-7/efaninstall2.gif

[volvostud]

Any thoughts on mounting an LED to this circuit? How about an LED that turns off when the fan is on. That way when you see the light on, you know that the fan is off. If the fan is off for too long you know something is wrong.

[745TiGene]

not to get off topic, but i wired my efan to the ac fan (has been eliminated) wires and it works great

[ShadowofBob]

not to get off topic, but i wired my efan to the ac fan (has been eliminated) wires and it works great

Are you sure you aren't running too hot now? I know the fan was originally there for extreme heat and in case the clutch fan failed. Do you know what the temp switch that is in the radiotor(or coolant hose) is rated at?

[240Psycho]

Are you sure you aren't running too hot now? I know the fan was originally there for extreme heat and in case the clutch fan failed. Do you know what the temp switch that is in the radiotor(or coolant hose) is rated at?

I had a small fan infront of the condensor, the wires never got power and the fan when hooked up to a battery failed to come on, so it wont work for every one.

I hook my relay's ground up to the t-stat in the radiator, it does indeed come on too hot, but not enough to really hurt anything, i had the fan set before to 165, the t-stat in the radiator is set to 180 i beleive. at anyrate i was driving the car around with no fan for about 4 days, so this new set up makes me feel more at peace

[240Psycho]

Any thoughts on mounting an LED to this circuit? How about an LED that turns off when the fan is on. That way when you see the light on, you know that the fan is off. If the fan is off for too long you know something is wrong.

And this is very possible but the fuse for the relay/fan could fail and the LED would never come on,
at any rate, if you wanted to do this you would hook a wire up from the relay at terminal #87A and have it go to the LED then a ground from the LED, as soon as the thermastat closes in the radiator and makes a ground, the coil in the relay will become charged and pull the magnet over to the other poll(87) and turn the fan on.

Thats a good idea you have there, maybe placing it under the temp gauge would be a good place for it.

[Sinbad the Sailor]

If you wanted the fan to stay on regardless of whether the car is on or not could you hook the ground for the fan to the thermostat and the positive straight to the battery. Would that burn out something? What is the best way to hook the fan up for this? Also what is the best temperature thermostat to use for this? Would the stock 740 thermo that mounts in the rad be okay?

Thanks

Spencer

[swedefiend]

If you wanted the fan to stay on regardless of whether the car is on or not could you hook the ground for the fan to the thermostat and the positive straight to the battery. Would that burn out something? What is the best way to hook the fan up for this? Also what is the best temperature thermostat to use for this? Would the stock 740 thermo that mounts in the rad be okay?

Thanks

Spencer

High amperage current should never flow through a switch ;-)

Relays are your friend... (They are there for a reason)

[swedefiend]

Oh yeah, I use a Saab Relay. 50 amps. Cost about zero dollars from the junkyard.

[faster4_tec]

The fan that is driven on a pulley on the front of the engine, is that fixed to the shaft, or does it only turn upto a certain rpm, then stay there whilst the engine continues accel?

Just it seems to be stopping any sort of top end 'go' out of my engine.

Could I remove it and have a nice electric set up, to compliment my electric water pump etc that i am also fitting (more reliablity and trustworthy ness then performance orientated).

[tjts1]

The fan that is driven on a pulley on the front of the engine, is that fixed to the shaft, or does it only turn upto a certain rpm, then stay there whilst the engine continues accel?

Just it seems to be stopping any sort of top end 'go' out of my engine.

Could I remove it and have a nice electric set up, to compliment my electric water pump etc that i am also fitting (more reliablity and trustworthy ness then performance orientated).
Electric water pump is more reliable than a belt? I don't know about that. I mean moving air is one thing. The electric fan only has to be on when the car is sitting in traffic basically. But the water pump is on all the time. Also that electric water pump is being run by the alternator which is also turned by a belt.

As of the belt driven fan, it is connected to the engine through a temperature controlled clutch. The air coming out of the radiator heats up the clutch which provides more and more traction for the fan as the temp goes up. So the theory goes. Its a very simple and reliable system. The fan clutch usually fails by keeping the fan permanently connected to the water pump at all temps which creates a fail safe mode. I converted the 240 to an electric fan it was worth it for the reduction in noise alone.

[davidmacq]

I was asking someone about this in another thread. Whether you remove the belt driven fan. They said yes, but that doesn't sound right. If the Electric fan is set up right, it will keep things cool and you will recieve a performance benefit? You don't need to remove it do you?

My old car, I had trouble tracking down where and why it was losing water. Turns out the fan clutch had gone out, and the electric fan was not coming on at all. It would lose water without the temp guage reading anything but straight up and down until the water level got low, then it would show hot. Seems really stupid to regulate the temp guage like that.

[240Psycho]

David, Pm me if you own a 240, i can help you out.

This thread is deals with the Electric fan converson on the rwd bricks.
The conversion removes the noisy, heavy clutch fan, to get replaced with the electric fan that is mounted on the radiator.

The fan that came stock on some cars INFRONT of the condensor is nothing more then an ac cool down fan, this fan was not intended to be used to cool the car down at idle.

Also electric water pumps is a different topic, if you want, you can start an article about how to do that.

Not trying to be an ass, but it would be nice if this stayed ontopic and delt with electric fans only.

[davidmacq]

I have a 940.


There are some things I think aren't clarified about this modification. I was under the impression that the electric fan a lot of people acquired are from 940s.

The link at the top of the page doesn't mention removing the fan clutch from what I could find.
My question was does this conversion use this electric fan from the 940 and does the conversion remove the fan clutch.

I ask because if the fan people use is the one from the 940. Then I could remove my fan clutch to get the same performance benefit.


It was my understanding that the fan clutch did not engage until the engine got hot. So it may also be possible to set the electric fan to come on first for a performance benefit.

So what I wanted clarified, what isn't included in the article. Is the 940 electric fan suitable. Sounds like it isn't from what you say, and does this article suggest removing the mechanical fan, or just setting up the electric one to come on first with a thermostat, etc.
Thanks, feel free to delete any of my questions. Please include this info in the article?

[740Weapon]

even tho you dont believe in using mathmatical models to get a performance edge,

hopefully this helps illustrate using a 940 fan:

http://www.pbase.com/740weapon/electric_fan

[davidmacq]

LOL, don't believe in a bunch of physics crap and talking smack. Models are fine.

I wasn't disputing this mod. Just wanted to know if the 940 fan is used, and if people are actually removing the fan clutch. The article doens't go into that, and person above said 940 fan wasn't the type used.

I'd like to set mine up to come on first, so the fan clutch doesn't engage. Seems like that would give performance benefit also. Maybe near the same as removing the fan clutch. Just some things that I thought weren't answered about this mod. Don't have much of an opinion either way.

[740Weapon]

if you dont remove the clutch fan an electric fan probably wont fit.

and the clutch fan is always stealing power.

just less when its cold.

old clutch fans are usually burt and rob too much power anyway.

so you should also buy a new clutch if your even going to attempt to use both kinds of fans.

dont use both kinds, it doesnt really make sense to do so.

[brucepick]

I have a 940.... Is the 940 electric fan suitable...

I used a fan from a 960 for my e-fan conversion. Works great. I know that others have done this too. I think the 940s had the same fan.

You want the radiator fan, the one behind the radiator. Be sure to take the plastic shroud too. The relay for the fan is on passenger side, behind the headlight. Take that also, and as much length of wire as you can get that's attached to the relay. There are 2 thin ones that are grounded to 'trip' the relay. Red and green power out go to the fan. Heavy red (power in) goes to the battery. On mine, the heavy red wire had a fusible link in it, but I only found that because I traced that wire from the relay all the way to where it ended at the battery and got the whole thing. Definitely worth the effort.

The relay is excellently built. Mine was from a roughly 10-year-old car, and the gasketing on the relay terminals is so good that the contacts in there are still shiny as new. That's a good thing for a fan that can draw maybe 27A. That's another reason I like having the fusible link - I didn't have to bother setting up a high-amp-rated fuse for this project.

[tjts1]

I used a fan from a 960 for my e-fan conversion. Works great. I know that others have done this too. I think the 940s had the same fan.

960/940/850 all had the same 2 speed electric fan.

15 months after installing the 940 fan in the 240, it finally blew the 30a fuse this past weekend. I caught it in traffic as the temp gauge (compensation board removed) spike past the half way point but long before the red. I replaced the fuse (always carry spare fuses in the glove box) and I was back in business in 3 minutes.
This is the wiring diagram for the Volvo fan and relay.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v242/tjts2/c70c43d2.jpg

[dezquest]

I found a 940 in my junk yard here locally, and I am a little confused. I have an '87 240 DL automatic, and my A/c Sucks when the car is not moving. I added a fan to my A/C Condesor and it was working great until it started getting into the '80s. I want to convert to e-fan. I know I need the relay and the wiring, But how do I remove that big monsterous belt driven fan in front of the B230F engine? and how do I mount the 940 e-fan. ?

[Steve O]

I want to convert to e-fan. I know I need the relay and the wiring, But how do I remove that big monsterous belt driven fan in front of the B230F engine? and how do I mount the 940 e-fan. ?
The easy way out on removing the fan is to remove the entire assembly and replace the waterpump studs with short bolts.

As far as mounting it the e-fan, you could do it this way...
<a href=http://forums.turbobricks.com/showthread.php?t=34418 target= blank> Custom Shroud</a>

[765tiME]

OK, I'll bite...

I found a fan (forget from what... Ford?) 17" and fits near perfect in the existing shroud provided for the stock fan (760 b230 etc.). But it only just interferes with waterpump studs. Anyone have a source for short waterpump studs or P/N? Anyone have a single pulley setup? I'm about >1/4" away from having it fit. With Dremel I've taken about as much material away from the Ford? housing as I am comfortable with...

...OK and so I followed the link in the last post and what do you know? I think thats the same fan! I'm in the same boat.. except that instead of the 5+ inches of clearance I have an intercooler and am right up against the water pump studs with the same setup. Hmmmm.

[PetesDustyVolvo]

OK, I'll bite...

I found a fan (forget from what... Ford?) 17" and fits near perfect in the existing shroud provided for the stock fan (760 b230 etc.). But it only just interferes with waterpump studs. Anyone have a source for short waterpump studs or P/N? Anyone have a single pulley setup? I'm about >1/4" away from having it fit. With Dremel I've taken about as much material away from the Ford? housing as I am comfortable with...

...OK and so I followed the link in the last post and what do you know? I think thats the same fan! I'm in the same boat.. except that instead of the 5+ inches of clearance I have an intercooler and am right up against the water pump studs with the same setup. Hmmmm.

you could just replace the studs with bolts

[Steve O]

OK, I'll bite...

I found a fan (forget from what... Ford?) 17" and fits near perfect in the existing shroud provided for the stock fan (760 b230 etc.). But it only just interferes with waterpump studs. Anyone have a source for short waterpump studs or P/N? Anyone have a single pulley setup? I'm about >1/4" away from having it fit. With Dremel I've taken about as much material away from the Ford? housing as I am comfortable with...

...OK and so I followed the link in the last post and what do you know? I think thats the same fan! I'm in the same boat.. except that instead of the 5+ inches of clearance I have an intercooler and am right up against the water pump studs with the same setup. Hmmmm.
Share what you find out as I'll be in the same boat soon when we +T the 240 in a few months.
I'll let you know how it turns out.

[765tiME]

Might be a week or so... before I get to it to put it in, more pressing projects at hand. I'll try with bolts instead of studs and check for clearance. Hope it works because the fan fits the stock shroud so nice, and its dual speed.

[F1reBird]

sweet write up..im thinking about doign this within the next fw weeks..maby months..

[thelostartof]

sweet write up..im thinking about doign this within the next fw weeks..maby months..

you should do it ASAP .. one of the best cheap mods out there that picks up a fair amount of power

[Aoder1]

^^ im planning on it soon prolly in a couple weeks ;)

[EmaGen]

Im doing my fan this friday.. hopefully

[smurf244]

I did a E-fan on my 244 6 or so months ago and have put on 6000 miles on it with no problem. I just redid the the wiring today just cause I was board and wanted it to look pretty :-P. For the water pump studs, I just flip them around and it works just fine. I can takes pictures if anyone would like.

Later,
Adam

[Eargasm]

OK, I'll bite...

I found a fan (forget from what... Ford?) 17" and fits near perfect in the existing shroud provided for the stock fan (760 b230 etc.). But it only just interferes with waterpump studs. Anyone have a source for short waterpump studs or P/N? Anyone have a single pulley setup? I'm about >1/4" away from having it fit. With Dremel I've taken about as much material away from the Ford? housing as I am comfortable with...


Can't you just shear a little bit off the studs with your dremel?

[socalsean]

Can't you just shear a little bit off the studs with your dremel?

Yes...just be sure you thread a nut on the stud, cut off the extra part of the unneeded stud, then remove the nut. This will re-cut the threads after the cutting wheel does it's havoc.

[thelostartof]

Can't you just shear a little bit off the studs with your dremel?

would be 10000x easier to just go to a local hardware store and buy 4 bolts that fit it .. i did that 5 years ago when i did my elec fan swap and they are still there working just fine

[peacereef]

what would the cons be if you just had the fan going at all times? i have the fan in the article and i have a crazy old man who knows cars. so all i can see is that sitting in traffic you would get annoyed with the sound?

[GrandmaSideways]

I am ready to do this conversion, and I think I've found a good candidate. I dont like buying used if I can help it, so I've found this.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/14-INCH-ELECTRIC-COOLING-FAN-PRO-SERIES-14-INCH-FAN_W0QQitemZ8026867023QQcategoryZ33600QQrdZ1QQcmd ZViewItem

I am just worried with the drain it will put on my alternator... will it be able to handle it? I am going to be running Sirius Satellite radio, and a 52x4 watt CD deck.

Should be no problem, it's when you get into amps and subs that the problem really comes up. I have a 350WRMS sub and a 400W MTX amp, as well as four speakers and a high end deck, and power windows, locks, car alarm, etc...
Basically I wouldn't worry about it until you start getting amps. I noticed my headlights would VERY SLIGHTLY dim when the bass really hit, at idle. I got a 1 farad capacitor and it's no longer an issue. You'll be okay, as long as your battery is in decent shape.

[Rockmonton]

Can't you just shear a little bit off the studs with your dremel?

turn the studs backwards, they fit!

[smurf244]

turn the studs backwards, they fit!

Thats what I did.

[Rockmonton]

just curious, what models of cars are you all ganking the fans from?

[smurf244]

I got mine from a inline 6 960. I think the same fan is in the s40 but not sure.

[Aoder1]

got mine from a 940...wiring harness and all but here ya go

http://www.turbobricks.com/mods.php?content=art0008

[500dollar744ti]

i used a chrysler lebaron fan... looks great on the car, almost like factory and fits even with 3 inch thick intercooler...

http://xs215.xs.to/xs215/07224/IM003667.jpg

[Rockmonton]

just grabbed one from a dodge spirit/plymouth acclaim, very similar fan, but trim an inch off the large side of the shroud, and actually pressure fits in no problemo. should be good when i get it wired up!

[500dollar744ti]

just grabbed one from a dodge spirit/plymouth acclaim, very similar fan, but trim an inch off the large side of the shroud, and actually pressure fits in no problemo. should be good when i get it wired up!

yeah i believe that is actually the exact same fan, just trim to fit! looks great

[Rockmonton]

well, the mounting tabs are different, yours from the lebaron interchanges with the minivans (voyager/caravan) where as the sundance, acclaim and spirit have a slightly different one (that works just as well.

[lammmy]

nice, I grabbed a fan from a 92 acclaim or something. Only the V6's had to seem a useable fan, all the 4-cyl and turbos had fans with super skinny/long fan motors. I'm all excited to get it installed, I alreayd have the relay and wires all wired up.

Too bad I just got pulled over for being too low. He said my exhaust was lower than the lowest rim. I went out and measured and the exhaust is like an inch taller...so lame. Now I have to get an inspection....great. I'm going to have to find on non-cut springs :(

But back on topic, the fan looks like it will fit nicely.

[740tankDriver]

I'm thinking of instaLLING a 3000 CFM fan from summitracing.com, what can it hurt? any input? going to remove my mechanical fan and upgrade to this fan with a manual override switch in the cockit. only! I will control when it will come on. BTW, I hae already removed the auxiliary fan for condensor, will the condesor fan power outlet work for a new fan or will i have to hot-wire new wiring????

[McLovin]

Maybe this is here somewhere, but I didn't see it.

I really want to do this as I HATE how loud my engine is at idle or at any RPM for that matter.

Can someone who's done this type up a shopping list? Basically EVERYTHING I would need to d it?

I'll probably find an e-fan from a car at the JY.

[500dollar744ti]

Maybe this is here somewhere, but I didn't see it.

I really want to do this as I HATE how loud my engine is at idle or at any RPM for that matter.

Can someone who's done this type up a shopping list? Basically EVERYTHING I would need to d it?

I'll probably find an e-fan from a car at the JY.

which car are you doing it on?

[clifford]

960/940/850 all had the same 2 speed electric fan.

15 months after installing the 940 fan in the 240, it finally blew the 30a fuse this past weekend. I caught it in traffic as the temp gauge (compensation board removed) spike past the half way point but long before the red. I replaced the fuse (always carry spare fuses in the glove box) and I was back in business in 3 minutes.
This is the wiring diagram for the Volvo fan and relay.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v242/tjts2/c70c43d2.jpg


I do not know if this thread is dead or still alive but I will take a chance and ask my question
I am also thinking of biting the bullet :drool: and putting an e fan on my 1990 240

First most imp question :???:
How to see if the junker fan is good (apart from the looks of it)?

I have few questions about this diagram


1. Green from c1 - Does it power the high speed of the fan or the Red from C2

2. Since I have a 240 so signal for high speed will come from sensor mounted on rediator (This sensor came stock with Nissens ,hopefully it should work)
So does the Grn/org from B1 and Yel/Brn from B2 go to this Rad mounted sensor

3. So how do we power the low speed . ?

I would like to power it Via a manual switch so that I am able to increase the cooling effeciency of AC when moving at slow speed.I hope this will not cause any issues for the
engine cooling as it will be controlled via the temp sensor)
Will it be through this relay shown in diagram or I will need a separate relay controlled by a manual switch at dash.


If I am thinking correctly then this means that one of out put from either C1 or C2 does not connect anywhere. Is that correct.

Regards
Gopesh

[tjts1]

1. Green is low speed, red is high.
2. It depends if you want the the switch to activate low speed or high speed. GRN/ORG activates low speed, YEL/BRN activates high. On my car low speed is activated by the thermo switch at the radiator, high speed is activated by the switch in the dash as a backup. Make sure you verify the temp rating of the switch that came with your Nissens radiator. It should be stamped on the side of the switch in degrees C.
3. Both low speed and high speed are powered at all times by "fusible link" through the relay. I can't explain the whole diagram in words. It would be best to get assistance from someone with more electrical experience. All the symbols an wires are self explanatory.
Good luck

[McLovin]

which car are you doing it on?

Teh 1987 240DL Wagon.

[BDKR]

This is what I was thinking for some wiring, but I got a feeling that the one Kyle posted on the first page of this thread will indeed work fine. I think I'm going to give his a try this evening. If not, I'll use the one below.

http://forums.turbobricks.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3158&stc=1&d=1179770502

The idea of this one is to use the first relay to arm the system. I just never liked the idea of taking power for the fan directly from the fuse panel. Of course, Kyles diagram doesn't either. ;-)

[BDKR]

For the record, the above diagram works perfectly. :nod:

[icebrick]

For the record, the above diagram works perfectly. :nod:

I will install a 940 e-fan in my 91 240 soon using a relay from a 960. The diagram in BDKR's post shows the fan single speed, controlled on-off by a thermostat with a manual overide switch that disables the circuit . I want to have my fan operate 2 speed. In Cliffords diagram the fan appears to operate either low or high triggered by the engine control module. Does the relay have a central position where the fan is off?
More pertinent to my application, if there is no central position on the relay, does that mean that I will need two sensors and two separate relays to have
"OFF"
"LOW"
and "HIGH" settings, or I guess my real question is....is"OFF" really needed?

[TheJoyOfSix]

Be brave and give $110 to http://www.dccontrol.com/ for their FK-35 e-fan controller.

This little box of tricks contains everything you need bar the fan itself. All wiring, mounting screws, temp sensor, connectors etc are included. It's a variable speed controller and the set temp is adjustable via jumpers. It also includes inputs for A/C and permanent feed.

I have one fitted to my 760 V6 and it works great. Stuck in a motorway tailback in 80* ambient temps it kept the coolant temp constant and was barely noticeable in operation due to it gradually building up speed as neccessary. It's wired to the high speed side of a 960's fan, with the slow speed side controlled by a switch on the dash to give me an emergency back-up.

Have a look at their site - it includes all info neccessary about the controller and the instructions to fit it. I can't reccomend it enough.

[A-Rode]

Oh yeah, I use a Saab Relay. 50 amps. Cost about zero dollars from the junkyard.



Amen to that!
somethings at yards just cost $free.99
Mine wanted $8 for a foglight relay

[McLovin]

Amen to that!
somethings at yards just cost $free.99
Mine wanted $8 for a foglight relay

So does it matter if the relay is high amperage? A 50 amp will work just fine compared to a 35 amp?

[BDKR]

The diagram in BDKR's post shows the fan single speed, controlled on-off by a thermostat with a manual overide switch that disables the circuit .


Everything is correct except for the manual override part. The switch that disables/enables the circut is a switched power source! In other words, put your key in and turn to on and the fan circut is enabled.

Additionally, the easy way to run and control your fans is just to get one of these:
http://static.summitracing.com/global/images/prod/large/flx-31165.jpg

It also has the two stage (variable speed) control you are after.

I decided a long time ago that hacking the OE fan stuff sucks. Here is my fan.
http://static.summitracing.com/global/images/prod/large/der-16926_w.jpg

[McLovin]

Alrighty, so I yanked a Lebaron fan today at the jy. In good order. Got it for $15.

What all should I need other than this?

I also picked up a little relay that I found in a Saab 900S there. It's called a cooling fan timing relay. I figured it might be useful. Anyone know anything about it? I'll get a pic here in a bit if need be.

[icebrick]

Everything is correct except for the manual override part. The switch that disables/enables the circut is a switched power source! In other words, put your key in and turn to on and the fan circut is enabled.


:oops: duh on me, ...you're obviously not using the same (940) relay as Clifford is using. And looking back at the 940 relay, I see now that the fan is "off'" if neither sensor is "on". Which is what I was going for.

Thanks, I think I'm less confused!

Edit: ..and it can also be wired as a Switched power source ?

[OttoB]

Saab also have 2-pole switch, 87 and 92 C, suitable for two speed fan.

[elyktaylor]

Any idea what the minimum CFM capability should be?

[McLovin]

Can someone please post some pictures or descriptions of what relays they're using. I'm just not getting that part.

[icebrick]

Check ebay ..."VolvoFan Relay", or post in this forum in 'Wanted' 940/850 efan relay if you want to use Volvo parts.

[MikeSr.]

I did an electric fan swap from a 940 into my 1990 740 GLE 16V, using the big radiator, and the stock Volvo relay. This is a very easy swap. The relay has two wires coming out of the middle which are grounds used by the 940 ecu to turn the fan on, one at high speed and one at low speed. I hooked these wires to temp sensors, one in the radiator and one in the lower radiator hose, like a 240 turbo. The low speed wire is on the lower radiator hose. On each sensor, i took the other connector and sent it to ground. Main power wired to the battery+, Done! Now the fan turns on if either sensor reaches it's temp setting and completes the ground circuit.
Much quieter car now- and it runs cooler with the big radiator. Anybody with an engine driven fan should do this swap.

Also put a late 940 intercooler in at the same time. Wonder why?

[McLovin]

I did an electric fan swap from a 940 into my 1990 740 GLE 16V, using the big radiator, and the stock Volvo relay. This is a very easy swap. The relay has two wires coming out of the middle which are grounds used by the 940 ecu to turn the fan on, one at high speed and one at low speed. I hooked these wires to temp sensors, one in the radiator and one in the lower radiator hose, like a 240 turbo. The low speed wire is on the lower radiator hose. On each sensor, i took the other connector and sent it to ground. Main power wired to the battery+, Done! Now the fan turns on if either sensor reaches it's temp setting and completes the ground circuit.
Much quieter car now- and it runs cooler with the big radiator. Anybody with an engine driven fan should do this swap.

Also put a late 940 intercooler in at the same time. Wonder why?

So, what connections does the 940 fan have? I like how you did it and this is exactly what I've been after, but I have a LeBaron fan that I'm gonna fab to fit. It just has a two prong connection wire coming out of it. Does the 940 fan have some special connections that indicate it's a 2 speed?

[MikeSr.]

The 940 relay has power in marked"30" on the relay- this uses a large red power wire in. The output has two poles ,also for power wires. The control part of the relay has two grounds. The relay has two different power paths,each with a different resistance built in, thus one powers the fan with more current at high speed, and the other powers with less current at low speed.
So, essentially there are two relays built into one,plus a resistance in line to control current flow.
The easiest way to do this is to use a 940 or 850 fan relay and harness and just use the grounds to control the relay thru the temp sensors, like I did. (Thanks to 740ATL for suggesting this setup to me).
If you have no Volvo relay, you could duplicate this setup with some simple relays and a couple of resistors with different resistance specs. Add a fusible link rated at 30 amps to the power wire to prevent pyrotechnics!

[tjts1]

The relay has two different power paths,each with a different resistance built in, thus one powers the fan with more current at high speed, and the other powers with less current at low speed.
I was with you there most of the way. The speed control is built into fan itself not the relay. If you just connect the fan directly to the terminals on a battery without the relay, green wire will give you low speed, red wire high. I have a 940 fan installed in a bmw without the volvo relay and I still have low and high speed functional.

[MikeSr.]

Good to know the resistance is in the fan wires, not the relay. Substituting another set of relays would work just fine. Another reason this is so easy. I had a donor 940 and just used the relay and harness when I moved the fan and radiator over. Easily done and a perfect fit w/o mods. Mikey did a similar setup with an aftermarket fan on the cover car and just used a simple relay and radiator temp sensor for a 1-speed fan.

[Homer]

Put a 9xx LH 2.4 ECU in your car. It has efan control built in.

[smith_t240]

Just to add to this thread so I can find it later, lol - on my Volvo relay there were two wires that could be grounded out for hi or lo fan speed, coming right off the relay:

Blue/Black - lo speed
White/Black - hi speed

I used the Saab switch (87/92) in the lower rad hose. Works nice so far.

[MikeSr.]

One addition - there is a fan ground wire in the harness, too.
Also-wired my way, the fan will run with the key off until temps cool down.

[Homer]

One addition - there is a fan ground wire in the harness, too.
Also-wired my way, the fan will run with the key off until temps cool down.

Same here.

[Tamnakz]

I'm converting my '86 240 to an E-fan, and am also going have another conversion ready for when my '76 244 gets on the road. I picked up 850 fans. I've got one question on it though.

I'm going to set the high speed off an in-line temp sensor (Bottom radiator hose, I'm using a Saab inline sensor housing). I'm going to run this off an ignition-switched relay, so that it only works when the car is on.

The low speed, I'm going to run off of the sensor in the radiator, so it'll continue to cool on the low after the car is turned off.

Does anyone see a problem with this?

[Boostin740]

where do you get the sensors for the coolant lines that turn the fan on at a certain degree (looking for around 190-200F unless someone says otherwise)
i tried an e-fan out of a 95 buick century custom, but the damn fan motor was too big. :grrr:

[Tamnakz]

Pick up an in-line sensor housing from a Saab. 3 bucks at the local PnP for me.

[mickeys240]

High amperage current should never flow through a switch ;-)

Relays are your friend... (They are there for a reason)

tell that to chrysler. 2 fires in the same place. (The switch)

[Jordan]

I just wired up a fan in my car with a Honda four-pin relay. They are mega reliable. I can scan the diagram I used and take pictures of the install too if there is any interest. Lemme know. It works perfectly and took me about an hour.

[Steve O]

I'm converting my '86 240 to an E-fan, and am also going have another conversion ready for when my '76 244 gets on the road. I picked up 850 fans. I've got one question on it though.

I'm going to set the high speed off an in-line temp sensor (Bottom radiator hose, I'm using a Saab inline sensor housing). I'm going to run this off an ignition-switched relay, so that it only works when the car is on.

The low speed, I'm going to run off of the sensor in the radiator, so it'll continue to cool on the low after the car is turned off.

Does anyone see a problem with this?
The one in the radiator is too high. Use a low temp sensor from a scirrocco<sp> in the saab fitting for the low speed and the one in the radiator for the high speed. I did mine like this and haven't had the high speed come on yet as the low temp works well.

[jmclay]

Everything is correct except for the manual override part. The switch that disables/enables the circut is a switched power source! In other words, put your key in and turn to on and the fan circut is enabled.

Additionally, the easy way to run and control your fans is just to get one of these:
http://static.summitracing.com/global/images/prod/large/flx-31165.jpg

It also has the two stage (variable speed) control you are after.

I decided a long time ago that hacking the OE fan stuff sucks. Here is my fan.
http://static.summitracing.com/global/images/prod/large/der-16926_w.jpg

What model fan & controls are in your post, and where did you get them?


EDIT: found it

http://forums.turbobricks.com/showthread.php?t=76270&highlight=electric+fan+radiator+dimensions

[BDKR]

What model fan & controls are in your post, and where did you get them?

Go to Summit and search Derale. That fan/shroud assembly should come up. I'm not using that controller right now, but they have those there at Summit as well.

[Crazychopstick]

Okay, with the 940 relay, if teh highspeed (white/black) is running to a dashboard mounted SPST switch, do I need any inline fuses anywheres?

[Jordan]

Okay, with the 940 relay, if teh highspeed (white/black) is running to a dashboard mounted SPST switch, do I need any inline fuses anywheres?

Any hot wires, or wires that are supplying power should have a fuse as close to the battery as possible. If the hot wire goes through a relay however if its a hot relay system instead of a grounded relay system you just need the fuse on the battery side, again as close to the battery as possible.

Thats just a general wiring rule of thumb.

[Crazychopstick]

Any hot wires, or wires that are supplying power should have a fuse as close to the battery as possible. If the hot wire goes through a relay however if its a hot relay system instead of a grounded relay system you just need the fuse on the battery side, again as close to the battery as possible.

Thats just a general wiring rule of thumb.

I'm guessing it's a "grounded" relay system since the switch will be leading to a ground (how the 940 2 speed operates). So it's not hot? So no fuse?

[Jordan]

I'm guessing it's a "grounded" relay system since the switch will be leading to a ground (how the 940 2 speed operates). So it's not hot? So no fuse?

Correct. As long as there is a fuse from the power supply, if anything surges that fuse will blow and it will be impossible for any other wire to spark and cause a fire because they will all be dead wires. You don't really need a fuse but its insanely stupid not to have one. Just remember, any wire that goes from power supply (+) to anything needs a fuse as physically close as possible to the origin of the (+) source.

[McLovin]

Okay. So seriously. What temp sensors do you guys use???!?!?? I have a T-Fitting from a Saab 900S and I assumed I'd be able to find a generic sensor at autozone or something, but I can't find one anywhere. I really need to get this thing up and running. Using the heat when I'm in traffic is killing me.

[tryingbe]

Google found

I paid $34 for an adjustable thermostatic fan control switch from O'Reilly auto parts. It's made by Hayden Automotive, part # 3647. Includes a temp sensor that mounts to the radiator as well as a control box and relay.


http://www.partsamerica.com/productdetail.aspx?MfrCode=HAD&MfrPartNumber=3647

thelostartof

me personally i just went and got a cheapo $15 haynes switch crap from kragen/autozone/pep boys .. as they all have it .. its just a generic rad/thermostat that is adjustible so its nice as you can set it when to come on and what not. take its design for measuring the temp isn't all that great but for $15 it worked as has yet to fail me

Also
http://www.partsamerica.com/productdetail.aspx?MfrCode=HAD&MfrPartNumber=3652&PartType=843&PTSet=A

[JohnMc]

I'm vaguely considering taking the 940 efan back off mine, and putting the shroud and mech fan back on. the issue is that on hot days, when driving around fast with the A/C on, the temp needle rises.

But a couple of things hold me back:
1) Still haven't bypassed the temp compensation board, it might just be dorky electronics on patrol
2) The car hasn't ever actually exhibited any signs of overheating other than the gauge going up, never actually boiled and blew steam all over the place
3) The MS ECT shows a very jumpy and spike ridden signal, I should probably replace the temp sender before I do anything else (sometimes, especially under full throttle runs, the temp shows spikes of only a split second duration where the temp shoots from 230 up to 300 ish and right back down again. And it's generally very wiggly all the time anyhow)

[tryingbe]

You know, if I don't have any problem with electronic fan conversion in 110 degree weather, nobody else should.

JohnMc, do you have the splash guard installed at the bottom of your car?

[McLovin]

Google found



http://www.partsamerica.com/productdetail.aspx?MfrCode=HAD&MfrPartNumber=3647

thelostartof


Also
http://www.partsamerica.com/productdetail.aspx?MfrCode=HAD&MfrPartNumber=3652&PartType=843&PTSet=A

What's the difference between the two?

They both say Hayden Fan Control Kit, but one's $40 and one's $24.

[JohnMc]

Yep, has a splash guard. I recently replaced the thermostat and the original radiator with a 3-row with little improvement. The fan is a two-speed 940 fan, low speed hooked up to a combination of either the A/C high pressure switch (piggy backed onto the existing pusher fan control circuit) and/or Megasquirt fan control, on at 210 and off at 190. The high speed is hooked up to the switch on the rad, comes on around 225 degrees.

A couple of other possibilities (in addition to the gauge/sender issues I mentioned above):
1) Perhaps I should remove the OEM pusher fan in front of the radiator, might just block more air than it does any good with the current setup. Currently, it works in conjunction with the 940 fan.
2) My cheap eBay NPR was somewhat grotty, although I cleaned it up it's possible it isn't allowing as much air through as a cleaner, newer NPR might.

But again, driving it hard on a hot day isn't an issue, and using the A/C on a hot day isn't either. It's just the combination of the two (sustained periods of on-boost driving on the highway with the a/c blowing) that sends the needle up. And again, the needle going up is the only sign of trouble, and I have reasons to doubt it. Never had issues with the mechanical fan, but that was a while and quite a few mods ago.

I wired mine up to permanent 12V as well, and the high temp switch on the rad works well, usually cycling the fan on and off a time or two on cool down. i can only imagine that's good for the underhood environment to get that mani/turbo heat out of there instead of just letting it all bake.

[McLovin]

Yep, has a splash guard. I recently replaced the thermostat and the original radiator with a 3-row with little improvement. The fan is a two-speed 940 fan, low speed hooked up to a combination of either the A/C high pressure switch (piggy backed onto the existing pusher fan control circuit) and/or Megasquirt fan control, on at 210 and off at 190. The high speed is hooked up to the switch on the rad, comes on around 225 degrees.

A couple of other possibilities (in addition to the gauge/sender issues I mentioned above):
1) Perhaps I should remove the OEM pusher fan in front of the radiator, might just block more air than it does any good with the current setup. Currently, it works in conjunction with the 940 fan.
2) My cheap eBay NPR was somewhat grotty, although I cleaned it up it's possible it isn't allowing as much air through as a cleaner, newer NPR might.

But again, driving it hard on a hot day isn't an issue, and using the A/C on a hot day isn't either. It's just the combination of the two (sustained periods of on-boost driving on the highway with the a/c blowing) that sends the needle up. And again, the needle going up is the only sign of trouble, and I have reasons to doubt it. Never had issues with the mechanical fan, but that was a while and quite a few mods ago.

I wired mine up to permanent 12V as well, and the high temp switch on the rad works well, usually cycling the fan on and off a time or two on cool down. i can only imagine that's good for the underhood environment to get that mani/turbo heat out of there instead of just letting it all bake.

Does it stop rising? As in level off anywhere? I haven't had a fan in my car for about a month and I just turn on the heat when i'm sitting or driving through town. My car will sit just below the redline on the temp gauge and not blow steam or anything of the sort.

[Crazychopstick]

Correct. As long as there is a fuse from the power supply, if anything surges that fuse will blow and it will be impossible for any other wire to spark and cause a fire because they will all be dead wires. You don't really need a fuse but its insanely stupid not to have one. Just remember, any wire that goes from power supply (+) to anything needs a fuse as physically close as possible to the origin of the (+) source.

So I guess I'm off to get an inline from Radioshack. I saw a 30amp one with a waterproof seal, should that be sufficient?

[Jordan]

So I guess I'm off to get an inline from Radioshack. I saw a 30amp one with a waterproof seal, should that be sufficient?

Thats exactly what I have. I even got it at RadioShack.

[tryingbe]

What's the difference between the two?

They both say Hayden Fan Control Kit, but one's $40 and one's $24.

The more expensive one is adjustable, you can get the fan turn on at your prefer setting.

The other one is preset at 185, probably be fine for most people.

Also, you want to use at least a MAXI fuse. You do NOT want to use regular 30 amp fuse on a fan, it's going to melt that fuse slowly.

30amp maxi fuse works fine for me.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Electrical_fuses%2C_plug-in_type%2C_different_sizes.jpeg

[brucepick]

I run low speed off a relay that's tripped by the brake light circuit.
That's from a tip from mapleafer of this board.
Uses a 240 dome light relay along with the main fan relay to give some delay to both the on and off functions to reduce on/off cycling.
Works very nicely.

However I have no a/c and no boost. With those heat-generators running you'd best have a good temp sensor functioning as well.

Be sure you have the oem splash pan, between radiator and front of block.

And be sure you have the scoop that picks up air from the three holes in center of oem air dam, sending that air up to the radiator. Makes a nice improvement in cooling when car is rolling.

[242Bleek]

I am in the process of hooking up a 940 e-fan and relay on my 242t and I have a few questions. I have all 10 gauge wire and a 30A fusible link running from the battery positive to the relay power terminal. I ground out the low speed pin on the relay and the fan runs fine on low. But when I ground the high speed pin, it blows my 30A fuse every time. Could I just put a 40A or 50A fuse in it's place? I am using a Saab temp sensor switch to run the fan on low speed. I have another temp sensor switch and radiator hose T that came standard on my 242t, I believe it was used to control the fan that sat in front of the AC condenser. Does anyone know about this switch, and what it's temp range is? I was thinking if it came on at a hot enough temp I could use it to control the high speed on the fan. If not i'll prolly just hook it to a safety switch in the car.

[tryingbe]

I use a 30 amp maxi fuse and it never gave me problem.

[vvpete]

fan control, on at 210 and off at 190. The high speed is hooked up to the switch on the rad, comes on around 225 degrees.

But again, driving it hard on a hot day isn't an issue, and using the A/C on a hot day isn't either. It's just the combination of the two (sustained periods of on-boost driving on the highway with the a/c blowing) that sends the needle up.

I think the temp trip points for your fan are waay too high.

In Dallas things get hot under the hood, and my conversion has worked well in 110 deg heat with A/C on sitting in traffic. It's important to match the thermostat temp (87 deg C) with the trip point of the switch in the 3-row radiator, on at 87, off at 82 deg. Note that due to the location of the switch on the upper left, the coolant temps into the radiator are much higher at the opposite side, which means that if you have an on temp 210, that means the head is running at well over boiling, like 230 deg F or more. Even with good system pressure the temp is dangerously high.
If you use a fan switch in the lower radiator this tempdifferential is much greater, and an even lower temp trip is required. The lower hose fan switch from Volvo is a very high trip point as it was only inteneded for aux cooling when A/C was on. For primaary cooling this temp trip point should be about 80 C/175 F

The triple-row radiator I have came with a Vernet switch, on at 92 off at 82 deg C. It lasted about 1 yr with my 940 conversion . I saw some similar temp rises after a hard run in hot summer weather. I replaced it with a NAPA on 87 and off 82 degrees C and everything has been fine for the past yr and a half, except that the switches don't last more than a year, some only 8 months.

Anyone else experience the problem of failed switches?
Anyone know where to get the 22 mm thread Vernet switch that comes in the Nissen radiators?

FYI some part numbers and equivalents for the temp switch, 22mm thread for the aftermarket 3 row radiator:

Vernet p/n ??? on 92 off 82
NAPA p/n FS150 on 87, off 82 C (198/188F)
FAE p/n 201-0809 on 87, off 82
Wahler VWW022209 on 87, off 82
-
I'm using the stock Bosch relay dirrectly from the battery, I don't use a fuse, and wonder why anybody would think they need one, as this power control relay is designed to be a fuse in itself, which is the way it was used in the 940.

[davashcow]

I think the temp trip points for your fan are waay too high.

I'm using the stock Bosch relay dirrectly from the battery, I don't use a fuse, and wonder why anybody would think they need one, as this power control relay is designed to be a fuse in itself, which is the way it was used in the 940.

I was looking at a used 245 off Craigslist last week at the owner's home and commented that the owner's other car (a 940) had the fan running which was weird since it was cold out. He said he hadn't driven it for hours. We lifted the hood and found the fan happily running and the fan relay merrily smoking and giving off lots of heat. I suggested that he disconnect the battery, so he did and end of story but that could've been a fire. I will use a fuse when I hook up my 940 fan to my 302 conversion.

[brucepick]

I've been using Wahler switches since I installed the fan in summer of '05. No failures through this past fall. After that the weather cooled off and the temp switche(s) don't activate again till spring.

[500dollar744ti]

if you choose to use a 90-94 chrysler lebaron 3.0 v6 efan, for the record it is about 2.25 inches thick, this is the style you want because of thickness. they should also be found on same year spirit/acclaim with 3.0 v6.

trim along red lines to fit volvo 740 radiator.
http://xs223.xs.to/xs223/08041/lebaronfan277.jpg
^^^ only picture i could find of fan for mockup lines is this aftermarket replacement, the actual mopar oem fan is even thinner. the one i have is oem mopar.

[Volvit]

my $.02 for those who need it...

I did the 940 efan swap yesterday on my 86 245. And yes it is as easy as everyone claims it is.

First I trimmed the shroud right next to the flaps as seen in the picture ("borrowed" from volvo940tuner)

http://www.evolvolution.com/images/940efan.jpg

I attached it to the radiator with two self-tapping screws up top and two zip ties at the bottom.
That was the easy part. Next is the ever dredded (sp?) wiring. Which when explained in plain english is cake.

I suggest when you pull the fan from a yard you leave as much stock wiring as possible. I left the wires going from the fan into the relay as they were on the 940. I cut the wires COMING OUT of the relay and the black ground. There should be a total of 4 wires you have to worry about (or 3 if you don't need a high and low speed). 1 is a black ground which is up to you where you ground it, I used the fuse holder by the battery. The red wire is second. It should be fused, it looks like most use up to and above 30 amps. I took another route, it was a small circuit breaker (for lack of better words), this way if it trips it can reset itself, not cause a fire, and I don't have to worry on a hot day about over heating. I hooked the red wire directly up to my battery. At this point you can ground the blue/black wire and low speed should work or ground the white/black for high speed. I chose low speed, because it was enough air flow, for my weather. So I took the blue/black wire and ran it across the firewall behind the motor and connected it into the Saab T-Housing with a coolant sensor fan switch from an 85-92 VW Jetta/Golf 1.8 SOHC. It was the same thread size and everything, cost about $10 from a VW garage. After connecting the Blue/Black wire to one terminal, I grounded the other terminal to the washer fluid bracket. The switch is constantly open and when the temperature is reached it closes and completes the circuit and grounds the fan, turning it on. There was something goofy about the saab switch which I didn't understand, it seemed that it was always closed. Either way it works as it's supposed to now. I don't think I forgot anything, let me know if I did. The whole deal cost was $15 for fan and relay/wiring, $3 for the Saab 900S T-Housing, and $10 for the sensor. Total = $28 + spare wire, connections, screws, zip ties, etc. So call it $30.

[Crazychopstick]

I wouldn't trust zipties to mount the lower part of the fan.

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a226/Crazychopstick/Volvo/DSC00332.jpg

A couple bucks at the Home Depot.

[Volvit]

I wouldn't trust zipties to mount the lower part of the fan.



Why's that? To much vibration?

[davashcow]

Lowe's sells mil-spec zipties that are rated to 175 pounds. I've seen some people on this board that would consider using these as motor mounts:wtf: Not to name names, but he lives a couple hundred miles from me:neener:

[Crazychopstick]

Why's that? To much vibration?

I dunno.

Call me crazy, but I'd take a few sheet metal screws over zipties anyday, the plastic can deteriorate eventually, and I never found a good place to slip them besides mounting them to the radiator.

A few peices of metal, a drill and 10mins is all it takes to secure your e-fan to the radiator support. That's almost as fast as changing ziptie motormounts!

[mullen1120]

for the temp sensor, whats the best way to mount that in the rad hose?

[Midgie245R]

for the temp sensor, whats the best way to mount that in the rad hose?
If you are talking about using a saab sensor, it screws into a t-piece that is inserted into the hose. eg:

http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q82/Midgie245R/volvo/efan.jpg

[totaled108]

I had been using the stock sensor IN the radiator with great results. I saw that a few people have used this rad hole method. So I gave it a shot, and it failed for me. The sensor in the rad has two settings. 95c, on, 85c off. The other one too high. Anyways, once it turned on the fan, the gauge was reading high. Then it wouldn't turn off, even when the gauge went below 9 o'clock. Hooked it back up to the 'A/C' switch in the rad, it switch on and off in traffic at the perfect times. That sesor is rated at 92c on and 82c off. Both times I tested them it was ~91F outside.

I think I am going to put the Saab T in the bottom rad hose as a coolant drain, so I don't have to remove the hose and make a mess. :)

[mullen1120]

the only temp sensor ive notice in my rad is on the top left, has two wires, but i thought from reading the other post that this is hooked up to the front ac fan and only turns on for extreme heat? is that what your talking about?

my fan is from a 940 i have the relay and everything and i modded my original shroud to fit the 940 fan looks real good and stock.

any ideas on what the best way to go about the temp sensor is? b/c im about to just wire it up to a switch on my dash lol

[totaled108]

the only temp sensor ive notice in my rad is on the top left, has two wires, but i thought from reading the other post that this is hooked up to the front ac fan and only turns on for extreme heat? is that what your talking about?

my fan is from a 940 i have the relay and everything and i modded my original shroud to fit the 940 fan looks real good and stock.

any ideas on what the best way to go about the temp sensor is? b/c im about to just wire it up to a switch on my dash lol



Hooked it back up to the 'A/C' switch in the rad, it switch on and off in traffic at the perfect times. That sensor is rated at 92c on and 82c off. Both times I tested them it was ~91F outside.

I think I am going to put the Saab T in the bottom rad hose as a coolant drain, so I don't have to remove the hose and make a mess. :)


Yes, its for the A/C fan, that doesn't exist in my car. I think some of the switches in the rad, for the A/C, are rated high. I got lucky enough to have a lower rated switch. Get one that are in the range of the one I have, and you'll have no problem.

Works great for me

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c2/Totaled108/P3210176.jpg

[mo5005]

Is it safe to wiring the relay straight to the positive terminal? Is anyone worried about draining the battery out besides me????

Lets just say its a 110* degree day, the fan could hypothetical run forever if you are using a 87/92 degree switch.....right???

[totaled108]

Is it safe to wiring the relay straight to the positive terminal? Is anyone worried about draining the battery out besides me????

Lets just say its a 110* degree day, the fan could hypothetical run forever if you are using a 87/92 degree switch.....right???

Thats in Celcius, not Fahrenheit. The switchs are rated in Celcius. Our bodies are 98.6F, or 37C. So 92C is 197.6F, and 82C is 179.6F. So when I say the switch turns on at 92C, the coolant is a hot 197.6 degrees Fahrenheit. Most automotive thermostats are 87-95 degrees Celcius. I think mine is 92C.

I wired mine through a relay straight to the battery. Also, there is a switch and LED, so I can control it manually if needed, and I know when it turns on by itself.

[mullen1120]

sweet, ill wire it up and see when it turns on, thanks guys

[mullen1120]

I did an electric fan swap from a 940 into my 1990 740 GLE 16V, using the big radiator, and the stock Volvo relay. This is a very easy swap. The relay has two wires coming out of the middle which are grounds used by the 940 ecu to turn the fan on, one at high speed and one at low speed. I hooked these wires to temp sensors, one in the radiator and one in the lower radiator hose, like a 240 turbo. The low speed wire is on the lower radiator hose. On each sensor, i took the other connector and sent it to ground. Main power wired to the battery+, Done! Now the fan turns on if either sensor reaches it's temp setting and completes the ground circuit.
Much quieter car now- and it runs cooler with the big radiator. Anybody with an engine driven fan should do this swap.

Also put a late 940 intercooler in at the same time. Wonder why?

what is better about the 940 intercooler?

[mullen1120]

okay all wired up, used the rad temp sensor and grounded it.
now the dash temp gauge never went past half but i used a laser temp reader gun (i use it for HVAC) to double check and the rad hoses never went past 210, but the red block was reading 225 when the fan came on.
what do you guys think, should i get another temp sensor?

[tjts1]

If you are talking about using a saab sensor, it screws into a t-piece that is inserted into the hose. eg:

http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q82/Midgie245R/volvo/efan.jpg

What temps the temp rating of your thermoswitch?

[marshcat]

Why is an E-fan so good? Does it really matter if it's powered by the engine or by the battery?

[totaled108]

Why is an E-fan so good? Does it really matter if it's powered by the engine or by the battery?

Honestly, after having if for a while, the only thing I am seeing it do is, quiet down the engine in stop and go traffic. I haven't seen a noticeable increase in fuel economy (1-2 mpg at the most) or power, though the throttle does feel alittle snappier. Also the engine bay is alittle more open and getting at the front of the engine is easier.

People have said that, the water pump bearings will last longer with out the mass spinning on it. I know a few of my blades had alittle plastic chewed of on the ends, so it may be be putting alittle stress on the bearings, because its not perfectly balanced. But I think that might be taking it a bit far.

If I ever need to go back do to a failed E-fan, I'll do it and stay stock, but for now itd nice to have the quieter engine bay.

that my $.02

:-P

[MikeSr.]

what is better about the 940 intercooler?
Oh, I put it in for +t conversion. Now I am gonna put an ebay cooler in. I have no turbo on this car, so as it comes together, I wanted an intercooler in place an the radiator change was a good time to do it.
Still no turbo, but coming soon.

[740ATL]

I know why! :)

[davidmacq]

Fan clutch sucks up your whorsepowers

[mo5005]

Should i be worried about my battery draining if i wired the E-fan straight to my battery?

[totaled108]

Should i be worried about my battery draining if i wired the E-fan straight to my battery?

No worries, just use the proper wiring, fuse and relay.

Eveyone seems to have there own way of mounting the thermoswitch though. When I used the Saab hose T, the fan stayed on for over a minute after the car was turned off. Mine is in the radiator and never stays on for more then 15 seconds after the car is shut down, even on HOT days. This is all worked out by the switches set temps. The one that came in the Saab T would have switched on at 115C (239F) and off at, i think 110C (230F). Thats far to hot.

[mo5005]

I keep blowing my 30A fuse?!?!!!! Why is this my wiring is correct and the fan works perfectly with the fuse running!

[mo5005]

My car keeps blowing the 30A fuse! (in line with the relay) Why is this!? Should i use a higher amp fuse? Or should i just not fuse it at all? HELP its SUMMER! if this **** blows during a hot day i'm gonna be screwed!

[tryingbe]

I keep blowing my 30A fuse?!?!!!! Why is this my wiring is correct and the fan works perfectly with the fuse running!

Use a Maxi 30 amp fuse. Regular 30 amp fuse can't handle the heat.

http://www.bcae1.com/images/jpegs/fusemaxi.jpg

[totaled108]

Go over the wring again, and make sure there are no bare wiring that can short out. I havn't had to diagnose blowing fuses with mine, so thats all I can think of.

[mo5005]

I used the MAXI fuse... thing still blows?! So wierd!?!! Any other suggestions?

[mo5005]

should i wire it between the positive terminal to the relay?

or

should i wire it between ground to the relay?

[totaled108]

should i wire it between the positive terminal to the relay?

or

should i wire it between ground to the relay?

Yes. Where is it placed now? I have a cheap $3 in-line fuse, placed between the + and relay, and have had no such issue.

[mo5005]

between the + and the relay. im starting to loose hope..... i think im just gonna wire it straight through (no relay)

[totaled108]

between the + and the relay. im starting to loose hope..... i think im just gonna wire it straight through (no relay)

Could you take a picture of all the wiring/connectors?* What fan are you using?

I don't understand how some of these settups work with out issue, and others, settup the same way, do.

If you don't use a relay, you will go through many switches by burning them out. Blowing fuses is a sign that somthing is not settup right. Or a wire is grounding when it shouldn't.

[Midgie245R]

What temps the temp rating of your thermoswitch?

It's 92C on, 87C off.

Get the thermoswitch from the saab's radiator - top left corner, looking from the engine, and install it in the tube.

[mullen1120]

is it that much better to have the temp sensor in the rad hose, cant you get a sensor to fit in the rad in place of the old one? just bc it would look cleaner

[totaled108]

is it that much better to have the temp sensor in the rad hose, cant you get a sensor to fit in the rad in place of the old one? just bc it would look cleaner

IMO, its not any better. Mine is in the rad and works great in 90f+ weather, driving it hard then, hitting down town in stop and go.

[Linas]

Does anyone have a wiring diagram for hooking up a later 960 fan with relay into an older 940?

[1stRaven]

If your blowing fuses (as I was) it might be because you are switching straight to high speed on a dual speed fan. When I fitted a 960 efan into my car (Which was not a drop in!), i blew three fuses straight off until I found out why. Rewired it to switch on the low speed and added another switch in to fire high speed. Haven't blow another fuse yet.

I will be attemping to control the efan via MS shortly so we'll have to see how that goes.

[84B23F]

Should i be worried about my battery draining if i wired the E-fan straight to my battery?

Mine is hooked directly to battery...I'm not worried:omg:

Unless your relay contacter got stuck closed, then you might worry....or if you have a weak battery, and fan runs a pinch after shutting off motor on a hot day, then you might worry.

On a 244, one might be able to use coil positive wire to snap close a relay to supply power to fan relay...but just another circuit to go kaput, down the road.

[Steven Zagony]

Try using a slo blo type fuse as opposed to the common fast acting type. Slo blo fuses have built in current limiting chokes or resistors that will absorb the current surge at the fan motor startup. They can be purchased from your local Radio Shack store.

[lummert]

I once owned an 82 VW Quantum that had a two speed Temp switch screwed into the radiator. it had three wire connections.

[lummert]

I did some reading about thermoswitch for cooling fan location. It goes in the right radiator end tank or the lower radiator hose.

Hope this clears up some of these cooling problems I have been reading on this forum.

[lummert]

I also remember that I installed a radiator and fan from an 85 Audi 4000S in that VW Quantum. The fan housing had two fans with a single speed motor on one fan blade with a drive belt connecting to the second fan blade. It didn't need two speeds because it had two fan blades.

[84B23F]

thermoswitch....Mine is in the radiator and never stays on for more then 15 seconds....

Yes....I have there one too....but I have no idea what application this came from....did yours come with vehicle????

I'm looking for model year(s) this radiator thermo-switch was in....can you get different temp set points for it?

[totaled108]

Yes....I have there one too....but I have no idea what application this came from....did yours come with vehicle????

I'm looking for model year(s) this radiator thermo-switch was in....can you get different temp set points for it?

The radiator was replced by the PO, and the only way to go was the 3 row rad. Which has the switch in it for the A/C pusher fan. I guess it has a cooler temp setting then most, which is actually good.

After all that, I have gone back to the stock clutch fan. I didn't really have any issues with the E-fan, I just like the fact that the clutch fan will ALWAYS be moving air over the motor. Also I installed a tranny cooler and want the air to be moving through it all the time. Also the temp gauge is FAR more steady with the stock settup. The noise of the clutch fan isn't as bad as I had thought it had been.

[84B23F]

gone back to the stock clutch fan. I didn't really have any issues with the E-fan, I just like the fact that the clutch fan will ALWAYS be moving air over the motor


My driving is about 98% truckin (rural roadways, highways), and 2% stop/go city traffic....which all means there is a constant air supply flowing past radiator...which means the temperature indicator is rock solid in the middle about 99.9% of the time.

If I had to deal with stop/go traffic, I would use clutch fan since E-Fan would be running most all of the time in warmer weather...in stop/go traffic.

[Freq]

I got an 850 fan and relays from a yard today ($10 :-D) and I'm having some trouble with how it should be wired. So far I've gotten the idea that it can't control the high and low speeds with one relay? Or do I need 2 thermo switches and 1 relay? I rarely go off the freeway so I'm not 100% worried about getting both setup, but I'd rather do it properly.

Edit: I don't use my AC, and I'm not sure if it even works, so I'm fine if I remove the AC pusher?

Edit 2: I can't upload pictures because I'm not home ATM, but the two relays I grabbed off the fan are...
One is 5 pronged (2, 2, 1), labeled 2 1 (out), 2 1 (in), 30.
The other is a 4 prong. There doesn't seem to be a diagram like the other one, but it's labed
3 545 803
($) 89 99 83
12V 40A 8 92
I'm assuming 8 92 would be the production date? These were both wired to the fan when I pulled it. I think I need to use the 5 prong?

[84B23F]

So far I've gotten the idea that it can't control the high and low speeds with one relay?


The Bosch Relay Unraveled (http://www.classictruckshop.com/clubs/earlyburbs/projects/bosch/relay.htm)


I could.....but I have no idea how Volvo wired up theres....I need a schematic to evaluate.

[OldSchoolEuro]

I dont know if I have this hooked up right or not but I have that 940 relay and I was told (since I have no AC) is to only use the high speed wire for the fan to turn on. But I did this and the fan won't turn on till the temp gauge nears the red! It does turn on if I only use the low speed tho. Thoughts?

[84B23F]

Thoughts?

Schematic????

Off hand, I'd say your temp sensor is off...but I need a schematic to understand circuit.

[OldSchoolEuro]

Here's exactly how mine is hooked up except that I do not have AC and I am having the high speed wire (yellow/brown) and ground hooked up to the temp sender.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v242/tjts2/c70c43d2.jpg

[OldSchoolEuro]

And I have a Nissens 3 Row Radiator with a push in thermostat. I have no idea what the temp rating is but I did order it from FCP. It is the only one they had.

[84B23F]

Nissens 3 Row Radiator with a push in thermostat


Just a quick overview...then I'll get to the meat to your situation...

Schematic shows the ECU controls the show....and it gets it sensor info (not shown) from some type of temp sensor.

Hence,

1. Does ECU get its info from

(a) block temp sensor,

(b) ECU temp sensor, or

(c) radiator temp sensor (like mine...1984 244 modified).

So....if one is using a different ECU than shown in the schematic....don't expect it to work right...ECU must have two fan leads to fire up that relay.

===================END===========

Nissens 3 Row Radiator with a push in thermostat

There are two type of temp sensors that could be used in radiator:

A. On-Off Switch

B. Analog resistance change with temperature.

In my 1984 244, I use an On-Off Radiator Temp Switch with a Bosch Relay.

I would disconnect wires to radiator temp sensor when engine cold, put an ohmmeter on those sensor's connectors (I assume)...start motor up, and watch ohmmeter....if resistance changes while motor gets warm, you need to find a different radiator temp sensor....on/off sensor.

On mine, to "fire up" the relay, I run ground circuit thru the radiator temp sensor...this way a larger current is not going thru radiator temp sensor...last longer...just enough current to make relay go.

[OldSchoolEuro]

Okay so I do need that ECU if I am going to use both wires. Well right now I have it hooked up as high speed wire and ground to that push in thermostat switch. Won't turn on till it gets 75 percent to the hot zone. I am going to probably run a switch inside my car to manually turn the fan on during traffic.

[84B23F]

push in thermostat switch.

Show me this device....FCP...where?

[84B23F]

Won't turn on till it gets 75 percent to the hot zone

I use an infrared temperature gun, like this (http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/31EK3R53MWL._SL500_AA280_.jpg), and shoot it at the thermostat housing, and top part of radiator near top hose...to verify.

My radiator temp sensor has a low set point, somewhere around 190 degrees, it switches "on." I wish set point was higher, since fan tends to cycle more in city traffic.

Unless you have verified your analog temp gauge inside of vehicle, I would assume nothing.

On GM vehicles, I don't think the fan comes on until like 225 degrees F, or so....its too high for my needs....this would pressurize your radiator system at that temp....and I don't like the thought of a freeze plug being persuaded to pop out...

I have no idea what Volvo specs are....was theirs setup to turn fan on at higher temps, like GM?

[Freq]

The kit I bought (temp sensor + wiring kit) turns on at 165F, which is roughly 2/3 on the temp. gauge. The fan usually turns on after I turn the car off, too. Once the fan kicks on doing about 65mph the gauge drops to 1/4.

[OldSchoolEuro]

Show me this device....FCP...where?

Here.

http://www.fcpgroton.com/product-exec/product_id/7783/nm/1985_1991_Volvo_740_Turbo_Radiator_Fan_Switch/category_id/195

[84B23F]

(temp sensor + wiring kit) turns on at 165F, which is roughly 2/3 on the temp. gauge

Seems quite low....unless you are running 160F thermostat....stock is around 197F...for a 1984 244...2.3 L...check specs in back of owner's manual.....that's about mid-way on temp gauge.

Fuel economy wise, and emission wise, I would suspect not being upto temperature would affect these two.

[84B23F]

Here.

http://www.fcpgroton.com/product-exec/product_id/7783/nm/1985_1991_Volvo_740_Turbo_Radiator_Fan_Switch/category_id/195

It says "Fan Switch," which should denote On/OFF at some temperature....but what temperature is the question.

Without infrared temperature gun, one would not know....I assume your thermostat is good, and not stuck in some position.

[OldSchoolEuro]

My thermostat is brand new. Yeah I have no idea what temp rating it is. I am thinking of wiring up a switch inside the car to turn on the fan just in case it doesnt. How would one go on and do that with my setup?

[84B23F]

How would one go on and do that with my setup?

Assuming the fan is a two speed motor, which it appears to be the case.

Circuit #22 - When engaged (ECU grounded), this engages fan, but prevents circuit #7 from engaging even if Circuit #7's is grounded at ECU.

Circuit #7 - When engaged (ECU grounded), the other Ciruit #22 will have an open at ECU, which feeds the hot juice to Circuit #7's relay.

In essence, only one side works at a time via ECU grounding....so, if your radiator's temp sensor is using the grounding principle on this relay, you can only do one relay (fan speed) at a time. Throwing two grounds at it, would only invoke Circuit #22.

So, your ground switch in interior needs to attach to Circuit # 22, and your radiator's temp sensor should be working on a grounding basis, and would hook to Circuit #7....

Are you using ground to activate relay...and running a hot link as shown in picture?

You can test this out, before you install your switch...simple grounds from battery...two of them, and touch circuit #7 first, then circuit #22. Circuit #22 over-rides circuit #7, as I read the schematic.

PS: This setup allows for high speed fan setup when you flip the switch....reverse wires for low speed fan when you switch it manually...your choice.

[OldSchoolEuro]

Yeah well there are three wires coming from the fan motor itself. (yeah its a 940 fan). Green, Red and Black wires. Green and Red wires go to the relay mentioned above. Black goes to a ground. Then there is the red wire that comes from the relay and goes to the battery with a inline use. Then there are two smaller wires that come from the relay. Yellow/Brown and Green/Orange. I took the green/orange wire out and just had the yellow/brown wire connected to the fan switch in the radiator. The other spade terminal on the fan switch is grounded. Thats how my setup is. I do NOT have the ECU that controls the e fan btw.

So I can only turn on the fan via the switch inside the car only on one speed?

[84B23F]

Yellow/Brown and Green/Orange. I took the green/orange wire out and just had the yellow/brown wire connected to the fan switch in the radiator. The other spade terminal on the fan switch is grounded. ....So I can only turn on the fan via the switch inside the car only on one speed?

It could be turned on on either speed, inside of vehicle, with a three-way switch, rocker type switch (On_1, Off, On_2)....Circuit #22 over-rides circuit #7, so when Circuit #22 is engaged, it should be the AC circuit, high fan speed.

The grounding on other spade terminal (Circuit #7) is a waste...fan should be running via C1-GRN wire...or internal relay has shot craps.

[OldSchoolEuro]

Oh yeah I forgot to mention I dont have AC in my 240. That's why theres a ground.

[84B23F]

Oh yeah I forgot to mention I dont have AC in my 240. That's why theres a ground.

That's why its backwards......its not needed...

Experiment:

1. Disconnect Spade Terminals at Relay Box (#22 & #7)

2. Get a grounded wire and touch each...what happens?

3. Get two grounded wires, and touch both...what happens?

Those terminals are normally activated via Ground Circuit via ECU...not needed now, if your Temp Sensor is grounded when switched on.

[OldSchoolEuro]

Okay so I dont even need that ground wire. Does the ignition need to be turned on when I do these experiments?

[84B23F]

Does the ignition need to be turned on when I do these experiments?

As based upon that schematic picture above, the Relay is wired Hot all the time....is this correct for your setup? Or did you put the Hot lead on a switched hot?

Disconnect wires 7 & 22.......at Relay....then ground a wire to battery ground (or frame), and touch the other end of this ground wire to Relay terminal 7 first, and then to relay terminal 22; the fan should run each time...with terminal 22 putting fan in high speed....is this the way it works on your setup now when this test is performed?

[OldSchoolEuro]

Yeah the relay has a red wire running straight into a inline fuse (40amp) to the battery so yeah it is wired hot all the time. So just ground each connection (7 and 22) and the fan should run each time i ground them?

[shellshock]

Interesting topic

Now for my question. Since I will be using the turbo computers from my 1995 940t in my 1992 240, could I just rip the wires that run from the ECU to Efan relay from the 940? I could then just run those same wires on my 240 and plug one end up to the appropriate pin on the ecu and the other end on the relay. Pretty much the exact same setup as stock on my 940...

Eh?

[84B23F]

just ground each connection (7 and 22 at Relay) and the fan should run each time i ground them?

Correct....with the wiring harness removed (Yellow/Brown and Green/Orange wires at Relay), ground out each terminal separately with a ground lead....the fan should work each time the spade-terminals are grounded.

[OldSchoolEuro]

Okay I just tested it and yes it does turn on when ground each circuit.

[84B23F]

Since I will be using the turbo computers from my 1995 940t in my 1992 240, could I just rip the wires that run from the ECU to Efan relay from the 940?


I would assume you will be taking wiring harness out of 1995 anyway...correct.....if true, yes, you can use those wires from 1995 ECU....will need to convert to E-Fan, of course.


I would leave wiring harness intact when it is removed....your word "rip the wires" I don't understand.

[OldSchoolEuro]

Okay I tested the two circuits and they turn on what does this mean loll.

[84B23F]

Okay I tested the two circuits and they turn on

Turned On Fan:

1. Low Speed: Circuit #7

2. High Speed: Circuit #22

Correct?????

[OldSchoolEuro]

Yes

[84B23F]

Yes

1. Low Speed: Circuit #7

2. High Speed: Circuit #22

Well....Logic might suggest to hook a ground circuit to Radiator's Temp Sensor and hook other side of it to #7 relay spade; and inside of vehicle use a grounded switch for Circuit #22's spade terminal on relay.

Since your vehicle does not have an AC....then low speed circuit should handle radiator OK...but you can hook it up any way you choose. Where you live, it should only be the hot days when you need high speed fan if your cooling system is fit for duty.

Does your radiator-temp-sensor sense actual anti-freeze liquid, or just radiator's metal?

Maybe you could ask FCP directly what temperature does this temp sensor switch to on, and if they have a lower switching temperature.

[OldSchoolEuro]

Okay so just have two wires coming from the temp switch (ground and low speed) and then wire the high speed wire to a switch inside the car? and the radiator temp sensor is actually sensing the coolant liquid itself NOT the metal.

[84B23F]

temp switch (ground in to it and wire out to low fan-speed terminal on relay terminal #7 spade)...wire relay's high-fan-speed-terminal (#22) to a grounded On/Off switch inside the car

Why yes...

[shellshock]

I would assume you will be taking wiring harness out of 1995 anyway...correct.....if true, yes, you can use those wires from 1995 ECU....will need to convert to E-Fan, of course.


I would leave wiring harness intact when it is removed....your word "rip the wires" I don't understand.


I'm not using any of the 940s harness. No reason too. the 240 is LH 2.4 like the 1995. I will be using the 1995s computers though. So all i would need would be the wiring from the ecu to the fan relay out of my 1995s harness.


Sorry I cant explain my idea too well :oops:

[84B23F]

I'm not using any of the 940s harness. No reason too. the 240 is LH 2.4 like the 1995. I will be using the 1995s computers though. So all i would need would be the wiring from the ecu to the fan relay out of my 1995s harness.

I can't make a comment here....usually in automotive world, when several years pass by...you can't plug a later ECU into earlier ECU's wiring harness....if both are exactly the same, LH 2.4, then it should have wiring there on 240.

I would do a setup like OldSchoolEuro...and not mess with ECU....Based upon my LH 2.0, it would be a pain to add wires to it.

I have no idea why the AC kicks in the fan....is this done for AC's high pressure switch (high head pressure)? If so, and if you have AC, there is a way to kick in high speed fan with another relay.

[OldSchoolEuro]

Awesome. Wired up a switch to the high speed wire and it works beautifully. I needed to fill up some switch spaces in my center control panel.

[84B23F]

I needed to fill up some switch spaces in my center control panel.

Here's one more: Vehicle Coolant Level Sensor (http://www.forums.turbobricks.com/showthread.php?t=143510)

Good to hear....

[OldSchoolEuro]

I think I am going to need a new e fan because when the fan is about to turn off it squeaks but when its running its fine.

[84B23F]

I think I am going to need a new e fan because when the fan is about to turn off it squeaks but when its running its fine.

My e-fan sat around, then when it got used again, it too would squeak when first powered up, then it got better, now I don't hear anything when it turns on.

Manually spin the blade....and manually see if you can feel free play in fan's bushing/bearing

[WindowsBreakerG4]

OK so I see that some people put the saab sensor in the upper hose and some people put it in the lower. Which way does coolant flow through this engine and what are the pros and cons to each way? I have mine in the lower hose now but it leaks and wants to rub on the ac line so that's a def con.

[Mr.Borrie]

Yeah i still have not figured out what sensors where i will use

[wooble]

For an ECU controlled fan, which LH2.4 ecus have fan control? I have a 954 ECU from a 940 turbo I plan on using when I convert my 240 to LH2.4, the 940 I got it from didn't have an electric fan, but will the ECU be able to control an electric fan setup from a later 940?

[Texas240]

For an ECU controlled fan, which LH2.4 ecus have fan control? I have a 954 ECU from a 940 turbo I plan on using when I convert my 240 to LH2.4, the 940 I got it from didn't have an electric fan, but will the ECU be able to control an electric fan setup from a later 940?

all 9xx ecu's have the fan controller

[tjts1]

OK so I see that some people put the saab sensor in the upper hose and some people put it in the lower. Which way does coolant flow through this engine and what are the pros and cons to each way? I have mine in the lower hose now but it leaks and wants to rub on the ac line so that's a def con.
Coolant flows from the engine to the radiator through the upper hose. Lower hose with an 91/87C temp switch works best. You'll need a much higher temp switch in the upper hose otherwise the fan will be running all the time and it will be slower to react.

[WindowsBreakerG4]

Cool that's what i wanted to know. Now I just need to fix my leaky POS saab switch. Guess that's what i get for using a saab switch :-P

[swedishiron.com]

Where does the Saab switch leak from? If it's from where the sensor screws into the T-fitting, you may need a new gasket/O-ring there to prevent leakage.

[WindowsBreakerG4]

Yea I think it's the o ring. I am going to deal with it some day soon, probably put a new switch in too for good measure.

[tjts1]

If you're still using the switch that came out of the saab, i think those are 110/115C. way hot.

[WindowsBreakerG4]

One I have is like 82/87 i think, what should I use a source for a switch?

[WindowsBreakerG4]

As a heads up, I found out this weekend a 940 efan doesn't fit with a 3 core nissens, it might barely clear if you cock the shroud to the side by leaving the passengers side bottom mount out but that doesn't seem like a good idea (I bolted it into the mech fan shroud, the normal one won't fit either cause it hits on the water pump).

I ordered a single speed fan (16") spal knock off for $50 on eBay that flows 2500 cfm (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Champion-Cooling-2500cfm-Spal-Quality-16-Inch-Fan_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem1c1184bc7fQQitemZ12 0552995967QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAcce ssories#ht_5527wt_1147) From these guys http://championcooling.com/. I am going to mount it in the stock shroud. Anyone see an issue with running a single speed fan? Should I change my saab sender temp or move the sender? Or both?

[MrBill]

You shouldn't use the original shroud.

Use the entire shroud that came with the efan and cut it down using a chopsaw.

or if you have $ pull the 940 radiator, intercooler, and piping and get yourself a nice little upgrade

[WindowsBreakerG4]

Even if I cut it it wouldn't fit, that wouldn't gain me anything sadly. I thought about going that route at one point but I like my oil cooler and want to add in my npr but some day i might still do that. Got my 16" could probably do a bit bigger but w/e, just need to figure out how to mount it in the stock shroud.

[Mr.Borrie]

you will need a Volvo 360 waterpump and pully.

[Mr.Borrie]

http://img513.imageshack.us/img513/1088/img0747o.jpg

[WindowsBreakerG4]

I thought about going that route, I might still, The fake spal i bought should clear fine. It's freaking thin!

[Mylesofsmyles]

I'll admit, custom electrical isn't my forte, though I've been really, really jazzed about putting an electric fan in my '79 242. I grabbed an e-fan out of an 850 yesterday, and grabbed a couple of the wires and relays that were in the holder just above it, though I don't think I got everything I need...

http://lh5.ggpht.com/__p8_bHFZ0vQ/S_eBLyHCWCI/AAAAAAAAGOA/aDkqp7SoXZ0/s800/DSCF2868.JPG
http://lh4.ggpht.com/__p8_bHFZ0vQ/S_eBMujaZEI/AAAAAAAAGOI/KszhwpX2SsY/s800/DSCF2870.JPG
http://lh4.ggpht.com/__p8_bHFZ0vQ/S_eBNXITKTI/AAAAAAAAGOM/LHWrjZ_ACzI/s800/DSCF2871.JPG
http://lh5.ggpht.com/__p8_bHFZ0vQ/S_eBNhu_CNI/AAAAAAAAGOQ/V9DcQ056jNo/s800/DSCF2872.JPG
http://lh6.ggpht.com/__p8_bHFZ0vQ/S_eBOH5a-QI/AAAAAAAAGOU/RGxAjrzqSfQ/s800/DSCF2873.JPG
http://lh3.ggpht.com/__p8_bHFZ0vQ/S_eBOiyRPMI/AAAAAAAAGOY/BQ8nX94RaiU/s800/DSCF2874.JPG

I seem to think that separate harness has nothing to do with the e-fan. I need what plugs to the connector on the fan, right? Installation makes sense, drill a couple holes for four screws to hold it into place. As for wiring, I'm still a little lost...one lead to the battery with a 30 amp fuse, but then there's two other wires on the fan...what do I do with those? Am I missing a connector, wires and a relay still? The temp sensor that came in my '79's radiator will or will not be sufficient? Will a temp sensor from a 740 16v be any better?

[Texas240]

the green wire coming from the fan is the low speed. red is high speed.

[Mylesofsmyles]

will this relay work...
http://lh4.ggpht.com/__p8_bHFZ0vQ/S_eBMujaZEI/AAAAAAAAGOI/KszhwpX2SsY/s800/DSCF2870.JPG

[Texas240]

will this relay work...
http://lh4.ggpht.com/__p8_bHFZ0vQ/S_eBMujaZEI/AAAAAAAAGOI/KszhwpX2SsY/s800/DSCF2870.JPG

beats me, I dont know the know the 850 electric system other then the efan is the same

[Mylesofsmyles]

looks like i forgot to snag the relay i needed, so back to the bone yard. I'm hoping to have this done by tuesday night. oh. and what rating am i looking for on the temp sensors?

[WindowsBreakerG4]

If you're using a saab one, buy a new one. They seem to like to go bad

[Mylesofsmyles]

i'm pretty well there, just a wire or two crossed.

got the fan installed, with the 850 relay, fusible link from starter and used a 740 compression-fit radiator fan switch. The fan won't go on and lets the temp run up way too high...north of 9 o'clock, which it's never done before. Lan told me something about grounding one of the temp wires and triggering only the high or low speed. it seems silly, considering i have a dual speed fan, to not utilize that...maybe it's overkill though.

i wired the two skinny yellow wires off the relay to the the two prongs on the fan switch, so what do I do with the two yellow leads and what do I do with the two prongs on the fan switch.

Also, there's rumor that my 740 fan switch will turn on too hot...what's the magic number for keeping my water cool?

either way, I need to get one of those two speeds working ASAP, as in now!

wired the way i have it now, red wire on the positive, black grounded, will the fan work regardless of ignition position? could I route the positive to the starter as on the 850.

[WindowsBreakerG4]

The switch in the top of the Rad tends to let temps get way too hot, use a saab switch in the bottom hose, Think I used an 87on/82off and honestly I think I could go a tad warmer. I'd just hook that to the high speed and call it a day.

[miguel.760ti]

Looking to do this swap on my 760, I have a 960 fan with the relay.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v242/tjts2/c70c43d2.jpg

I want to wire the fan using the saab temp switch for low speed but I don't want to wire it to constant 12v, I want to do it to switched 12v. How would i go about doin that?

Also, on the saab temp senders there's 2 prongs, one is for the signal wire coming out of the volvo relay and the other one is for ground, right?

[Mylesofsmyles]

The switch in the top of the Rad tends to let temps get way too hot, use a saab switch in the bottom hose, Think I used an 87on/82off and honestly I think I could go a tad warmer. I'd just hook that to the high speed and call it a day.

as in, the fan come on too soon?

[WindowsBreakerG4]

Looking to do this swap on my 760, I have a 960 fan with the relay.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v242/tjts2/c70c43d2.jpg

I want to wire the fan using the saab temp switch for low speed but I don't want to wire it to constant 12v, I want to do it to switched 12v. How would i go about doin that?

Also, on the saab temp senders there's 2 prongs, one is for the signal wire coming out of the volvo relay and the other one is for ground, right?
Why would you want it to be switched? It's nice having it be able to run after you shut the car off imho. You Could use a relay on the signal wire inbetween the switch and the ground that would close when ever they car is turned on but again I ask why? My fan runs maybe 15-20 seconds max when I shut my car off
as in, the fan come on too soon?
No it's not coming on soon enough. Also the rating of that switch is really really warm, it's supposed to be the OH****WE'REOVERHEATING OMGWTFBBQ!!!1ONE1!!!11! switch. I think the position can cause it to come on too soon as well.

[Mylesofsmyles]

No it's not coming on soon enough. Also the rating of that switch is really really warm, it's supposed to be the OH****WE'REOVERHEATING OMGWTFBBQ!!!1ONE1!!!11! switch. I think the position can cause it to come on too soon as well.

haha, this one goes to 11. gotcha...gonna inquire about lower temp switches. yeah, maybe just wire it into the high speed and call it a day.

[WindowsBreakerG4]

I would, no idea if you can put something lower temp in that top spot but i don't like that top spot regardless, if you get a tad low on coolant you might not have that sensor in coolant still, giving you false readings.

[miguel.760ti]

Why would you want it to be switched? It's nice having it be able to run after you shut the car off imho. You Could use a relay on the signal wire inbetween the switch and the ground that would close when ever they car is turned on but again I ask why? My fan runs maybe 15-20 seconds max when I shut my car off

I don't want the damn thing draining my battery, but if it's only going to run for a short while after I shut the car off I'll just leave it alone

[Mylesofsmyles]

got it working, sorta!

i tried running a ground to the temp sensor/relay...the only bummer is that i gotta manually connect the wire under the hood when I start it up and take it off.

no less, I have an e-fan on my 242! so much quieter!

[WindowsBreakerG4]

got it working, sorta!

i tried running a ground to the temp sensor/relay...the only bummer is that i gotta manually connect the wire under the hood when I start it up and take it off.

no less, I have an e-fan on my 242! so much quieter!
Like I said, saab switch ;)

I don't want the damn thing draining my battery, but if it's only going to run for a short while after I shut the car off I'll just leave it alone
It's not going to kill your battery

[Mylesofsmyles]

spoke to the folks at Groton. they are familiar with the e-fan conversion.

the tech rep I spoke with suggested I use fan switch #1274962; it'll fit the radiator like stock and should start the fan in time...

http://auto-parts.fcpgroton.com/search/index?query=1274962

[Mylesofsmyles]

I've just gotta better understand my wiring. from the relay, there's a single power wire...I have it on the "+" side of the batter, but am wondering if I put it on the starter, will it only work with the ignition on?

the harness that goes from the fan, just plugs into the relay, so there isn't really any question there.

there are two leads small yellow leads off the relay, labeled output. I have one directly connected to a single prong on the fan switch, the other one is connected to the other prong on the fan switch, but I spliced it so I can run a lead to the ground.

the ground coming directly off the fan is grounded as well.

This setup means I have to manually connect and disconnect my ground. sorry, wiring isn't my thing, and I still don't know what I'm doing wrong.

I want it such that the fan will turn on and off on it's own, preferably only on the high setting.

I'm starting to think that the two wires off the output of the relay are for two separate switches, one to trigger high and one to trigger low...no? so unless I install another fan switch, I'll only have one speed...sorry if this has all been said in the 8 pages before me, but I'm just not getting the big picture.

[bcumby]

960/940/850 all had the same 2 speed electric fan.

15 months after installing the 940 fan in the 240, it finally blew the 30a fuse this past weekend. I caught it in traffic as the temp gauge (compensation board removed) spike past the half way point but long before the red. I replaced the fuse (always carry spare fuses in the glove box) and I was back in business in 3 minutes.
This is the wiring diagram for the Volvo fan and relay.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v242/tjts2/c70c43d2.jpg

If you hook up the thin wire labeled in the above diagram as B2 (Yel/Brn) to Ground, you'll get high speed only.

[WindowsBreakerG4]

spoke to the folks at Groton. they are familiar with the e-fan conversion.

the tech rep I spoke with suggested I use fan switch #1274962; it'll fit the radiator like stock and should start the fan in time...

http://auto-parts.fcpgroton.com/search/index?query=1274962

http://forums.turbobricks.com/showthread.php?t=160300 saab sender :P much better location because it checks the temp of water coming out of the rad.

[Mylesofsmyles]

http://forums.turbobricks.com/showthread.php?t=160300 saab sender :P much better location because it checks the temp of water coming out of the rad.

wouldn't it be ideal to check temp of the hot water, not cool water? the water coming out of the radiator should be cooler than the engine, right? it's going into the engine to help cool it...wouldn't the water coming in be a better representation of engine temp? then again, I guess if the water you're feeding your engine is too hot, it'd be a good opportunity to turn up the fan.

[mickeys240]

Well Your engine is going to spew out hot water out of the thermostat (assuming you have one) at its rated temp that your thermostat opens (again assuming that you have a thermostat that opens at a certain temp say 190') If your thermostat switch is placed before it goes to the radiator, hot water would continue to come out of the engine thermostat via the vent orifice causing the sender/switch to trigger the fan for a period of possibly 30 min or longer and cause a flat battery. (the fan can cause a drain of 15-25 amps. while in operation)

After the radiator is the best place for a fan switch.

After the engine is the best place for a Temp Gauge.

[iron_mighty07]

I'm looking at doing the E-fan conversion - just curious which model Saabs surrender the sender unit & carrier.Sadly walk-in scrap yards are becoming a rare commodity and the one nearest me doesn't have much in the way of Saabs so if I can ring around with a vague inkling which to look for it'll be a time saver, many thanks,

[WindowsBreakerG4]

Well Your engine is going to spew out hot water out of the thermostat (assuming you have one) at its rated temp that your thermostat opens (again assuming that you have a thermostat that opens at a certain temp say 190') If your thermostat switch is placed before it goes to the radiator, hot water would continue to come out of the engine thermostat via the vent orifice causing the sender/switch to trigger the fan.

After the radiator is the best place for a fan switch.

This. Basically in the top of the rad makes it run more then is needed.

I'm looking at doing the E-fan conversion - just curious which model Saabs surrender the sender unit & carrier.Sadly walk-in scrap yards are becoming a rare commodity and the one nearest me doesn't have much in the way of Saabs so if I can ring around with a vague inkling which to look for it'll be a time saver, many thanks,
Think it's a mid 80s 900 series.

[badvlvo]

Just installed a 900 e-fan. The switching is wired from a key-on fuse (3?) to a switch in the radiator's factory location to a 30 amp relay. Works perfect.

The next task will be wiring it as a true 2-speed. Not that I need it, if the fan is run without the switch as a key-on only, the car won't fully warm up.

[WindowsBreakerG4]

Odd, it should still warm up fine as the temp switch should control the fan operation and that should matter little based on if it's wired as hot all the time or not.

[Big Lan]

Yeah, I run the e-fan in my 245 on low with a switched ignition trigger, and I have no problems with warmup.

[bcumby]

Yeah, I run the e-fan in my 245 on low with a switched ignition trigger, and I have no problems with warmup.

Cool, I am glad to hear you don't have warm-up problems - I am going to hook it up as a 2-speed with low as ignition and high as temp switched, along with a pusher fan for AC use in traffic.

Then, for the winter I'll think about putting in a switch to kill the low-speed fan in case I need it for warm-up.

[thebornotaku]

I will hopefully be doing this tomorrow -- I've got that Jegs e-fan I got from Steve and I need to swap out my radiator, I figure why not?

Any problems with wiring it to run at key position II (run), rather than on a temperature sensor? I was thinking of wiring it to a switch on the dash but knowing my luck, my mom would forget to turn the fan on :rofl:

Also, any suggestions for relays or sensors to grab while I'm there? I want to minimize stops if I can and I figure there'll be tons of relays I could possibly use -- any specific ones you guys know of?

[Mylesofsmyles]

I will hopefully be doing this tomorrow -- I've got that Jegs e-fan I got from Steve and I need to swap out my radiator, I figure why not?

Any problems with wiring it to run at key position II (run), rather than on a temperature sensor? I was thinking of wiring it to a switch on the dash but knowing my luck, my mom would forget to turn the fan on :rofl:

Also, any suggestions for relays or sensors to grab while I'm there? I want to minimize stops if I can and I figure there'll be tons of relays I could possibly use -- any specific ones you guys know of?

the fan relay from an 850 worked like gold for me...i can choose between high speed and low speed, depending on which of the two leads off the relay I use...most convenient and $free.99 at the jy along with associated wiring. I dunno how this will do with your Jegs Fan; I used the 850 fan set to low. It comes on right at 9-o'clock, but I want to switch to a high temp thermostat and then get a Saab lower radiator fan switch. If I were really cool, I'd leave the fan switch in the radiator and use that as my high speed switch...maybe, dunno what I'm really talking about. :-P

Good luck, it's a nice lil upgrage!

Oh, how u gonna wire it to the ignition? I wanna do this, cuz now the fan will do it's own thing regardless of the ignition position.

[thebornotaku]

Picked up a saab temperature sender, as well as something like 5or 6 12v 40a relays from 940s. I wanna know how to wire up the saab thing -- does it just work on resistance or something?

edit\\

more importantly, how can I tell what temperature the sensor kicks on/off at? I can get pictures of it. junkyard part.


edit\\ nevermind

actually read the sensor, it's a 110/115. guess i'm just wiring the fan to ignition on until I can get a sensor for it.

[Mylesofsmyles]

Picked up a saab temperature sender, as well as something like 5or 6 12v 40a relays from 940s. I wanna know how to wire up the saab thing -- does it just work on resistance or something?

edit\\

more importantly, how can I tell what temperature the sensor kicks on/off at? I can get pictures of it. junkyard part.


edit\\ nevermind

actually read the sensor, it's a 110/115. guess i'm just wiring the fan to ignition on until I can get a sensor for it.

u got the 940 fan relay?

i don't think wiring the saab switch should be any different from wiring the volvo radiator fan switch. one lead from the relay to the switch, then ground the other prong on the switch.

[thebornotaku]

I don't know if it's a 940 fan relay, i can always look up the part numbers tomorrow. I have five of the damned things...

yeah, i figured that the saab switch is non-polar considering the fact that it's not marked as such, so it can be wired either way.

[miguel.760ti]

Picked up a saab temperature sender, as well as something like 5or 6 12v 40a relays from 940s. I wanna know how to wire up the saab thing -- does it just work on resistance or something?

edit\\

more importantly, how can I tell what temperature the sensor kicks on/off at? I can get pictures of it. junkyard part.


edit\\ nevermind

actually read the sensor, it's a 110/115. guess i'm just wiring the fan to ignition on until I can get a sensor for it.

Use the sensor from the radiator, not the T fitting going to the thermostart

[thebornotaku]

Use the sensor from the radiator, not the T fitting going to the thermostart

my radiator doesn't have a port for a thermal switch.

[WindowsBreakerG4]

my radiator doesn't have a port for a thermal switch.

Use a Saab thingy. Works well. Reasons I can see for not wanting it to run anytime the car is running is 1 noise, 2 Life of the fan, 3 draw on alt (which is probably 70 amp in your car), 4 might keep the car from warming up as quickly

[thebornotaku]

Use a Saab thingy. Works well. Reasons I can see for not wanting it to run anytime the car is running is 1 noise, 2 Life of the fan, 3 draw on alt (which is probably 70 amp in your car), 4 might keep the car from warming up as quickly

I was going to run a saab dealio.

Noise I'm not so worried about, and I'm not planning on running it like this for long. I just need to get my old rad out (well, it's out now actually) and I figured while it's apart, I could install the fan.

I also don't mind it taking a bit longer to warm up, as it's gonna be summer soon and I intend to have it wired properly within the next month or two.

any suggestions as to where I can get a saab sensor with a reasonable temperature range, like 95-90 or something instead of the 115-110 one I have?

[WindowsBreakerG4]

I was going to run a saab dealio.

Noise I'm not so worried about, and I'm not planning on running it like this for long. I just need to get my old rad out (well, it's out now actually) and I figured while it's apart, I could install the fan.

I also don't mind it taking a bit longer to warm up, as it's gonna be summer soon and I intend to have it wired properly within the next month or two.

any suggestions as to where I can get a saab sensor with a reasonable temperature range, like 95-90 or something instead of the 115-110 one I have?

Amazon has them, I posted a link for one but i think you could go up to the next step in temp

[thebornotaku]

Amazon has them, I posted a link for one but i think you could go up to the next step in temp

I did an amazon search and nothing turned up.

Swedishiron has some for sale in his FS thread, maybe I'll see about getting some monies so I can pick one up.

Figure I should run a 92-87?

[mickeys240]

Well Your engine is going to spew out hot water out of the thermostat (assuming you have one) at its rated temp that your thermostat opens (again assuming that you have a thermostat that opens at a certain temp say 190') If your thermostat switch is placed before it goes to the radiator, hot water would continue to come out of the engine thermostat via the vent orifice causing the sender/switch to trigger the fan for a period of possibly 30 min or longer and cause a flat battery. (the fan can cause a drain of 15-25 amps. while in operation)

After the radiator is the best place for a fan switch.

After the engine is the best place for a Temp Gauge.


I also wanted to add that if you get low on coolant, You could face a thermal runaway if water is not transferring enough heat to activate the sensor. Especially of your sensor is mounted on top and then the only medium of heat transfer to activate the switch would be steam. (or air at that point.)

Summery, and words of wisdom. Place it on the bottom of the radiator, with the switch being placed upside down ONLY IF YOU HAVE CLEARANCE TO DO SO.

Otherwise place the sensor according to the manufactures instructions. Oddly, I have came across a few that say that they work best being placed on top. Weird if you know how these devices work. Orientation IMO should not effect function.

[WindowsBreakerG4]

Rock auto
BECK/ARNLEY Part # 2010809 More Info
2 Prong Switch 92 Degrees, Standard Climates

92/87 switch (http://www.amazon.com/Beck-Arnley-201-0809-Thermo-Switch/dp/B000CB0D6S/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=automotive&qid=1275424040&sr=8-1) (might do this, few $ cheaper on rock auto but i have amazon prime so I'd get it there)

Rock auto says
BECK/ARNLEY Part # 2011545
2 Prong Switch 82 Degrees, Warmer Climates

82/77 switch (http://www.amazon.com/Beck-Arnley-201-1545-Thermo-Switch/dp/B000CB3EEG/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=automotive&qid=1275424247&sr=8-1) (again a bit cheaper on rock auto ymmv)

Honestly picking between the 2 I am not 100% sure which you should get, I have the 82/77 and I think I might try a 92/87 just to see if it makes the fan run less (though that might not be ideal for obvious reasons)

[bigbret]

Just got my E-fan hooked up. I have a 960 dual speed fan wired up to constant 12v from the coil. It runs low speed only. I noticed that my rad has a fitting for a temp sensor in it. I will plan on using the 960 2 speed relay I grabbed from the jy. Right now just running a 940 12v 40A relay. I need to figure out what sensor will fit the port.

[Mylesofsmyles]

my 242 has had it's e-fan for the past week...grantid, I haven't driven the car in that time due to some u-joint failure. with it in the shoppe, i've tested the radiator mount fan switch by running the car at idle...when it's warmed up i watch the gauge to see when the fan comes on. before the conversion, my car was a good hour and a half below 9-o'clock. now it gets much, much closer to 9-o'clock, with the fan coming on just north of that.

after reading the posts in this thread, i was worried that the fan would come on much, much too soon. that the hot water from my thermostat would shoot out onto the fan switch and force it on all the time. seems to be working just right...maybe it'll be different in the real world. also now seeing how a fan switch indicator light on the dash would be useful. my dad's '84 ferrari 308 had a fan light, and i think it's been the only car I've seen with one...now i get it. :D

[badvlvo]

Odd, it should still warm up fine as the temp switch should control the fan operation and that should matter little based on if it's wired as hot all the time or not.

It won't get over about 165. I have really good coolant flow, 3 row, no heater core (direct coolant between 3 and 4 at the head) and no intercooler or condenser in the way. But you must have missed where I don't have a temp switch, it's key-on.

my radiator doesn't have a port for a thermal switch.

Use the Saab method, it works.

Use a Saab thingy. Works well. Reasons I can see for not wanting it to run anytime the car is running is 1 noise, 2 Life of the fan, 3 draw on alt (which is probably 70 amp in your car), 4 might keep the car from warming up as quicklyThis. I will be switching mine soon enough, I don't like it running all the time.

I also wanted to add that if you get low on coolant, You could face a thermal runaway if water is not transferring enough heat to activate the sensor. Especially of your sensor is mounted on top and then the only medium of heat transfer to activate the switch would be steam. (or air at that point.)

Summery, and words of wisdom. Place it on the bottom of the radiator, with the switch being placed upside down ONLY IF YOU HAVE CLEARANCE TO DO SO.

Otherwise place the sensor according to the manufactures instructions. Oddly, I have came across a few that say that they work best being placed on top. Weird if you know how these devices work. Orientation IMO should not effect function.

Why mount it upside down? There is no real reason for that.

Mounting in the top of the radiator has the best control for even coolant temps in the system. If the coolant is low then you need to fix your leak! Don't band-aid the car for a problem, fix it properly.





I have a 92 degree switch going in a Saab adaptor and an 82 degree switch going in the radiator. The redundant system will protect if a switch fails or a motor speed fails (happened on my Knoxville trip).

It will be wired in a fairly safe fashion- a 30 amp relay controls the main power to the Volvo 2 speed relay, key-on. The power will run from that relay to the Volvo relay, fan power will be triggered by the 82 degree switch for low speed, 92 for high. That's how it was in my last 2 cars and it worked just fine. Never got hot and the fan didn't run too much.



ALDEN- I have a spare NIB 92 switch, you can have it if you want to try it. I don't think I would go lower on your car, I don't think you are running too cold. What's your operating temp at cruise with the fan off?