How to make a pair of B6304 headers [Archive]

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frpe82

05-02-2009, 11:57 PM

First of all, you buy a set of these (or similar):

The ones who have read my project thread recognise these...

The headers that can be used for the B6304 engine are the M50/M52 BMW engine headers (1992-1998 I think).

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header.jpg

Start by cutting the head flanges off. Some headers may have a design where you can actually re-drill the flange to fit on the B6304, but not this one.

If you are keeping the BMW head flange, then there is also a question whether or not the opening in the BMW head flange have a smooth transition where it meets the runners. In that case you may have to port it, or even add material and then port it.

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (4).jpg

After the flanges have been cut off from the headers, we clean it up a little.

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (6).jpg

The headers in question are designed to fit the stock exhaust system of a BMW M3, and therefore the flanges and pipes are designed based on that. So we need to change more than just the flanges.

On this specific header, each of the three primary runners have a cross-sectional area of 962 mm2. For one header that makes the three primary runners have a combined cross-sectional area of 2886 mm2. That means that the collector of each header will need an output size of roughly 2.4".

But the collector tapered down to a pretty small size, and it had an outlet with a cross-sectional area of 1735 mm2. So I cut the tapered part after the collector off, and I will be replacing that part with 2.5" pipe (cross-sectional area of 3167 mm2).

Measure the collector part, and cut it where it tapers down. In this case it started to taper down from a size of 2.5" which is perfect for me to weld my secondary runners to (2.5" pipe).

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (2).jpg

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (3).jpg

Then clean it up a little:

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (5).jpg

This is how the 2.5" pipe is going to sit (not neccesarily at that angle though). I can't fit any pipes to the headers until they are test fitted on the car.

The pipes will not be welded directly to the headers though. I will use V-band flanges for that.

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (10).jpg

Here you can see that the collectors are tapered down a lot to fit the stock BMW output flanges, and that they are restrictive and have a flow imbalance:

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (8).jpg

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (9).jpg

Cut the Volvo head flange in two pieces.

There are two reasons why: To minimise the warping, and to be able to work on each header individually.

Please observe how it has to be cut so that the exhaust gaskets fit, and so that both headers can be put on the head with the correct amount of nuts.

This flange is the stainless steel version.

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (7).jpg

Weld the flanges to the headers. I MIG-weld using stainless 0.6mm wire and CO2 as inert gas.

I built up a lot of material with the welder to be able to port the opening out later on.

Unshrouding the bolt holes will be neccesary as well since some of the runners are really close to the bolt holes.

Welding it on both the inside as well as the outside is dependant on the header design you have chosen. On this header design I didn't have to weld it on the inside. I just wanted to know how difficult it was to do it with a MIG welder.

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (11).jpg

Then port it as much as you can.

Use a really good tool for this part. Use any technology and design of the tool you like, but investing in good equipment pays off in the end. It will take some time, even with good tools.

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (12).jpg

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (15).jpg

And then clean it up.

It looks like these headers will flow pretty good :-D

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (16).jpg

This is what they look like when almost finished.

I need to test fit them to the car and then put the secondary runners on.

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (1).jpg

The flanges will have to be machined flat. Some straightening of the flanges has to be made first, or else there will be nothing left after machining.

To do that properly, you need one of these. An 8kW induction heater:

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (17).jpg

And then clamp the headers to some really hard (and flat) beams. Heat them in strategic places and clamp it as hard as you can. Let them cool off by themselves, and then you can remove them:

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (18).jpg

Then the headers are left to Alex Buchka to be machined flat, and to get the V-band flanges welded on.

Really nice work :-D

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (39).jpg

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (35).jpg

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (36).jpg

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (37).jpg

Remove the stock manifolds and the downpipe/cat section:

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (25).jpg

Since I will get a new performance exhaust system, the rest will have to go as well.

It is very hard to get the entire system off the V90. I had to cut it in several places.

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (27).jpg

Test fit the headers.

Three problems arose...

* The headers got too close to the engine, which made the V-band clamps impossible to get on and off the flange.
* Both headers touched the water pipe that runs behind the stock manifolds.
* The front header touched the engine mount.

The first problem is easily fixed. Another head flange (10mm thick) is ordered. Then use that as a spacer to get the headers out. With exhaust gaskets between the head and spacer flange + exhaust gaskets between the spacer flange and the headers, the total spacing from the head is 12.5mm. That is enough to get the headers fitted.

The second problem is not easily fixed though. I massaged the pipe a little to bend it out of the way, but both headers are still touching it a little. Will this be a problem?

The third problem is fixed somewhat easily. Just cut a piece out of the engine mount.

:-P or :wtf: ? You decide.

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (19).jpg

Then test fit the secondary runners. It takes some patience to get this to fit properly. They have to clear each other, the floor of the car (while still sitting as close to it as possible), the chassis bracing etc. etc.

In total, I ended up using one straight 1000mm long piece, three 30* bends and two 45* bends.

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (20).jpg

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (21).jpg

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (22).jpg

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (23).jpg

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (24).jpg

Spot weld it all while it is fitted to the car, and then take it down to inspect it.

Remember that when you spot weld it in place, then put the welds 180* opposite of each other on the pipes so that it doesn't warp.

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (26).jpg

Then weld it all up.

Remember to still use the same procedure as when you were spot welding it while it was fitted to the car. Always weld on the opposite side of where you last welded on the pipe.

If you are using V-band flanges, then leave a small piece of the pipe protruding through the flange. This is used as a labyrinth gasket and it seals better. That way you will probably not need any type of gasket.

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (32).jpg

Then I put on a temporary pipe to use on the way to the exhaust shop where my new system will be fitted.

"TA BORT" as written on the temporary pipe, means "remove" in English.

I recommend you not to do what I did. It is incredibly loud! But I didn't have a choice really.

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (33).jpg

This is what it looks like from above when almost finished.

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (34).jpg

And when everything is put together (with a spacer flange and all the exhaust gaskets), and it has been taken for a spin to see if everything is alright, it looks like this.

Hot, hot, hot...

http://hem.bredband.net/fredrik-persson/Turbobricks/Header/Header (38).jpg

Now I am just waiting until the exhaust shop has made me a new exhaust system.

More updates will follow soon.

ShadowofBob

05-03-2009, 12:23 AM

Looks great! Might be doing something similar later this summer. Gotta get my 960 running first though.

What are you running from the dual 2.5" on the headers to the back of the car?

frpe82

05-03-2009, 12:32 AM

Looks great! Might be doing something similar later this summer. Gotta get my 960 running first though.

What are you running from the dual 2.5" on the headers to the back of the car?
The dual 2.5" pipes will be joined into one 3" pipe under the car, just before the cat.

On the 15th of May, the new exhaust will be installed.

3" metallic 300-cell cat.
After that, a pipe that tapers down to 2.5".
And a straight-through 2.5" exhaust system.

I don't know if I will have one or two mufflers, but we'll see how loud it gets.

And if you wonder why I am going with 2.5" exhaust instead of 3"...

* The 2.5" cat-back is sufficient for up to almost 300HP, and I don't think I will have more NA HP than that for a while.
* The 2.5" cat-back has the right length/volume for this tune.
* It is possible to fit it more easily over the IRS axle setup, but I don't care about that reason (if I had to use a 3" setup, I would have used that even if it is hard to get it to fit).

badvlvo

05-03-2009, 01:13 AM

Nice work. You will have to post some video so we can hear it when it's done.

volvorsport

05-03-2009, 05:40 AM

if youve got room .

http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/viewthread.php?tid=106545

frpe82

05-03-2009, 06:22 AM

if youve got room .

http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/viewthread.php?tid=106545
Interesting design.

frpe82

05-03-2009, 07:04 AM

The are a few header designs from different companies out there.

The reason I chose the one pictured to modify in the first post, is because it had nearly the exact specs to give good power on my car.

I don't know how the other headers compare, but if you can get the spec beforehand, or if you get it cheap (eBay for ~$100 shipped), then good for you. Most of them, if not all, will be better than the stock cast manifolds anyway, even though they may not be matched length-wise or in other ways.

What may become difficult though, is if you buy full length headers, since the install height would be different compared to the BMW, and it would be hard to mate it to the exhaust and get the correct clearance relative to the body of the car.

DaButcher

05-03-2009, 07:39 AM

It looks very good, fred! Cant wait to hear the exhaust roar.

frpe82

05-03-2009, 07:48 AM

It looks very good, fred! Cant wait to hear the exhaust roar.
I can't wait either :-D

But it will be another week before the headers are installed, and then another week before the rest of the exhaust is installed.

I will let you hear what it sounds like with just the header though (with and without the stock exhaust system connected :oogle:)

kildea

05-03-2009, 01:17 PM

it's worth mentioning that the stock bmw flanges will work well, if someone wants to skip the extra expense of new flanges.
when i did it i just redrilled the holes in the flange and welded a small tab at the back edge to pick up the last stud.

to get the extra couple of mm's so everything matches perfectly just port the flange a little.

frpe82

05-03-2009, 01:43 PM

kildea

05-03-2009, 01:46 PM

That was not possible with these headers though.

?

why not, it was possible with my bmw headers.

is it the angle of the flange?

frpe82

05-03-2009, 01:52 PM

?

why not, it was possible with my bmw headers.

is it the angle of the flange?
Yes, and how the runners are fastened on the flange. The runners are pretty big (wide). Some of the bolts would have to go through the side of some of the runners.

Trust me, it was not even close to fitting if it were to be re-drilled.

kildea

05-03-2009, 01:58 PM

Yes, and how the runners are fastened on the flange. The runners are pretty big (wide). Some of the bolts would have to go through the side of some of the runners.

Trust me, it was not even close to fitting if it were to be re-drilled.

the thing is i already did it.

and have been daily driving it for a year, i think you are missing something, the stock bolt holes on that flange need only to be moved slightly, one must be elongated, and the other redrilled.
the flange you have there ... the bmw one, is identical to the bmw flange on my t6 engine.

i'm simply suggesting an alternative for those who want to do it another way, and it works .... trust me.

frpe82

05-03-2009, 02:10 PM

the thing is i already did it.

and have been daily driving it for a year, i think you are missing something, the stock bolt holes on that flange need only to be moved slightly, one must be elongated, and the other redrilled.
the flange you have there ... the bmw one, is identical to the bmw flange on my t6 engine.

i'm simply suggesting an alternative for those who want to do it another way, and it works .... trust me.
So... do you have a set of these headers then?

I know that the flange is the same, and I can see how it can easily be done on many other headers on eBay and from some other companies. But not these specific headers. The runners and welds are in the way.

kildea

05-03-2009, 02:14 PM

So... do you have a set of these headers then?

I know that the flange is the same, and I can see how it can easily be done on many other headers on eBay and from some other companies. But not these specific headers. The runners and welds are in the way.

are you serious?

i'm the guy who told you about the m50 headers ... in that thread like 4 months ago.

the flange is what it is.

the bolt holes need to be redrilled AWAY from the ports . i.e. you pick up MORE ROOM by redrilling the same flange.

what you are suggesting would require that the opposite be true.
this back and fourth is simply going to cause more confusion for others who read this article, look at you picture above - the holes in the b6304 flange are further from the port than those in the bmw flange.

frpe82

05-03-2009, 02:27 PM

are you serious?

i'm the guy who told you about the m50 headers ... in that thread like 4 months ago.
I know. And I thank you. :)

But it didn't allow itself to be re-drilled. Otherwise I would have done that and saved quite a lot of time and money adapting the Volvo flange to it.

the flange is what it is.

the bolt holes need to be redrilled AWAY from the ports . i.e. you pick up MORE ROOM by redrilling the same flange.

what you are suggesting would require that the opposite be true.
this back and fourth is simply going to cause more confusion for others who read this article, look at you picture above - the holes in the b6304 flange are further from the port than those in the bmw flange.
Yes, I can clearly see that. But on this specific header it didn't work.

I definitely don't want to argue with you about it, since the sole reason I used the Volvo flange was because the BMW one could not be used.

On many others it will though. That is pretty obvious by just looking at many of the headers out there. Many other headers have a slightly different design that let them be easily adapted.

frpe82

05-03-2009, 02:32 PM

BTW... Which headers did you buy?

Is there a company or link? Maybe even a picture?

kildea

05-03-2009, 02:33 PM

I know. And I thank you. :)

But it didn't allow itself to be re-drilled. Otherwise I would have done that and saved quite a lot of time and money adapting the Volvo flange to it.

Yes, I can clearly see that. But on this specific header it didn't work.

I definitely don't want to argue with you about it, since the sole reason I used the Volvo flange was because the BMW one could not be used.

On many others it will though. That is pretty obvious by just looking at many of the headers out there. Many other headers have a slightly different design that let them be easily adapted.

look i talked to alex, he was there when you were doing this.

the holes that need to be drilled in the flange are further away from the tubes - to drill the flange you need to elongate the top bolt AWAY from the tube and to redrill the bottom one AWAY from the tube.
measure it and you'll see what i'm saying - the m3 head had the same exact bolt pattern and port spacing as the non-m3 m50 head - what you are saying suggests that the existing bolt holes would be too close to the tube - since drilling for the b6304 head requires drilling the holes FURTHER from the tubes than where they are on the bmw flange.

it's not that i don't think it's better to use the volvo flange - i do, i just want it to be clear that elongating thos bolt holes puts them further from the tubes than the stock bmw bolt holes do.

frpe82

05-03-2009, 02:38 PM

look i talked to alex, he was there when you were doing this.

what you are missing is that the holes that need to be drilled in the flange are further away from the tubes - to drill the flange you need to elongate the top bolt AWAY from the tube and to redrill the bottom one AWAY from the tube.

you've just got it wrong, go measure it and you'll see what i'm saying - the m3 head had the same exact bolt pattern and port spacing as the non-m3 m50 head - what you are saying suggests that the existing bolt holes would be too close to the tube - since drilling for the b6304 head requires drilling the holes FURTHER from the trubes that where they are on the bmw flange.

stop arguing and look - this is simply misinformation you are providing.
Yes, I will take a look at the flanges tomorrow and give an update on the matter.

I can of course be wrong (and then I have made all of this in vain).

But I do trust you since you have done it before.

Can you still tell me which headers you used, and what they look like? What did you do to it other than re-drill it?

kildea

05-03-2009, 03:01 PM

Yes, I will take a look at the flanges tomorrow and give an update on the matter.

I can of course be wrong (and then I have made all of this in vain).

But I do trust you since you have done it before.

Can you still tell me which headers you used, and what they look like? What did you do to it other than re-drill it?

well using the volvo flange is preferable - so i don't think you wasted anything, i just wanted to comment on what i though would be an easy way out for those without the funds.

as for what i did - well i bought 2 headers and one flange, the flange i got because at the time it seemed a cheap way out.
these are they:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/bmw-m50-s50-m52-s52-turbo-header-flange-DIY_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZ72Q3a1205Q7c66Q3a2 Q7c65Q3a12Q7c39Q3a1Q7c240Q3a1318Q7c301Q3a1Q7c293Q3 a1Q7c294Q3a50QQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem 3a4bf1f2a6QQitemZ250382250662QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fT ruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/BMW-E30-323-325-328-M20-T3-TURBO-STAINLESS-MANIFOLD_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZ72Q3a1205Q7c6 6Q3a2Q7c65Q3a12Q7c39Q3a1Q7c240Q3a1318Q7c301Q3a1Q7c 293Q3a1Q7c294Q3a50QQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhash Zitem230121c920QQitemZ150342846752QQptZMotorsQ5fCa rQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
and the m50 ones i have are similar to the curly ones you have there, though i don't see them on ebay now...

if the issue with drilling was the studs bumping into the curled back tubes then the simplest soilution is to use bolts on those spots - i actually use studs on only 4 of the holes on my headers, the rest get bolts for this reason, and just because i happened to have those and only 4 good studs.
to get things to fit in my case was a little bit of a different story - sortof.
i had ported the exhaust side of the t6 head quite a bit before starting. then i took the turbo header, cut the runners at the flange, and welded them to a set of larger tubes, then welded these tubes to the m50 flange.
i then built up the weld around the whole tube, extending this welded base ~3.5 cm out from the flange.
then i used a burr and ported the flange and that new welded base - i ended up taking a whole lot of metal out to widen the bmw flange and port to match the newly enlarged t6 port.
as for the drilling all i did was chose a bit that was slightly larger than the top hole on the flange and drilled that out, since the stud is only ~2-3mm overlapped - its orientation in the larger hole becomes ~ the 5 o-clock position.
the bottom hole i hogged out towards the 2 o-clock position by ~5-6mm to match the position of the stud.

as for the one stud at the back of the head i just welded on a little chunk to the back of the flange to pick that one up.

in my case i made the bmw tubes significantly wider and taller to match my head.

i still have the n/a headers at the shop, have not used them yet, but they may find their way onto a project soon.

i have since purchased the necessary gear to put together a new header, so when the existing one comes off i can photograph the flange for reference.

frpe82

05-03-2009, 03:42 PM

well using the volvo flange is preferable - so i don't think you wasted anything, i just wanted to comment on what i though would be an easy way out for those without the funds.
Yes, definitely. And that is exactly what I am saying in the first post in this thread as well. There is no point in making it more difficult than it has to be.

This is what I wrote:

Start by cutting the head flanges off. Some headers may have a design where you can actually re-drill the flange to fit on the B6304, but not this one.

If you are keeping the BMW head flange, then there is also a question whether or not the opening in the BMW head flange have a smooth transition where it meets the runners. In that case you may have to port it, or even add material and then port it.

as for what i did - well i bought 2 headers and one flange, the flange i got because at the time it seemed a cheap way out.
these are they:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/bmw-m50-s50-m52-s52-turbo-header-flange-DIY_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZ72Q3a1205Q7c66Q3a2 Q7c65Q3a12Q7c39Q3a1Q7c240Q3a1318Q7c301Q3a1Q7c293Q3 a1Q7c294Q3a50QQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhashZitem 3a4bf1f2a6QQitemZ250382250662QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fT ruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/BMW-E30-323-325-328-M20-T3-TURBO-STAINLESS-MANIFOLD_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZ72Q3a1205Q7c6 6Q3a2Q7c65Q3a12Q7c39Q3a1Q7c240Q3a1318Q7c301Q3a1Q7c 293Q3a1Q7c294Q3a50QQ_trksidZp3286Q2ec0Q2em14QQhash Zitem230121c920QQitemZ150342846752QQptZMotorsQ5fCa rQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
and the m50 ones i have are similar to the curly ones you have there, though i don't see them on ebay now...
Those look nice :)

if the issue with drilling was the studs bumping into the curled back tubes then the simplest soilution is to use bolts on those spots - i actually use studs on only 4 of the holes on my headers, the rest get bolts for this reason, and just because i happened to have those and only 4 good studs.
to get things to fit in my case was a little bit of a different story - sortof.
i had ported the exhaust side of the t6 head quite a bit before starting. then i took the turbo header, cut the runners at the flange, and welded them to a set of larger tubes, then welded these tubes to the m50 flange.
i then built up the weld around the whole tube, extending this welded base ~3.5 cm out from the flange.
then i used a burr and ported the flange and that new welded base - i ended up taking a whole lot of metal out to widen the bmw flange and port to match the newly enlarged t6 port.
as for the drilling all i did was chose a bit that was slightly larger than the top hole on the flange and drilled that out, since the stud is only ~2-3mm overlapped - its orientation in the larger hole becomes ~ the 5 o-clock position.
the bottom hole i hogged out towards the 2 o-clock position by ~5-6mm to match the position of the stud.

as for the one stud at the back of the head i just welded on a little chunk to the back of the flange to pick that one up.

in my case i made the bmw tubes significantly wider and taller to match my head.

i still have the n/a headers at the shop, have not used them yet, but they may find their way onto a project soon.

i have since purchased the necessary gear to put together a new header, so when the existing one comes off i can photograph the flange for reference.
Yeah, I understand you completely. But on this specific header, the re-drilling of the holes would have put them in less than favourable positions.

I am sure that I would have had close to no problems with re-drilling most of the other headers, but I could not have known that before I bought this set. I am once again referring to my quote in red text above. The flange swap is of course not neccesary if you can re-drill the BMW flange.

I don't know why we are arguing in the first place (I started it, I know). But for me, and in this single case, it was easier to swap the flange.

I made this guide for both the headers that can be re-drilled and the ones that can't be.

And like you, I also built up a lot of material around the tube to be able to port it a lot. I didn't like the sharp step that I got after welding the runners to the flanges. The BMW flange was even worse in that aspect, and if I had used that, I would have had to add a lot of material to those as well to be able to port them.

DaButcher

05-03-2009, 05:47 PM

I have a suggestion:
Those who have done (with success) mods like this, contribute with pictures, so the final article can have several options for mods.
However, saying just "foo fits bar", will also confuse people who dont even know what a bmw is, if they cant see pictures, etc. with good descriptions.

I hope more can contribute, but please also help with good pics, like frpe82 has done now :-)

frpe82

05-04-2009, 03:46 PM

After heating strategic parts of the headers with an 8kW induction heater and bolting/clamping it to a steel square profile to straighten the flanges, I left the rest to Alex (Buchka), and he is going to surface the flanges.

frpe82

05-06-2009, 05:16 PM

Alex has now welded the V-band flanges to my headers.

Pics will come.

Typhoon

05-09-2009, 04:02 AM

frpe82

05-09-2009, 06:21 AM

A suggestion for your secondary pipes. Everything I have ever read about every inline six suggests that you should make the secondary pipes as long as you reasonably can under the car. It seems all inline sixes respond to this with a much broader torque curve.
The Jaguar XK engine for example will pick up around 20ft/lbs of torque just by lengthening teh secondary pipes another 9", everything else in teh exhaust system remaining the same.
The limit in my system (and everybody elses systems), is the placement of the cat. If this was a 940, I could have put the cat further back, but on the V90 the placement is limited to one place only.

Some sources suggest a true dual system to the back of the car with balance pipe is the best way to go, but later model cars seldom have room for this.

Regards, Andrew.
Definitely. The V90 would be able to do a dual 2.5" all the way back, but then again... the cat.

I am actually at the shop right now, welding my secondary pipes and fiddling around with the exhaust. It is tricky. Dual 2.5" pipes from the headers and under the car is pretty tight.

The headers "almost" fit fine. I had to get rid of a piece of the engine mount to clear the front header, and I have to use another exhaust flange to space the headers out from the head (the V-band flanges were almost touching the block, making it impossible to get the clamps on).

Pictures will follow later.

DaButcher

05-09-2009, 05:09 PM

The limit in my system (and everybody elses systems), is the placement of the cat. If this was a 940, I could have put the cat further back, but on the V90 the placement is limited to one place only.

Definitely. The V90 would be able to do a dual 2.5" all the way back, but then again... the cat.

I am actually at the shop right now, welding my secondary pipes and fiddling around with the exhaust. It is tricky. Dual 2.5" pipes from the headers and under the car is pretty tight.

The headers "almost" fit fine. I had to get rid of a piece of the engine mount to clear the front header, and I have to use another exhaust flange to space the headers out from the head (the V-band flanges were almost touching the block, making it impossible to get the clamps on).

Pictures will follow later.
Also dont forget that the E85 requires the Cat to be close to the engine :-)

frpe82

05-09-2009, 05:28 PM

Also dont forget that the E85 requires the Cat to be close to the engine :-)
Yes and no.

Yes, because: It takes a little bit longer for the car to warm up on E85, and the exhaust is also cooler during driving (but not enough to make a difference once the cat has started up).

No, because: Partly of what I said above. Once the cat is fired up, it works like it should.

But you do have a very valid point there. In many cases it can take a very long time to get the cat to work (as I have noticed several times at the annual emissions test).

frpe82

05-10-2009, 11:01 AM

Big picture and story update in the first post.

Now it gets interesting :-P

JW240

05-10-2009, 01:19 PM

very nice :-D

blabla

05-10-2009, 01:51 PM

This is coming together very nice :) Beautiful!

frpe82

05-10-2009, 05:35 PM

very nice :-D

This is coming together very nice :) Beautiful!

Hehe... I can't wait until Friday when the exhaust shop is finished with the car :-D

frpe82

05-13-2009, 02:35 PM

Even more updates have been made in the first post.

Everything is put together, and Alex Buchka's work is also shown off.

Only the rest of the exhaust remains to be fixed now.

Please look in my project thread for some driving with open pipes :omg: : http://forums.turbobricks.com/showpost.php?p=2439893&postcount=468

Mtouring_Tuff*typing

05-13-2009, 11:36 PM

I have a suggestion:
Those who have done (with success) mods like this, contribute with pictures, like frpe82 has done now :-)

Haha funnie thing is that theres a good chance Kildea kno's more on this topic then anyone on this thread.

a simple photo of his t6 242 motor bay will clear this up.

Typhoon

05-14-2009, 07:21 AM

I think you should put a slip joint in the shorter secondary pipe. Might be O.K, but keep an eye out for cracking.
System looks very nice though!

Regards, Andrew.

frpe82

05-14-2009, 08:18 AM

Haha funnie thing is that theres a good chance Kildea kno's more on this topic then anyone on this thread.

a simple photo of his t6 242 motor bay will clear this up.
I did this for my own amusement. I am not forcing it on anyone. I just thought it would be fun to post on the forum about which route I chose.

Kildea is a good guy and I thank him for showing me which headers that would fit. I am sure he has a very good header setup as well. I have never disputed that.

I just wanted to post my story.

But like DaButcher said, it would be nice with some more pictures and input in this thread on how this could be done with other headers. That way there are many options. My way and my header is not the only one.

frpe82

05-14-2009, 08:19 AM

I think you should put a slip joint in the shorter secondary pipe. Might be O.K, but keep an eye out for cracking.
System looks very nice though!

Regards, Andrew.
I was actually thinking about that recently as well... There is some flex in it though, but I will definitely look out for cracks.

Chuck W

05-14-2009, 09:14 AM

What is that 2-into-1 piece you used?

frpe82

05-14-2009, 09:17 AM

What is that 2-into-1 piece you used?
It is a chromed stainless piece that I bought from my exhaust shop. I think they make them themselves actually.

ADent

05-28-2009, 12:20 PM

BTW... Which headers did you buy?

Is there a company or link? Maybe even a picture?

I see the BMP Design logo on one of the early shots. Looks like their shorty headers: http://www.bmpdesign.com/product-exec/product_id/6862/category_id/100/search_year/1996/search_model/55

frpe82

05-28-2009, 04:39 PM

I see the BMP Design logo on one of the early shots. Looks like their shorty headers: http://www.bmpdesign.com/product-exec/product_id/6862/category_id/100/search_year/1996/search_model/55
You do know that I am the creator of this thread, right? I didn't ask myself what I bought... :-P

And yes, those are the headers I bought.

wckd

06-10-2009, 12:21 PM

(or similar)

Think THESE (http://www.handelshausprieser.com/auto-tuning/rennsport-edelstahl-faecherkruemmer-fuer-bmw/rennsport-edelstahl-faecherkruemmer-bmw-e36-e34.htm) would work? Could get a set for about $300 (new)...

frpe82

06-10-2009, 12:59 PM

Think THESE (http://www.handelshausprieser.com/auto-tuning/rennsport-edelstahl-faecherkruemmer-fuer-bmw/rennsport-edelstahl-faecherkruemmer-bmw-e36-e34.htm) would work? Could get a set for about $300 (new)...
I think you can get a much better price on eBay.

wckd

06-11-2009, 02:56 AM

I think you can get a much better price on eBay.

Right you are - 50€ -150€ on ebay.. nice of the seller to post a link with 845,00€ price :omg:
Anyway, OEM BMW headers ftw?

Turbeam

10-10-2009, 06:04 AM

z7orm

10-14-2011, 05:50 PM

anyone who can craft a pair of these for me?