How much P.S.I can standard.....AW71 Take?

[Harleyvolvo]

Seriously, what torque/WHP can the auto handle with the accumulator mod plus decent oil cooler? I just stuffed 3rd gear on the M46 and know the AW handles more then the Volvo box.
Also is the tail-shaft the same for auto and manual? Any other things different I need to know or GET?
I guess the AW71 is the same thru the years? (any year models better than others)
I'm just not up for the V8 T5 mod yet as rego is due in 2 weeks.
Thanks

[Raz]

People have run 12s on them?

[menace]

I just blew mine up the other day with


15G w/super 60 wheel @ 15 psi
3 inch catless exhaust
tlao chips
browntops
IPD cam

So Im sketchy as to how much abuse they can really take, but didnt that guy Kenny
( I believe) make over 400 wheel on an aw71 for a little while?

[Texas240]

im running 10 on m46 and its doing fine but thats just 10

[thelostartof]

AW71's from a 93+ car have shown to hold 300whp and 7000rpm just fine. After that it is unknown

[ErikS]

People have run 12s on them?

Easily, with less than 400whp.

[2fast242gt]

I just blew mine up the other day with


15G w/super 60 wheel @ 15 psi
3 inch catless exhaust
tlao chips
browntops
IPD cam

So Im sketchy as to how much abuse they can really take, but didnt that guy Kenny
( I believe) make over 400 wheel on an aw71 for a little while?

you didnt have the accumulator mod huh? they are great when modded sucky stock.

[BDKR]

you didnt have the accumulator mod huh? They are great when modded sucky stock.

+1

[Magnum TE]

AW71's from a 93+ car have shown to hold 300whp and 7000rpm just fine. After that it is unknown

I'm a little skurd to post in this thread... knock on wood and all that

My 160k '92 AW71 dosn't have the accumulator mod, however it feels like it did eat a ball or something because the 1 -2 shift is rather firm. I'm running around 12 psi on a MSnS +T setup making around 275hp and rev limiting at 7k. It's been holding up alirght... again I don't like saying it but it seems ok.

It all depends on maintenance and condition of the tranny... remember these fail on 114hp NA Volvos ... so YMMV

(300 hp should be ok)

[Harleyvolvo]

OK, thanks for the quick replies. I'm off to the wreckers!
Yeah, I was p!ssed off when I found out the autos handle more grunt then the manuals.
The accumulator mod looks easy to do, l'll just have to find somewhere to mount a cooler now.
I dont think a BW55 radiator with inbuilt cooler will be enough?
I'll try for the 93+ trans.
Hey nobody chimed in about the tail-shaft?
I'd guess it's the same.
Hey Texas240, mine blew at 14.5 psi. Although most of my driving Boost was at 19-21psi where I could.

[linuxman51]

the aw70 found behind NA volvos stock (with the exception of late model 900 series cars) is not at all the same thing as an aw71. they just look similar on the outside. How much they'll hold is still relative to how much high rpm power you make, not as much as how high you rev the engine.

[dieselboy]

i had aw71l with accum mod and it lasted 500 miles behind 18psi... with other mods of course. 94 b230f+16v+t. t3/t4 rsi rods 46lb injectors 4 bar fpr etc....
i ran 25psi through the old 8v and it lasted

[Harleyvolvo]

the aw70 found behind NA volvos stock (with the exception of late model 900 series cars) is not at all the same thing as an aw71. they just look similar on the outside. How much they'll hold is still relative to how much high rpm power you make, not as much as how high you rev the engine.

Are you saying only turbo cars have the AW71?
Can I quickly tell the diff?
Now I wish I'd left the B cam in, rather then the D cam.

[Dfer10]

i had a 93 aw71 and it held 300hp for over 15k miles but that was with a laggy turbo not a quick spooling 15g or 19t....... but larger indeed

[linuxman51]

Are you saying only turbo cars have the AW71?
Can I quickly tell the diff?
Now I wish I'd left the B cam in, rather then the D cam.

for the most part, only turbo cars have aw71's. HOWEVER after about 1993, all 9xx 4 bangers had aw71's.

[gsellstr]

Like Toby, I probably shouldn't be posting this as it means mine will drop dead tomorrow. 21k on a junkyard AW71L that came to me with 180k and seriously burnt fluid. Still runs great, did a flush last night and it smoothed out a little. The 71L's were in turbo and non-turbo cars post-93.

A suggestion for the OP...look for a late non-turbo car as the trans will have seen far less abuse than a turbo car.

[Harleyvolvo]

for the most part, only turbo cars have aw71's. HOWEVER after about 1993, all 9xx 4 bangers had aw71's.

Ahhh, OK.
AW70 are 3 speeds? yes?
So does the AW71 have 1,2,3,D,R,P and l'll be able to tell the differance?
I'm glad I saw your post before I left for the wreckers.

[Harleyvolvo]

Like Toby, I probably shouldn't be posting this as it means mine will drop dead tomorrow. 21k on a junkyard AW71L that came to me with 180k and seriously burnt fluid. Still runs great, did a flush last night and it smoothed out a little. The 71L's were in turbo and non-turbo cars post-93.

A suggestion for the OP...look for a late non-turbo car as the trans will have seen far less abuse than a turbo car.

Good STUFF, thanks!
Hey some of you lot are way too Superstitious.
I thought with an AW71 I wouldn't have to nurse the gearbox as much:-P
Hey 180K's is soooooo young! Anything under 400KM's I call OK:lol:

[ovlo]

aw71 is a good trans just keep in mind that your shopping for a 15 yr old used trans. dont expect too much. I wouldnt wrap up too much money in one if you plan on keeping your ride and making more hp down the road. get somthing thats gona last

[linuxman51]

The shifter on both aw70's and aw71's is the same. the linkage is the same. the cases are the same. You can set them both side by side and externally no one will be able to tell which one is which without seeing the tag on the side. You're looking for an 03-71, tag is on the driver's side of the transmission just above the trans pan. usually covered in about 1/2 inch of ****.

[Greenhornet95]

thought the easiest way to tell the AW70's & 71's apart was that the AW71's had the OD button on the side of the shifter & the AW70's didn't...?

-Carlo

[linuxman51]

no. that is a year to year thing, with most pre-92 cars having the button on the side.

[BDKR]

aw71 is a good trans just keep in mind that your shopping for a 15 yr old used trans. dont expect too much. I wouldnt wrap up too much money in one if you plan on keeping your ride and making more hp down the road. get somthing thats gona last

Define that upper power level. I would be perfectly comfortable living with an AW71 in a 300+ HP car.

But also speaking to what you say, you are right: if the unit has been poorly taken care, then it's going to suck.

[89740GLT]

91 940T w/AW71

3" exhaust, 10psi, brown tops. daily Driver

225,000mi on the clock.

Approx 100K of those have been with the above combo the trans has the accumulator mod performed at 130K and synthetic fluid.

So far no problems or fading of the transmission noticed.

Keep the fluid cool and clean.

[linuxman51]

Guys its not really a function of boost that kills the transmissions. If it was, sam would have blown the last aw71 we put in his 240 all the way out to arnold's desk... Drag radials, 120 dry shot out of the hole and 27psi on race gas with a 50 trim? no issues out of the transmission for months, and iirc its still in the car to this day (Altho I'm willing to bet the new owner doesn't beat on the car nearly as bad as sam did :-D )

[BDKR]

guys its not really a function of boost that kills the transmissions.


+1

[TerribleOne]

It's really hard to tell the 70 from the 71 until you get under it and locate the ID tag.. Be careful buying filters for them as well, because they differ between the 70 and 71.. Some of the later models have a lockup converter which is a good thing with the price of gas these days.
http://c2.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/42/l_10fe56e3bcc54b4a93607e0d6c60921d.jpg


Basically no matter what you get, be sure to use clean fluid, change the fluid often if you drag the car alot.. and be sure before you drive the car, all the circuits are full of fluid before you pull the stick.. and dont forget to compensate for the extra capacity if you install an oil cooler.

[morganpartee]

What tranny came on the straight sixes in the earlier 960's?

[linuxman51]

A341. not interchangeable without a lot of work.

[fcpgroton]

When I had my 940 Turbo, I was running 13PSI on the AW-71 without an issues. Like was mentioned above, some guys have had 300 wheel HP and they were fine. Make sure you have some really good tranny fluid in her.

[morganpartee]

A341. not interchangeable without a lot of work.

Gotcha, didn't think so, but figured i'd ask. Meh, time to start looking for an AW71 i guess. Silly N/A 740...

[Harleyvolvo]

Thanks for the info Guys! Not too many volvo's at the wreckers in my local area. Two actually! Both 1988's with ~300KM's. It's Ford and Holden (GM) around here. Asked about other boxes (V8 T5 etc), and the general reply is "what, volvo's don't make enough power to brake a gearbox":roll:
20yrs ago Volvo's in Aust where driven by old slow folk who couldn't drive so bought the Volvo because it's safe: however there all dead now, or.... have given them to there kids who thrush them. Old slow folk drive Suburu's here now.

Anyhow are AW70 total crap?

Might get a convertion kit and Supra from 'Dellow' if I'm going to freight a box 700KM's:wtf:

[Harleyvolvo]

Found this @ brickboard

[Gene Stevens] The only AW71L gearboxes available in NA behind the B230F (not turbo) do NOT have the same valving or number of clutch plates as the turbo version. Same for the AW70/70L used before 1992. It is a light duty version and will not live long behind a turbo engine, regardless of the "71" designation. The reason a lockup converter was used with turbo in Europe, but not NA, is that the higher 120-140 kmh highway speed allowed the turbo to stay in boost range but US/Canada 80-90 kmh speed lowered engine (and turbo) speed too much for good performance. The theories of weak converter clutch as the reason are baloney.

[gsellstr]

I call BS. The local dealer catalog shows the same part number for 93 NA and turbo cars, both being a 71L. No difference in clutch numbers I wouldn't assume, being it's the same part number from Volvo.

[Jerd]

can the acumulator mod be done on a aw70? I have a friend with an 92 240 n/a.

[linuxman51]

can the acumulator mod be done on a aw70? I have a friend with an 92 240 n/a.

yes it can.

[linuxman51]

Thanks for the info Guys! Not too many volvo's at the wreckers in my local area. Two actually! Both 1988's with ~300KM's. It's Ford and Holden (GM) around here. Asked about other boxes (V8 T5 etc), and the general reply is "what, volvo's don't make enough power to brake a gearbox":roll:
20yrs ago Volvo's in Aust where driven by old slow folk who couldn't drive so bought the Volvo because it's safe: however there all dead now, or.... have given them to there kids who thrush them. Old slow folk drive Suburu's here now.

Anyhow are AW70 total crap?

Might get a convertion kit and Supra from 'Dellow' if I'm going to freight a box 700KM's:wtf:

aw70 is not worth the effort. look around a little more for a turbo automatic. its worth the effort.

Found this @ brickboard

[Gene Stevens] The only AW71L gearboxes available in NA behind the B230F (not turbo) do NOT have the same valving or number of clutch plates as the turbo version. Same for the AW70/70L used before 1992. It is a light duty version and will not live long behind a turbo engine, regardless of the "71" designation. The reason a lockup converter was used with turbo in Europe, but not NA, is that the higher 120-140 kmh highway speed allowed the turbo to stay in boost range but US/Canada 80-90 kmh speed lowered engine (and turbo) speed too much for good performance. The theories of weak converter clutch as the reason are baloney.

The guy is wrong. up to 1992, NA cars got either aw70's or 70L's, the latter is just a lockup version of the former. The Asin-warner designation for the volvo aw70 is the A42D (or DL). It has a smaller overdrive unit in it, but the same number (off the top of my head) and type of clutches as found in an aw71 from overdrive back ..HOWEVER.. everything inside is phsyically smaller.. smaller planetarys and sun gears, smaller shafts, different pump assembly. The aw70 also runs a bit lower line pressure throughout.

the 3-71L and the 3-72L are both A43DL's, and the aw71 is an A43D. with these boxes you get bigger planetary gears and sun shells, a different valve body and separator plate. The Lockup transmissions have bigger pumps, and the overdrive brakes are bigger (it is worth nothing that the overdrive brakes are what force the transmission into overdrive, not the clutch found inside the overdrive shell).

All of the locking transmissions should be locked up by approximately 45mph (depends on throttle input however as the throttle valve has a direct impact on line pressure) under cruise and light acceleration. The **** small turbos volvo put on these cars would still be "in the boost range" regardless of the national speed limits. Turbo cars after 1993 also got aw71L's in an effort to boost the fuel economy. I'm not really sure what that guy is talking about. Converter clutches can and do wear out just like any other part of the transmission.

I call BS. The local dealer catalog shows the same part number for 93 NA and turbo cars, both being a 71L. No difference in clutch numbers I wouldn't assume, being it's the same part number from Volvo.

yeah. same gearbox. For ****s and giggles get an aw72L converter with a 71L transmission and enjoy a slightly higher factory stall experience.

[DaButcher]

If running it on a turbo car which sees a lot of boost, remember extra oil cooler.
We killed one aw71 after maybe 5000km.. It started making funny sounds, squeeling, then suddenly it had no power left :P I believe heat killed it.

[charles850t]

Yeah, I was p!ssed off when I found out the autos handle more grunt then the manuals.



Wait, what?

The Auto will handle more power than the Stick?

What about the Getrag?
How much will that take?

[740ATL]

Wait, what?

The Auto will handle more power than the Stick?

What about the Getrag?
How much will that take?

Yes, you read that correctly... from what has been shown, the "modded" aw71 can handle more abuse than either the m46 or the m47..... unmodified, the 71 will not live long.

Seeing as the getrag is not a stock volvo transmission, it was probably not included in this discussion, but yes, the getrag 265 (262) is fairly robust and will handle more of what you can throw at it than the aw71/m46/m47... but there's the small issue of the conversion.

[linuxman51]

If running it on a turbo car which sees a lot of boost, remember extra oil cooler.
We killed one aw71 after maybe 5000km.. It started making funny sounds, squeeling, then suddenly it had no power left :P I believe heat killed it.

if it started making noises, you had FOD damage going on. I normally just wipe the friction material off the clutches.

[hockey930]

mine hasn't completely crapped it's self yet. But how many miles do you consider it "holding"
Last dyno run proclaimed 350/420 This aw71 can't last too long.

[hoydog]

I also am looking for a junkyard AW71 trans. becuase my AW70 with the accumulator mod behind my +T @ 10psi is just about done, it slips if i push the gas pedal more that 1/4 of the way. I have heard that it is a good idea to get a rebuild torque converter with a junkyard transmission? I have also heard from others that this is not necessiary. Does anyone have an answer to this? Do I have to get a rebuilt torque converter?

[Vee_Que]

Op. Aw71s were in 740 turbos and 760 gles with the v6. And you can change the bellhousing to fit. Where are you go aus?
Posted via Mobile Device

[linuxman51]

I also am looking for a junkyard AW71 trans. becuase my AW70 with the accumulator mod behind my +T @ 10psi is just about done, it slips if i push the gas pedal more that 1/4 of the way. I have heard that it is a good idea to get a rebuild torque converter with a junkyard transmission? I have also heard from others that this is not necessiary. Does anyone have an answer to this? Do I have to get a rebuilt torque converter?

get the converter that goes with the jy box and let it ride. try to find one with clean fluid and such.

[BDKR]

... unmodified, the 71 will not live long.


While I agree with you, I think it really depends on the condition of the unit in question. There were a couple of examples of cars that should have blown up their A-dub's but never did. I know I had a fund sitting aside for what I considered an eventuality, but it never came to pass. Now it's been modded and it's better then ever. Sure, the car at the time prolly never made more then 220 hp, but it had a hell of a lot of torque and was fun as hell.

Of course, I'm south of 300hp so we'll see what it does when I get a chance to run this turbo at the level I want.

[charles850t]

Yes, you read that correctly... from what has been shown, the "modded" aw71 can handle more abuse than either the m46 or the m47..... unmodified, the 71 will not live long.

Seeing as the getrag is not a stock volvo transmission, it was probably not included in this discussion, but yes, the getrag 265 (262) is fairly robust and will handle more of what you can throw at it than the aw71/m46/m47... but there's the small issue of the conversion.
Ok and the modification you speak about is this "accumulator mod".

What is it exactly?

and about the Getrag:
<hr style="color: rgb(51, 51, 51); background-color: rgb(51, 51, 51);" size="1"> <!-- / icon and title --> <!-- message --> By: Jon Glommen

Description: Ok, here it is; the easiest transmission swap in the world for 240/700 series. This is the kit you need to put a BMW 5-speed (Getrag) into a Volvo 240/700- series. Martin Volvo Service of Wales, UK (44 1570 434459) sells this kit for $550:

http://www.turbobricks.com/mods.php?content=art0009

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~
So which is better performance wise?
The auto AW71 or the manual Getrag?

[Forg]

Is an '84 B23ET 760 going to have an Aisin-Warner 'box?
Didn't Volvo change to the ZF's for 700-series cars, even turbos, for a while?

Vee_Que - you'll know this!

[740ATL]

Ok and the modification you speak about is this "accumulator mod".

What is it exactly?

and about the Getrag:
<hr style="color: rgb(51, 51, 51); background-color: rgb(51, 51, 51);" size="1"> <!-- / icon and title --> <!-- message --> By: Jon Glommen

Description: Ok, here it is; the easiest transmission swap in the world for 240/700 series. This is the kit you need to put a BMW 5-speed (Getrag) into a Volvo 240/700- series. Martin Volvo Service of Wales, UK (44 1570 434459) sells this kit for $550:

http://www.turbobricks.com/mods.php?content=art0009

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~
So which is better performance wise?
The auto AW71 or the manual Getrag?

The accumulator mod I'm going to let you find on your own.

As to which is better depends on what you want... too many variables... do you want the quick shifting dragstrip performance of an automatic, or do you like going through the twisties?

If I had very little money, I'd stick with the modded aw71 and deal with the fact that I'd really rather be shifting gears...

BTW... that getrag swap is going to cost you no less than $1000. Clutch, adapter plate, driveshaft, and oh yeah, transmission. (and by getrag, I'm referring to the 265).

If I wanted a strong manual transmission with better gear ratios, I'd look into something like the TKO 5-speed. (this is a whole can of worms...) The getrag is a strong transmission, but you really need something like a 3.31 rear gear to be happy with it.

Mike

[charles850t]

The accumulator mod I'm going to let you find on your own.

As to which is better depends on what you want... too many variables... do you want the quick shifting dragstrip performance of an automatic, or do you like going through the twisties?

If I had very little money, I'd stick with the modded aw71 and deal with the fact that I'd really rather be shifting gears...

BTW... that getrag swap is going to cost you no less than $1000. Clutch, adapter plate, driveshaft, and oh yeah, transmission. (and by getrag, I'm referring to the 265).

If I wanted a strong manual transmission with better gear ratios, I'd look into something like the TKO 5-speed. (this is a whole can of worms...) The getrag is a strong transmission, but you really need something like a 3.31 rear gear to be happy with it.

Mike

Ok, fair enough.

I like going through the twistys. I really don't care about straight line performance.

That's probably more than I am going to spend on the car.
Would it cost as much for, say, an M90?

Sounds like I'm just going to stick with the AW71 and put the largest oil cooler ever conceived on it.

[740ATL]

Ok, fair enough.

I like going through the twistys. I really don't care about straight line performance.

That's probably more than I am going to spend on the car.
Would it cost as much for, say, an M90?

Sounds like I'm just going to stick with the AW71 and put the largest oil cooler ever conceived on it.

If you can find a redblock M90, you'll probably pay as much to get the tranny here. Seems like a grand is the entry level for a stout manual transmission swap.

Stick with the aw71 and do the accumulator mod.

Mike

[charles850t]

Ok.

Thanks for your help.
...now to find out what the hell the accumulator mod is, where is that search button, ah there it is.

[740ATL]

Ok.

Thanks for your help.
...now to find out what the hell the accumulator mod is, where is that search button, ah there it is.

Here... I feel bad for ya... http://forums.turbobricks.com/showthread.php?t=108965

[charles850t]

Here... I feel bad for ya... http://forums.turbobricks.com/showthread.php?t=108965
Why thank you kind sir.

I have to go anyway, but I will look at that later.

:cheers:

[Harleyvolvo]

Is an '84 B23ET 760 going to have an Aisin-Warner 'box?
Didn't Volvo change to the ZF's for 700-series cars, even turbos, for a while?

Vee_Que - you'll know this!

The Gear Box was a M46. The only Volvo at wreckers here are 2x 1988 740 which have AW70's or ZF's (which apparently crap themselves if you rev them in neutral or smog test them. 1985,6,7 but who knows for Aust?....Both my 1981,2 B23E's had D cams, not K's)
Trying Sydney for a AW71 or else a Supra w55 conversion. Dellowautomotive want ~$1000 for the bell house etc and I'm yet to get there price for the box:omg:
I was also sus on the NA AW71 V's Turbo AW71's!
How could you tell them apart? They'd both have the same tag!
That Quote was from 700/900 FAQ's

[25psi]

The same rules of automatic transmissions apply to the AW71, run good quality fluid and be diligent about changing it, keep heat down (get a cooler), and make sure shifts are quick and firm to reduce heat even more and lessen the load on the clutches(accumulator mod).


Seems like people have pretty good luck with them when you keep these things in mind.

[charles850t]

The same rules of automatic transmissions apply to the AW71, run good quality fluid and be diligent about changing it, keep heat down (get a cooler), and make sure shifts are quick and firm to reduce heat even more and lessen the load on the clutches(accumulator mod).


Seems like people have pretty good luck with them when you keep these things in mind.
With all this information I cant want to get another 240. :cool:

[Harleyvolvo]

Finally tracked down a AW71 from a 1988 B230ET. $425 exchange or $525

Much easier then the $985 for conversion kit, $895 for recon Supra w58 plus $500 penalty for no exchange box. Then I'd still need to fab a cross member and mount plus tail shaft mod.

May still get the car rego'd in 2 weeks!

I was surprised that they still only used the radiator cooler for the Trans oil like the old B23E auto WB55's. I may still have to use that for a short period till I find somewhere to mount a Trans-cooler:-(
Not much room anywhere with the 31" IC and external oil cooler.

mine hasn't completely crapped it's self yet. But how many miles do you consider it "holding"
Last dyno run proclaimed 350/420 This aw71 can't last too long.

How sick is it now? (slipping ,making noises?)
How many miles did you put on it?
Didn't you run fairly high numbers on your M46?

[The Racing Volvo]

i found, that if you shift the trans manually, you get a little more pressure build up, and a firmer shift. i'm by know means savy when it comes the the exact happenings of internal function, but it apears to work. if you rebuild one, i know theres a couple of manufactures that make heavier clutch packs. Red Devil kevlar, i think is the name.

we used to joke about ZF in the shop. nick named 'em "Zero Function". they make a decent power streering rack though.

but, every body is pretty on the money. if you're not breaking planetaries, or busting cases, then it's torque convertors, and clutch packs. in addition to slipping packs, when you glide into gear, it's technically slipping at that time, therefore, heating up the clutches. the more power, the more slippage, the more heat. that's why increasing pressure at certain points on the trans will reduce the slipping, and give a firmer engaugement. i HAVE seen the splines shear off inside the torque convertors before, too.

[linuxman51]

Alto makes hi-po clutches and steels. red eagle, and kolene coated steels.
you do get a bit better flow with the transmission manually shifted, mainly because it restricts flow to various parts of the valve body, but it also sends fluid a couple of places that aren't needed for racing (engine braking in 2nd, for instance. it locks up a set of clutches that normally don't get locked up in 2nd gear)