auto vs manual showdown

[240 JAH]

I would like to see some well evenly matched cars go head to head one with an auto and one with a manual.

I would like to get an opponent with a pretty much stock 244 with a b230 n/a with a manual transmission to go head to head. Just want to see how the auto tranny in the 88 I got form my dad will do. it seems to pull hard and I have no complaints about it. but manual is more fun to me. just thought I would have fun with this though. Ive got a solid straight stretch of road we can use at an old industrial park. even video it.

anyone around my area up for it? and anyone else who wants to start there own shown down would be pretty cool to read about.

[DurableSwedish]

i'm up for it! oh, i'm in washington. :-P

[240 JAH]

i'm up for it! oh, i'm in washington. :-P

its seriously would be fun. find a partner up there and have at it. i want to see some results lol

[towerymt]

I've got a '90 244, M47, pretty much stock. I'll bring it to the next Richmond meet (had it down there once for Vince's meet). It feels quick for stock (it's LH3.1) but the rear bushings are not so good, so the launch would be questionable (better than auto, but nothing like my '87). I put poly torque rod bushings in it, but the large bushing on the axle on one side is so bad that it still throttle steers.

[DurableSwedish]

unfortunately the majority of volvo guys up here are VS guys...i think there are some TB'ers up near canada though.

[240 JAH]

I've got a '90 244, M47, pretty much stock. I'll bring it to the next Richmond meet (had it down there once for Vince's meet). It feels quick for stock (it's LH3.1) but the rear bushings are not so good, so the launch would be questionable (better than auto, but nothing like my '87). I put poly torque rod bushings in it, but the large bushing on the axle on one side is so bad that it still throttle steers.


sounds good, im down for it. im started to get sad about selling my wagon. but I gotta hold out. got any extra m47's man? i want to swap to manual

[Poik]

DurableSwedish, do you go to school in Pullman, or do you actually live there?

[towerymt]

got any extra m47's man? i want to swap to manual
I wish. Only have 2 that are in my cars. M46 in the garage is going in my '78. Might grab another M46 w/bad overdrive as a backup. I'd like to get a '90s M47 from the junkyard at some point, but if I'm going to pull a trans, it may as well be from a 635CSi/528e.

[volvorod85]

Been there done that, from a light with a buddy....

my 1984 240 B23F updated to LH 2.2 N/A M46 with 226,000 on the clock

And my friend with his 1990 240 LH 2.4, AW71 145,000 on the clock

my rear bumper was at his front bumper, and thats where it stayed, up to about 50 MPH, we backed off there. He couldnt pull nor could I. I got the jump cause of the stick, would have been better but I spun those awsome 14's near through 1st gear, till i ran outa torque (heh when the motor stopped pulling)

[240 JAH]

Been there done that, from a light with a buddy....

my 1984 240 B23F updated to LH 2.2 N/A M46 with 226,000 on the clock

And my friend with his 1990 240 LH 2.4, AW71 145,000 on the clock

my rear bumper was at his front bumper, and thats where it stayed, up to about 50 MPH, we backed off there. He couldnt pull nor could I. I got the jump cause of the stick, would have been better but I spun those awsome 14's near through 1st gear, till i ran outa torque (heh when the motor stopped pulling)


awesome. I know that my auto 88 was faster than my 84 with a m46. my dad and I did the whole race thing when the 88 was his and the 84 was mine. now the 84 is gone and the 88 is mine. Im trying to justify if a manual tranny would really do me that much better. the 88 auto pulls hard and I can still have fun with it. I dont really want to do much with the engine though. my performance car will be my 76 with a v8 that im going to be building up.

its just nifty to see the differences.

[Sp3aK]

With proper boosting off the line the auto can be a beast :) With my +T / AW71 combo I can get a good hard launch down.

[ZexPow245]

im down... when you tryin to do this, i want to change over from auto.

[towerymt]

Im trying to justify if a manual tranny would really do me that much better. the 88 auto pulls hard and I can still have fun with it.
The problem with your comparison is the aw70/3.73 will probably be close to m47/3.31 car. 3.31 gearing KILLS the acceleration, but of course it will still get off the line quicker (the 4.03:1 first gear accelerates well, but 2nd & 3rd gear go on forever).

But if you do a manual swap and keep the 3.73 rear end, it will get off the line quicker AND accelerate quicker. 2nd and 3rd gear will pull strong to redline instead of struggling to just reach 5000rpm.

I ran 17.4 with the 3.31/M47 combo (2.276 60ft)

I ran 16.7 & 16.9 with the 3.73lsd/M47 combo on bad launchs with broken motor mounts (2.22-2.23 60ft, so the gain was mostly the gearing, not the LSD).

I ran 16.5 on good launches with the 3.73lsd/M47 combo (2.1 60ft).

If you do a manual swap, throw in a decent cam, and run good 15" tires, it should crack the 16.999 barrier. Right now you're in the 18.3 range. Rob drove Sam's '90s 244 auto at SE4.0 and after several runs, could only muster an 18.3. Ben's wagon only did 19.1 with the airbox full of dog food...I think you can beat that. ;-)

[240 JAH]

The problem with your comparison is the aw70/3.73 will probably be close to m47/3.31 car. 3.31 gearing KILLS the acceleration, but of course it will still get off the line quicker (the 4.03:1 first gear accelerates well, but 2nd & 3rd gear go on forever).

But if you do a manual swap and keep the 3.73 rear end, it will get off the line quicker AND accelerate quicker. 2nd and 3rd gear will pull strong to redline instead of struggling to just reach 5000rpm.

I ran 17.4 with the 3.31/M47 combo (2.276 60ft)

I ran 16.7 & 16.9 with the 3.73lsd/M47 combo on bad launchs with broken motor mounts (2.22-2.23 60ft, so the gain was mostly the gearing, not the LSD).

I ran 16.5 on good launches with the 3.73lsd/M47 combo (2.1 60ft).

If you do a manual swap, throw in a decent cam, and run good 15" tires, it should crack the 16.999 barrier. Right now you're in the 18.3 range. Rob drove Sam's '90s 244 auto at SE4.0 and after several runs, could only muster an 18.3. Ben's wagon only did 19.1 with the airbox full of dog food...I think you can beat that. ;-)


I think i would like to take the car to the track before a manual swap gets some times then swap and check it out.

I have the dracos on it with some decent tires right now. new motor mounts are on it as well and I have a set of new HD bilstien rear shocks , I will be replacing the front struts with HD inserts. I have a B cam I can put in the car as well.

[towerymt]

I think i would like to take the car to the track before a manual swap gets some times then swap and check it out.
Good idea, but bring something else too, cause it's a waste of 10 bucks otherwise (actually 25 up here, assume it's cheaper down there).

I have the dracos on it with some decent tires right now.
The auto won't care. ;-) The shorter, the better (just for the gearing).

[mikep]

hmmm...this looks like a street racing thread, but plow's here...better look the other way..

[towerymt]

hmmm...this looks like a street racing thread, but plow's here...better look the other way..
walking that fine line of acceleration testing within legal limits on two very slow cars.

I already know the results, backed up by times at the track. ;-)