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-   -   1983 242 Turbo LH 2.2 Swap Question (https://forums.tbforums.com/showthread.php?t=338161)

FTY 12-06-2017 09:01 PM

1983 242 Turbo LH 2.2 Swap Question
 
Pics of my car for attention
Looking for someone to point me in the right direction, trying to troubleshoot. My 242 gets a hick up while at idle or driving. The AFR gauge reads steady 14ish at idle then all of a sudden it gets a burst of fuel and reads 9-10 rich for a second and catches itself. This happens at idle, even while driving intermittently.

I don't see an idle control valve
I don't see a coolant temperature sensor

Could it be a bad MAF or O2 sensor?
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c3...psvgidof5f.jpg

http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c3...psam9ezqki.jpg

dl242gt 12-06-2017 10:03 PM

Have you put a meter on the o2 sensor and watched the voltage at warmed up idle? Your description of the o2 operation just doesn't sound correct. The signal should bounce around the 14.7 at fully warmed up idle. It should be constantly hunting or oscillating as the controller adds fuel then removes fuel to keep the mixture corrected. A sensor giving just a steady signal at warmed up idle is bad. There is also a test lead wire for LH2.2 dwell. I think it was a red wire on the inside left fender.

Where is the o2 sensor located in your setup and is it heated or single wire?

dl242gt 12-06-2017 10:04 PM

The car looks great!:volvo:

Hotdoggin 12-06-2017 11:09 PM

Man, I need GTAs. What adapters did you buy?

sbabbs 12-07-2017 12:24 AM

Did you swap to EZK ignition also?

You don't see a temp sensor??? Wut the fluck does that mean? Hey your ECU needs to see one...

BillyMaysHere 12-07-2017 01:14 AM

http://www.volvotips.com/service-man...81-part-1.html

BillyMaysHere 12-07-2017 01:16 AM

http://www.vlvworld.com/VolvoRepairM...ck_sensors.jpg

FTY 12-07-2017 10:46 AM

Thanks for the feedback fellas
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dl242gt (Post 5716143)
Have you put a meter on the o2 sensor and watched the voltage at warmed up idle? Your description of the o2 operation just doesn't sound correct. The signal should bounce around the 14.7 at fully warmed up idle. It should be constantly hunting or oscillating as the controller adds fuel then removes fuel to keep the mixture corrected. A sensor giving just a steady signal at warmed up idle is bad. There is also a test lead wire for LH2.2 dwell. I think it was a red wire on the inside left fender.

Where is the o2 sensor located in your setup and is it heated or single wire?
The car looks great!:volvo:

Thanks! It looks good on the road but its running crappy right now.
The o2 is working just as you describe. 14ish was my way of explaining the bounce.
The current o2 is a three wire unit and is mounted just after the turbo at the downpipe.
The test lead wire would apply to my LH2.2 swap? Previous owner did the swap. What does dwell mean?
Location of the o2
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c3...psnfyb0tv3.jpg

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hotdoggin (Post 5716164)
Man, I need GTAs. What adapters did you buy?

I had custom adapters made. Took a lot of fab and cutting to make them work.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sbabbs (Post 5716183)
Did you swap to EZK ignition also?

You don't see a temp sensor??? Wut the fluck does that mean? Hey your ECU needs to see one...

Sbabbs- No EZK ignition. using the breakerless. I have to look closer to find the coolant temp sensor. That might be my problem....the coolant gauge on the dash is not working either.
The picture Billymayshere posted should help me find it. Would the Kjet motor have the two sensors in the same location as described in the photo?

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMaysHere (Post 5716198)

Thanks for the links to the manuals
this is a huge help.

FTY 12-09-2017 05:44 PM

Been searching and reading up on Dwell

dl242gt 12-09-2017 06:02 PM

I thought LH2.2 had that test lead there.

Ok not to be confused with checking ignition dwell. Bosch setup Kjet with lambda and LH2.2 with a red test lead on the inner left fender. You can use a dwell meter to read the duty cycle of the controller and o2 sensor. It is actually a dwell meter for ignition testing but is being used instead for this lambda testing. Unless I am mistaken LH2.2 had this as well as the lambda kjet.

FTY 12-09-2017 06:18 PM

What does the test lead look like?

dl242gt 12-09-2017 06:19 PM

On the cars I've worked on it was a red wire with a plastic housing around a single male flat connector. I will check the Bentley manual and post back.

Edit. I am mistaken. The test lead seems to be only kjet lambda. But you can always check an o2 sensor with a voltmeter as well. Sorry bout that.

BillyMaysHere 12-09-2017 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dl242gt (Post 5717462)
On the cars I've worked on it was a red wire with a plastic housing around a single male flat connector. I will check the Bentley manual and post back.

Edit. I am mistaken. The test lead seems to be only kjet lambda. But you can always check an o2 sensor with a voltmeter as well. Sorry bout that.

i thnk it does have one, red with white stripe?

FTY 12-12-2017 10:21 PM

Still trying to figure this out.
http://www.vlvworld.com/VolvoRepairM...ck_sensors.jpg
The above picture is the K-Jet Gauge and ECU sensor.
Because of the swap the pictured sensors are not connected.
Does the breakerless ignition system still need it?

The LH swap harness is connected to a LH Coolant temperature sensor closer to the firewall.
The car is running worse now. My wideband is showing dangerously rich. bouncing between 9 and 10 at idle.
Can't figure this out.

Could the problem be ignition related?
my distributor has a vacuum line and a electrical cable...this is breakerless right?

BillyMaysHere 12-12-2017 10:24 PM

provide pics

FTY 12-12-2017 10:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BillyMaysHere (Post 5718834)
provide pics

OK working on pics.

FTY 12-12-2017 11:03 PM

http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c3...psizgcdy1y.jpg
Above is the LH Temp sensor connected and a signal prong connector located closer to the firewall but still under the intake manifold. I attached a loose yellow wire to that signal prong connector assuming it was my dash cluster temp sensor. Still no reading at the dash.

http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c3...ps5zweiyf8.jpg
K Jet dash temp sensor not connected

http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c3...psnk4bboso.jpg
K Jet ignition and Fuel Temp sensor not connected.
you can see the LH sensor to the far right connected...

FTY 12-17-2017 08:22 PM

With the amm plugged in, I get a rhythmic surging idle. With it plugged out, Steady idle.
Pig rich both plugged or unplugged.

dl242gt 12-17-2017 08:50 PM

the dash gauge uses the yellow wire and goes to the same sensor and location as the kjet gauge. The single pole sensor under the first to second runner area on the intake manifold. the electronic injection usually uses a location a bit further back with it's sensor. The breakerless bosch ignition does not use any temp sensing. The Constant Idle System of the kjet setup uses a temp sensor at the back of the block on the driver side. The single pole sensor in that same area is the cold engine cutout switch and nothing should be connected to that now.

FTY 12-17-2017 11:17 PM

That explains a lot thank you dl242gt

why does the car run better with the amm unplugged? is it bad?

Baileyswhite 12-19-2017 05:22 AM

I’ve got an ‘83 244 Turbo running LH2.2/breakerless. When I first bought it I had a very similar rhythmic surging at idle. I ended up doing a few things before I got it to smooth out, and to be entirely honest it still surges ever so slightly now, all tuned up.

(in no particular order)

-Make sure timing is dead on, 12 degrees (within two degrees of 12 for emissions)

-Make sure vacuum advance/boost retard distributor is working correctly, without any check valves or anything in the vacuum line between the manifold and the distributor. (Previous owner installed one-way check valve on this line on my car unbeknownst to me, causing the distributor to hold full advance always, resulting in detonation in boost)

-Make sure your fuel injectors are matched with your ECU/MAF combo. If the injectors you’re using are stock (for the ECU anyway)—you’re good. If you’re running bigger, higher flowing injectors you’ll need to add the appropriate sized resistor to the MAF>ECU signal wire to match your injectors so your ECU can function properly (remember—LH2.2 doesn’t do long term fuel trim, bigger injectors are outside of LH2.2’s adjusting ability). I don’t remember the threads I used to gather the info, but it is all on here. Check for threads about upgrading injectors on LH2.2.

-Make sure you have ZERO vacuum leaks. I’ve consistently had issues with my K-Jet injector plugs leaking (can’t source o-ring with strange dimesnsions of plug?). I ended up using an “okay” o-ring with a big gob of silicone all around. This has been the most effective method yet in sealing the old injector holes.

From there, set your timing, idle speed and base mixture by the Volvo procedure (a procedure very well documented on the 700/900 faq website, Google it). You’ll need a short jumper wire to set the idle correctly. Monitoring your O2 Sensor voltage during this will be helpful.

Mine ended up passing smog cleaner than any of my other Volvos, so it can be fixed.

Here’s mine: https://i.imgur.com/wAKrTZx.jpg

photoman327 12-19-2017 07:30 AM

Watching

FTY 12-28-2017 07:48 PM

Just an update.
Many thank yous to Baileyswhite!
Found a couple of vacuum leaks at the old fuel injectors. Took some ingenuity to find the right fit o-rings.
Still ran Pig rich. Tried to adjust the AMM and realized it sh*t the bed. The screw had no adjustment. Popped the cover and saw that the knob inside was broken.
Got a good used 006 AMM and adapted it to fit. Now Ethiopian Lean.
Should I try a 007?
My AFR Gauge shows idle is bouncing steady around 14ish sometimes in 15.
Problem is when I hit throttle or go into boost it gets scary lean. 15-17ish
So frustrating

DET17 12-29-2017 07:56 AM

While I'm certain you can "find your way" with LH2.2, consider an elegant alternative.... MegaSquirt MS2.

With LH2.2, you WILL be fighting all the "sins of the past", and whomever resto-modded your nice black 242. My son converted his 81 244 from CIS Kjet to MS; built his harness on a Saturday and fired it up that night! This after he went thru multiple LH2.2 ECUs, EZKs, harness tweaks, sensors, et al. Buy an appropriate copy of Tuner Studio, and you are on your way.

Of course, if you prevail, you will master all the previous sins and LH2.2..... and if it runs well, you won't be able to change fueling (much) if your thirst for power grows. Hence the beauty of MS.... it can change and grow as your vehicle does. LH2.2, well, not so much.

For my money, and ONE LEARNING CURVE, the MS way is the righteous way........ you decide, grasshopper!

FTY 12-30-2017 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DET17 (Post 5725886)
While I'm certain you can "find your way" with LH2.2, consider an elegant alternative.... MegaSquirt MS2.

With LH2.2, you WILL be fighting all the "sins of the past", and whomever resto-modded your nice black 242. My son converted his 81 244 from CIS Kjet to MS; built his harness on a Saturday and fired it up that night! This after he went thru multiple LH2.2 ECUs, EZKs, harness tweaks, sensors, et al. Buy an appropriate copy of Tuner Studio, and you are on your way.

Of course, if you prevail, you will master all the previous sins and LH2.2..... and if it runs well, you won't be able to change fueling (much) if your thirst for power grows. Hence the beauty of MS.... it can change and grow as your vehicle does. LH2.2, well, not so much.

For my money, and ONE LEARNING CURVE, the MS way is the righteous way........ you decide, grasshopper!


Thank you so much. Buying a MegaSquirt now. RIP K-Jet swapped LH2.2


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