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Terrible wheel hop, can't lose it

Fretka

Fretka

New member
Joined
Dec 22, 2013
Hello, guys!

Sorry for making a new thread if this is discussed somewhere already (it must be), but I couldn't find it.
I've experienced pretty terrible wheel hop then and now lately. Weird thing is that I didn't have it before for a long time with same setup. I thought it's my rear shocks that were worn. Changed those but still everything is the same.
Probably it's useful to mention that rear shocks are from way different car, much stiffer and almost twice shorter because of how low the car is to achieve better shock absorber travel.
Springs are from different car aswell - shorter and stiffer than original ones.

All the diff and axle bushing look fine for me, except one that is in lower end of panhard bar. Could that be the case? Somehow don't want to believe it.

One more thing that makes me think is that panhard bar is not shorter or adjustable, so the axle is in offset because of lowering. Could that be the case?

Anyways, thanks for any suggestions. Have been reading about wheel hop that it can be caused by A LOT of things. I know that I need to make everything on poly bushings all around sooner or later because of drifting, but haven't had time to do it yet.

Lastly - wheel hop appears pretty randomly. Mostly it's when you are loosing grips on straight line, more rarely when going sideways, but it still appears sometimes. Then I just let it go, kick the clutch again and it has disappeared.

Think that's about it.
 
Sorry!

'91 944, dead 1041 axle, B200FT turbo-back 70mm pipe, 16t turbo, 0,8bar boost, welded diff
I would say that car is lowered about 120mm by original height, so rear axle is offset really badly.
 
Fretka said:
Sorry!

'91 944, dead 1041 axle, B200FT turbo-back 70mm pipe, 16t turbo, 0,8bar boost, welded diff
I would say that car is lowered about 120mm by original height, so rear axle is offset really badly.
Click to expand...

120mm is like a 5 inches drop and you wonder why you have some wheel hop? :omg:
 
Poly is NOT the answer. It doesn't have enough give when the axle articulates. It just puts stress on your mounts. I've been slowly changing all my bushings out for heim joints. I recently swapped out my stock torque rods with a custom set with heim joints at both ends. They have a little more vibration through the chassis. But they have gotten rid of any wheel hop.

My plans so far are to go with dual heim joints on the torque rods. Poly bushings on the lower control arms (main axle bushings) and a custom heim joints from frame to front of lower control arms. I feel this will keep the axle planted in place, but allow for up and down "flex" of the suspension. I've read that the main axle bushings can cause lots of wheel hop when worn out. That might be the first place to look
 
I got terrible wheel hop in my car with an ez locker installed, put in a g80 and it went away...I'd bet its a combo of the welded diff and panhard being out of adjustment if car is that low with a stock bar
 
Back in the day I picked up a new set of tires and on the drive home I had horrible wheel hop when I got on it. Turned out the tire shop overfilled the tires with to much pressure.

Check the tire pressure it might just be to high. Keep it Simple to start.
 
Are your shocks attached at both ends? Have you shucked a weight on your wheel(s)? Has one of your tires separated a belt internally?

I've had all of the above contribute to come and go wheel hopping while driving under normal circumstances, at different times, with different cars...
 
It sounds to me like the entire setup is bad.

Geometry is bad.
Diff is welded.
No up travel, all droop.
Unknown dampeners.
Unknown spring rates.

It's like world class companies hire engineers to design these cars and their suspension so this kind of thing doesn't happen.
 
Thanks for answers. I hear what you are saying, I think first thing is to get my rear axle straight by installing adjustable panhard bar.
I don't see how welded diff would affect this since LSD works the same way while doing skids.
There is up travel, shock absorber travel is how it's ment to be, just way shorter and more stiffer then original.
 
Fretka said:
Thanks for answers. I hear what you are saying, I think first thing is to get my rear axle straight by installing adjustable panhard bar.
I don't see how welded diff would affect this since LSD works the same way while doing skids.
There is up travel, shock absorber travel is how it's ment to be, just way shorter and more stiffer then original.
Click to expand...

Well clearly you know all of the answers. Glad you asked us for advice.
 
Fretka said:
Thanks for answers. I hear what you are saying, I think first thing is to get my rear axle straight by installing adjustable panhard bar.
Click to expand...
That is one thing....I'm not sure how you prioritize what you've got going one here...

Fretka said:
I don't see how welded diff would affect this since LSD works the same way while doing skids.
Click to expand...
You don't??? Ok...


...Seriously???

Fretka said:
There is up travel, shock absorber travel is how it's ment to be,
Click to expand...
If this ^^^
Fretka said:
just way shorter and more stiffer then original.
Click to expand...
Then not this^^^

Get some properly valved dampers, with proper springs. I had a 940 SE (IRS) with stock replacement, but still rubber bushings, and my wheel hop went away with proper dampers and springs from BNE. And the IRS cars are more suseptible to wheelhop than the solid axle cars. But....I wasn't dragging my cross-member either.
 
Fretka said:
Thanks for answers. I hear what you are saying, I think first thing is to get my rear axle straight by installing adjustable panhard bar.
I don't see how welded diff would affect this since LSD works the same way while doing skids.
There is up travel, shock absorber travel is how it's ment to be, just way shorter and more stiffer then original.
Click to expand...

You also haven't mentioned if you have adjustable torque rods either, if you slammed this car without fixing the pinion angle, you might be mistaking some of the wheel hop with driveline noise.
 
doucheNozzle said:
Well clearly you know all of the answers. Glad you asked us for advice.
Click to expand...

Funny how everyone responds to my questions in Turbobricks every single time. Of course - slamming car is stupid, drifting is for kids, doing custom parts is stupid aswell.

Just in case someone is still interested in some answers or any kind of continuing about this, here it is:

Mogly said:
Sounds like you have two different size tires.
Click to expand...

Tyres are all around 215/40/17, running about 2,1bar all around. Now tell me that the tyres are too low aswell :-)

runslikeapenguin said:
You also haven't mentioned if you have adjustable torque rods either, if you slammed this car without fixing the pinion angle, you might be mistaking some of the wheel hop with driveline noise.
Click to expand...

I know about the driveline noise, most of it is felt on 2nd gear.


  • And seriously, I know when car loses grip and when it doesn't. Those are two different things.
    Wheel hop differs when drifting on wet and dry aswell, to be mentioned.

  • Wheel hop appeared only this year and nothing was changed in setup. Everything worked perfectly at the start - custom springs, custom shocks - everything. Yes, I know that it's hard to believe, but it actually worked and there was no wheel hop. How do I know? Because I wheel spinned the **** out of those tyres for past and this season.

Benjam83 said:
You don't??? Ok...


...Seriously???
Click to expand...

No, seriously. I don't see how wheel hop should appear when pushing full throttle going sideways or on transactions, since LSD locks both wheels 100% when on throttle. I'm open to your explanation and waiting for it.

Guess it's important to mention that wheel hop itself is generally called when your wheels jump up and down when loosing traction. I'm not talking about wheels hopping when I'm parking my car or turning in small radius, that's not a wheel hop technically (if not technically, then I'm not talking about it in this thread).

I've done many cars with welded diffs, custom spring, shock absorber setups and it hasn't been so terrible like this. Allthough none of those cars had dead axle.
 
Fretka said:
Funny how everyone responds to my questions in Turbobricks every single time. Of course - slamming car is stupid, drifting is for kids, doing custom parts is stupid aswell.

I've done many cars with welded diffs, custom spring, shock absorber setups and it hasn't been so terrible like this. Allthough none of those cars had dead axle.
Click to expand...

You sort of just answered your own question.
 
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