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240 M47 Transmission Fluid Choices

what i've been told, m46 and m47 aren't the same. m46 needs something a little different for the overdrive. m47 can prolly take just about anything, but i run redline mtl

i think i'm running 10w30 in my m46(or whatever kenny suggested in and old old thread)
 
what i've been told, m46 and m47 aren't the same. m46 needs something a little different for the overdrive. m47 can prolly take just about anything, but i run redline mtl
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M46 greenbook & M47 greenbook lists same ATF type F or G and the same p/n for the "complaint oil" for 240s and 740s, but unsure if it's the oil vvpete is referring to.
 
It could be, sure looks like the genuine thing, and the early p/n would be for the M47, both p/n are avail on Tasca.

I've never see a jug of it before, I may get 2 qts and try it (my MTL has 65k miles on it and it is nearly black.)

And those naysayers who doubted!:cool:

FYI, digging a little further, the 'good oil' may have been intoduced around '88 or later when the M47 was improved. I think the manual calling for ATF was for the earlier M47, same for the M46 II as ther were several generations.
 
Interesting - I am going to grab 2 quarts as well, to toss in when I attempt to replace the M47 gaskets in a week or two...
 
mtd240 said:
Is this the OEM Volvo fluid? I can't find the part number to save my life..

http://www.vivaperformance.com/genuine-volvo-manual-transmission-fluid/

Just $13 on Tasca :-P
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I doubt this is compatible with an M4x transmission despite what they claim. The label indicates it's a 75w90 GL-4 gear oil which is way to heavy for the M4x transmissions??

FWIW I'll throw in my .02 for Amsoil SuperShift Transmission Fluid https://www.amsoil.com/storefront/art.aspx, it's fully synthetic in the proper Type F ATF specification that Volvo calls for unlike the Redline MTL. I have it in my 90 240 and it shifts great, I have no idea what was in there but it looked liked mud when I drained it and the shifting improved after. I also have a hard time with the "filled for life" BS that Volvo preaches, sounds like a good way to keep the stealership bays full...
 
I also have a hard time with the "filled for life" BS that Volvo preaches, sounds like a good way to keep the stealership bays full...
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So do I. As gears & brgs break in and then wear, the oil should be changed periodically to remove the wear particles. This regardless of what type oil is used, dino or syn. Just my opinion from years of experience.
 
smokeyfan1000 said:
So do I. As gears & brgs break in and then wear, the oil should be Filtered periodically to remove the wear particles. This regardless of what type oil is used, dino or syn. Just my opinion from years of experience.
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Fixed

Well, neither of you guys have had exeprienced using extremely high vapor pressure synthetic oils in high vacuum pumps used for toxic chemical processing enviorments that have service life that makes these redblocks seem like sewing machines.
I've spent 35 yrs doing so, and across the board the industry won't throw it away, they filter it and put it back in. The very inert synthetic fluid (Trade name Fomblin, E.I. DuPont) simply won't break down in the harshest chemical environments. It's upwards of $200/LB (1 pint = approx 1 lb).

Now that's the best of the best stuff. In all the M47's I've opened up none had red ATF fluid ( I can count at least 6 M47's) and I believe Volvo has used such a fluid in their M47 (hell they actually use the claim as a marketing pitch, something you cannot just BS the whole world about), and would not necessarilly find it in the M46.

You out there, stop comparing the M46 to the M47. There is no common M4x.They are so differrent they should not be in this discussion.
An M46 having a hydraulic fluid coupling overdrive needs the ATF properties as the temp, valving, and presssures dictate very different oil environment than a manual trans.
The M47 having a 5th gear will benefit from an oil that maintains viscosity but has stiction to surfaces at normal temperatures and pressures. Since the 5th gear output is high on the case of the M47 an oil that has higher viscosity and stays on the gears and bearings are better. These areas only get fresh oil at higher rpm's. Good to overfill.

And the comment about 75w Gear oil too thick, that is nearly a watery viscosity when warm, just like the fluids that came out, that is, the OEM fluid, not ATF. M46 should use an ATF Type F

Edit:
Looking at the pic of Angle Gear oil, it has the Volvo logo on it, but the pic of the Manual Trans oil is blocked out. I think this may not be Volvo, I'll wait to see a bottle from a dealer.
And their suggesting that it's the same for all cars up to P2 cars. I don't accept that. Maybe owners of 850/S/V cars cam chime in.
 
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vvpete said:
Fixed

Well, neither of you guys have had exeprienced using extremely high vapor pressure synthetic oils in high vacuum pumps used for toxic chemical processing enviorments that have service life that makes these redblocks seem like sewing machines.
I've spent 35 yrs doing so, and across the board the industry won't throw it away, they filter it and put it back in. The very inert synthetic fluid (Trade name Fomblin, E.I. DuPont) simply won't break down in the harshest chemical environments. It's upwards of $200/LB (1 pint = approx 1 lb).

Now that's the best of the best stuff. In all the M47's I've opened up none had red ATF fluid ( I can count at least 6 M47's) and I believe Volvo has used such a fluid in their M47 (hell they actually use the claim as a marketing pitch, something you cannot just BS the whole world about), and would not necessarilly find it in the M46.

You out there, stop comparing the M46 to the M47. There is no common M4x.They are so differrent they should not be in this discussion.
An M46 having a hydraulic fluid coupling overdrive needs the ATF properties as the temp, valving, and presssures dictate very different oil environment than a manual trans.
The M47 having a 5th gear will benefit from an oil that maintains viscosity but has stiction to surfaces at normal temperatures and pressures. Since the 5th gear output is high on the case of the M47 an oil that has higher viscosity and stays on the gears and bearings are better. These areas only get fresh oil at higher rpm's. Good to overfill.

And the comment about 75w Gear oil too thick, that is nearly a watery viscosity when warm, just like the fluids that came out, that is, the OEM fluid, not ATF. M46 should use an ATF Type F

Edit:
Looking at the pic of Angle Gear oil, it has the Volvo logo on it, but the pic of the Manual Trans oil is blocked out. I think this may not be Volvo, I'll wait to see a bottle from a dealer.
And their suggesting that it's the same for all cars up to P2 cars. I don't accept that. Maybe owners of 850/S/V cars cam chime in.
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Sorry, vvpete,I've never seen an M47 with an oil filter .;-) Those metal shavings/paticles need to come out , and changing the trans oil is the only way on our Volvos.

Therefore, IMO, an M47 trans will benefit from changing it's oil periodically.

I'm using Royal Purple Synchro Max trans syn oil in mine. It is working well in mine.

But I'm using it because when I changed it I couldn't find the OEM Volvo M47 trans oil readily, for a good price. I'm running @ 2.2-2.5 qts in my M47. This required jacking the front of the car up pretty high to be able to pour it all in .

And I agree that the OEM M47 Syn oil is best to use if one can get it,in an M47, & using ATF type F in a M46 is probably best especially for the $ spent, (due to hydraulic operation of the Laycock OD unit)and they also benefit from frequent ATF type F trans oil changes as well. But many are doing well with Redline syn in M46s it seems.

And while we're at it, changing the diff oil periodically is a damn good idea too. I'm using Royal Purple diff oil at the moment too.
 
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vvpete: When are you going to pick up the trans fluid? I already have a tasca order, so I may just add it to what I have. The part number can't be a fake, if I order it directly from Volvo :-P Just want to make sure I'm not dumping something into my M47 that I shouldn't be..

Also, I believe I found the "original" part number, on volvoforums.com: 1161324. It was superceded by 1161645.



Edit: Found a thread that mentions someone using the fluid. It's real! I guess I will give it a go
 
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smokeyfan1000 said:
Sorry, vvpete,I've never seen an M47 with an oil filter .;-) Those metal shavings/paticles need to come out , and changing the trans oil is the only way on our Volvos.

Therefore, IMO, an M47 trans will benefit from changing it's oil periodically.

I'm using Royal Purple Synchro Max trans syn oil in mine. It is working well in mine.

But I'm using it because when I changed it I couldn't find the OEM Volvo M47 trans oil readily, for a good price. I'm running @ 2.2-2.5 qts in my M47. This required jacking the front of the car up pretty high to be able to pour it all in .

And I agree that the OEM M47 Syn oil is best to use if one can get it,in an M47, & using ATF type F in a M46 is probably best especially for the $ spent, (due to hydraulic operation of the Laycock OD unit)and they also benefit from frequent ATF type F trans oil changes as well. But many are doing well with Redline syn in M46s it seems.

And while we're at it, changing the diff oil periodically is a damn good idea too. I'm using Royal Purple diff oil at the moment too.
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The first time I busted my knuckles trying to get out the 'Made for Life" drain plug I mangled it so had to get a new one from the dealer. The only kind they stock are the magnetic type, expensive but they work.
The first time I had an M47 car I took it to a shop in San Jose for work and asked them to change the trans fluid. I begged them to do it, said It didn't need changing, and even came in with Redline MTL (that was back in 1995) and they gave me the story/scoop on the 'super duper syn fluid' and told me they always filter it and put it back in. He drained it, showed me the diffeerence and I was convinced. They used a simple painters funnel filter and it came clean and clear (was actually nearly particle free and clear anyway at 185k miles on the '89 245).
Thats how you do it.
 
The first time I busted my knuckles trying to get out the 'Made for Life" drain plug I mangled it so had to get a new one from the dealer. The only kind they stock are the magnetic type, expensive but they work.
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The magnetic dran plug helps, but won't catch it all. Much better than without a mag. plug though.

The first time I had an M47 car I took it to a shop in San Jose for work and asked them to change the trans fluid. I begged them to do it, said It didn't need changing, and even came in with Redline MTL (that was back in 1995) and they gave me the story/scoop on the 'super duper syn fluid' and told me they always filter it and put it back in. He drained it, showed me the diffeerence and I was convinced. They used a simple painters funnel filter and it came clean and clear (was actually nearly particle free and clear anyway at 185k miles on the '89 245).
Thats how you do it.
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Sounds OK, but I'd prefer to just change it & add new fluid. Either way is better than never changing/filtering it.
 
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vvpete said:
The first M47 I had I drained the trans fluid at 200k miles and thought as many say it would be plain-Jane ATF Type F but it was not, it was a clear colorless very thin fluid. I went to the local Volvo dealer and inquired about it and got this story.

Don't change it, we never do unless the trans leaks it out. In 17 years we've never change one M47. The fluid that Volvo puts in is a lifetime synthetic oil, that is put in at the factory after a break-in period (never mind the owners manual). Then the service manager went to the back got a small blue book with listings of specifications, and pointed to a line that gave the MIL-Spec numbers something like MIL-1927 from memory so don't quote me on that. He looked up the part number and said it was $22/quart and special order. I didn't heed his advice, drained it and put in MTL. BTW the plug is sealed at the facory, and if you find the plug easilly removed, and it has red oil in it someone has already drained the orig oil and replaced it. Now this was in 1999.
Fast forward to 2006 and my current '91 245. Same story, same clear fluid, 225k mi, same trip to the same dealer (I was prepared to spend $22/qt), and same service mgr said it was now $109/qt!

Anyway the orig oil is very good stuff, and if you decide to change it to another synthetic, go for it, as I did twice, but in hindsight, would have left it alone.
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Started a FYI thread because I could not find this one on my Phone. The part number is 1161 645-5 For the Volvo Fluid and list for $22.91 per Lit. Still a special order. Got some ordered so we will see if it come in next week.
 
I ordered some from tasca on Tuesday - will post when It arrives. $13.95 / quart. It is the same fluid use in the 850 manual transmissions
 
mtd240 said:
I ordered some from tasca on Tuesday - will post when It arrives. $13.95 / quart. It is the same fluid use in the 850 manual transmissions
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I saw the part number after I post and thanks I paid $17.18 and will have to go back to Huntsville to pick it up. Guess I should have checked a little farther.
 
Got the fluid in yesterday!! Let the pictures speak for themselves - will be putting it in next weekend.

30lf0n8.jpg



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Why would your fuel economy change? Change in frictional constant!?!? :lol:

More likely, you will imagine an improvement in mpg because you think you've found the holy m47 grail!
 
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