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Qwkswede's 1992 244 daily driver. Back to my rolling roots.

qwkswede said:
I haven't been able to confirm that. Did these turbos ever come on Volvos with a .63? I assume it is a .48.



Anyone know their Volvo turbos from this angle?

IMAGE_1122.jpeg
Click to expand...

Just by eyeballing it looks like a .48. I'll take a pic of my .63 for you to compare while I'm at lunch. Definitely slow-spooling. My engine sees max boost at that RPM but that's with less compression, a smaller engine, and a bigger turbine housing on an inferior EMS. You are way up in the thin air though.

Can you do a leakdown test? Maybe your rings are fried :e-shrug:
 
Any chance of a clogged intercooler? Can you measure charge air temp and is it nice and low?

Just trying to think of things nobody's mentioned yet.
 
I know they are way different Chris...glad they are as well. Even my brothers 242t with a custom t3 from turbo power with a 60-trim has full boost pretty quick though,
 
qwkswede said:
Full boost at 3600 rpm. . .
This is a 2nd gear pull where boost has a time to build. If I open the throttle in 1st gear, I don't hit full boost until I'm into 2nd gear. Does this seem weak to anyone else?

<a href="https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/1jI-P-zKqtU97rQ3I4X0h9MTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=embedwebsite"><img src="https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-_rstLc7iPRc/VQG2hPWdutI/AAAAAAAAJqI/WUSsscbAzRw/s640/slowboost.png" height="369" width="640" /></a>
Click to expand...

Very weak.. I've had 50 trim turbos with stage 3 turbine wheels in .63 housing make 16+ before second gear. Maybe the turbo has some damage? Jacked up turbin wheel? something binding in the wastegate linkage or a cracked turbine housing holding the wastegate open?

-Sam
 
I will do some more looking at turbo related stuff next. Maybe more preload on the WG rod is in order. I am using a G valve boost controller. The turbo makes about 6-8 psi without.

It has been a while since I sold my old 740 sedan DD. But it had a t3/t04e 60 trim. I remember it building boost way faster too. I actually have a china made "50 trim" on the shelf I thought about using. It needs bearings now, but it spooled faster too. I originally was thinking it would be too much for an automatic car with low stall speed. But if this turbo is knackered, maybe I'll give it a try.

- Intake air temperature isn't shown here but I can pull it out of the datalogs. I haven't looked at it during boost much yet. The GM open element sensors are not typically very fast to respond. So a 3 second long pull isn't really enough to get an accurate temp measurement. They drift up and down as the intercooler heat soaks and cools, but its not really an instant measurement of the air coming into the intake. They lag behind the temp changes quite a bit. I used to think you could tune using that as an input and adjust timing with hotter high boost charge temps, but when you start looking at the sensor output in the datalogs, you realize it just isn't responding fast enough.

I have driven these cars enough to know that it should lay some rubber when the boost hits in 1st gear. And it doesn't do that :-(.

Thanks for the ideas gents. Its good to have the community to bounce ideas off of.
 
I fixed the VR sensor input on my new Microsquirt unit this weekend. Now the engine will rev past 4800 and I can start to concentrate on the tune and lack of performance again.

I also installed the summer wheels. Which probably means we will have a blizzard in the next week. I got some pictures of the car with the new coilover stance and Eikers. I do think the front needs to be lowered 1/2" more.

<a href="https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/6_Y65jNrpxJKkDoA1SfXWdMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=embedwebsite"><img src="https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-ZB5ocdZP07s/VQZ1h_TrOjI/AAAAAAAAJrY/J-LmfK4GFWY/s400/DSC03975.JPG" height="268" width="400" /></a>
<a href="https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/8nVMGYE3K4NjXEKLZrLMfNMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=embedwebsite"><img src="https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-xCjzUYEdwGk/VQZ1jEOOOhI/AAAAAAAAJro/PdY9D83a0_M/s400/DSC03976.JPG" height="268" width="400" /></a>
 
qwkswede said:
I will do some more looking at turbo related stuff next. Maybe more preload on the WG rod is in order. I am using a G valve boost controller. The turbo makes about 6-8 psi without.

It has been a while since I sold my old 740 sedan DD. But it had a t3/t04e 60 trim. I remember it building boost way faster too. I actually have a china made "50 trim" on the shelf I thought about using. It needs bearings now, but it spooled faster too. I originally was thinking it would be too much for an automatic car with low stall speed. But if this turbo is knackered, maybe I'll give it a try.

- Intake air temperature isn't shown here but I can pull it out of the datalogs. I haven't looked at it during boost much yet. The GM open element sensors are not typically very fast to respond. So a 3 second long pull isn't really enough to get an accurate temp measurement. They drift up and down as the intercooler heat soaks and cools, but its not really an instant measurement of the air coming into the intake. They lag behind the temp changes quite a bit. I used to think you could tune using that as an input and adjust timing with hotter high boost charge temps, but when you start looking at the sensor output in the datalogs, you realize it just isn't responding fast enough.

I have driven these cars enough to know that it should lay some rubber when the boost hits in 1st gear. And it doesn't do that :-(.

Thanks for the ideas gents. Its good to have the community to bounce ideas off of.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't say your old 740 spools fast, but it seemed to make 15psi in first gear without any issues. I'm going to break your hand next time I see you though, motor mount bolts are not supposed to be TTY.
 
I'm sure I used a torque wrench on those, with the most precise calibration too. Now I'm going to have to come down there to defend myself. There must be more to this story that I should probably hear in person.

I never got to experience that car at sea level, and that turbo was a bit lazy. But I have to say this current tiny T3 vanilla is worse at the moment.

linuxman51 said:
I wouldn't say your old 740 spools fast, but it seemed to make 15psi in first gear without any issues. I'm going to break your hand next time I see you though, motor mount bolts are not supposed to be TTY.
Click to expand...
 
pain, suffering, and time. and an ejected remote oil filter adapter (that the current owner installed). had to remove the mount to perform the repair, this took cheater bars, profanity, an early AM beer, and far more time than should be required. on a somewhat related side note, if one is installing a remote filter, one should build some slack into the system apparently or one risks fatiguing and forcibly removing said filter adapter. This results in a variety of attention from non-combatants.
 
LOL.

Well I'll buy you a beer next time I see you to pay for that. I do miss that car at times. It was a good one.

linuxman51 said:
pain, suffering, and time. and an ejected remote oil filter adapter (that the current owner installed). had to remove the mount to perform the repair, this took cheater bars, profanity, an early AM beer, and far more time than should be required. on a somewhat related side note, if one is installing a remote filter, one should build some slack into the system apparently or one risks fatiguing and forcibly removing said filter adapter. This results in a variety of attention from non-combatants.
Click to expand...
 
I didn't know that you worked on that car with Andres, thats cool to hear. Did you guys do some MS tuning? I always kept that tune and boost levels pretty conservative on that guy just for reliability. Not sure where he went with that after the sale.
 
yeah, a little bit of tuning and a lot of emergency repair yesterday. mostly econ tuning, and leaning it out of the 10's in boost. MS reads 5-6psi lower than the two boost gauges, found that a little odd, but told him not to mess with it until he's got time to re-tune things.
 
Oh cool. Now I see why your cussing, recent memory even. It has been 2 years since I sold it, so i'll just claim that someone else worked on it....
 
I took the Volvo in for some work at the local independent shop Volvo Specialists. This place is run by sincere enthusiasts. These guys have more lowered Volvos than any place I have seen outside the Stancework website. We lowered the front about an inch more, and dialed the camber to -0.5 on both sides. Its not slammed and still has plenty of downward travel. Denvers roads rival many 3rd world countries for rough pot holed nastiness, especially after the rough winter we had. It still has enough compliance to drive almost normal speeds without fear of breaking something.

I also had them set the valve lash aiming for the looser side of the range. I was hoping there was some lost power hidden there, because some of the clearances were really tight with the new cam. But it is still the same old slowpoke. We also cranked the wastegate rod inward about 4 turns, and nothing changed. My mechanic friend verified my concern that thi is infact the slowest turbocharged Volvo he has ever driven. We scratched out heads a while trying to come up with some solutions. Its very mysterious still. I'm going to pull the downpipe loose next to get a look at the wastegete assembly.



<a href="https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/W_aPl1tizB3MMpkPrS0ZFtMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=embedwebsite"><img src="https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-0HWSWkXxJ8w/VQeItx5TCII/AAAAAAAAJsg/JYEdyG1cf60/s640/IMAGE_1358.jpeg" height="360" width="640" /></a>
 
Looks good.

Maybe sticky rings? Have you tried filling the bores with seafoam and leaving it to soak overnight? That alone picked up 3" of hg at idle for me and a whole lot of responsiveness. Speaking of which...how is your idle vacuum looking in N, stopped in D?
 
harribert said:
Looks good.

Maybe sticky rings? Have you tried filling the bores with seafoam and leaving it to soak overnight? That alone picked up 3" of hg at idle for me and a whole lot of responsiveness. Speaking of which...how is your idle vacuum looking in N, stopped in D?
Click to expand...

I don't have an idle valve right now, so the car revs to 1500 in neutral, and is held to 950 by the trans/torque converter in drive.

From datalogs, I am seeing 55kPa in drive and about 40kPa in Neutral. The seafoam idea is interesting. I hadn't thought about trying that.
 
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