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Valvetrain Noise

iHateVolvoPeople

Active member
Joined
Feb 1, 2014
Location
Midwest
Was trying to hold off on making a thread but here we are. 93 244+t. blah blah specs

TL;DR: iPd turbo cam been installed and great. Reshimmed to exact spec and now it makes noises. Is it the shims fault, or maybe a normal noise for a more 'aggressive' cam?

Had a few different cams in this car and have had the iPd turbo cam in here for well over a year. Initially didn't reshim because everything was verrry close to being in spec besides 1 or 2 on the loose side (but not excessive). Few months back I did some quick maths and ordered the shims I needed to make all clearances sit right around .016". Installed all new shims, everything was .015"-.017", so well within spec. Right after these new shims I noticed a far more audible valvetrain noise. Kinda just parked the car and worried about my other cars. I had second guessed myself and thought maybe the valves are still out of spec so I pulled the cam cover today and measured again Ever single clearances is between .014" and .018". I did not measure exact clearances but simply made sure they were all within spec. If I had to guess, I was right the first time and all clearances are hovering right at .016". Great! So why did this noise only show up after the new shims? Harder material than stock? Normal noise?

Please watch video in HD to hear it.
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/9Ok7JclM9-c" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 
More lift means a more forceful closing due to the nature of the spring constant as well as a different metal on the shins having different acoustic properties. I had the exact same reaction after I reshimed, then later I added the ipd cam and it got louder. But being a physicist I know a bit about spring force.

So, it’s normal imo.
 
Same thing happened after I swapped my b cam and shimmed it. There was a more audible tick. It even ticks on acceleration. Already had two technicians say it must be the higher lift making the valves shut more aggressively.
 
Make sure you're using a good oil. Such as 15W-40, if weather permits. Shell Rotella now has T5 15W-40 which is Synthetic Blend (lower pour point).
 
Same thing happened after I swapped my b cam and shimmed it. There was a more audible tick. It even ticks on acceleration. Already had two technicians say it must be the higher lift making the valves shut more aggressively.
Terrific, thank you. I will run it as is.
Make sure you're using a good oil. Such as 15W-40, if weather permits.

That is exactly what I’m using and have always used. I’ll step it down to a 5w-30 when it’s real cold. Since it just started happening after the re shim, oil shouldn’t be a factor.

Edit: Sorry, i run t6 5w-40 all year round. No ill effect though. Noise is from the new shims.
 
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Even though it's been shimmed, I am concerned at the loud valvetrain, at least I think it's the valvetrain. It ticks at idle and on acceleration, but goes silent while decelerating.
I'm on 89 gas, so not sure if it's pinging that's causing the tick.
 
Even though it's been shimmed, I am concerned at the loud valvetrain, at least I think it's the valvetrain. It ticks at idle and on acceleration, but goes silent while decelerating.
I'm on 89 gas, so not sure if it's pinging that's causing the tick.

Sounds like your exhaust manifold gaskets.
 
Installed the turbo cam too and replaced all of the valve hushers on an engine with 120k miles. Got louder after the install. Wasn't worried about it, still going strong like 20k miles later

Just a weird thought but could it be due to the amount of overlap in the cam, meaning the sound is escaping through the overlapping valves.
 
idle at the beginning and around 24sec, sounds like exhaust leak.

close up, sounds like valvetrain.

super close up around 12sec, sounds like noisy injectors through a stethoscope.

:e-shrug:

I don't worry about valve noise if the clearances are right. But I've never heard a dropped valve. Rather, when the end of the spring breaks off. I think mrBill had some top end noise. Found several upper retainers cracked in half and the only thing holding them together was the follower bucket. If clearances are right, I'd be looking for other signs of damage, and if nothing is found, I'd live with it.

How do you measure the valve clearances? Do you use straight or bent feeler gauges? Where do you have the cam lobe pointed when you measure? What does "too tight" feel like when the shim doesn't fit?

I was measuring mine last weekend after swapping the M cam for an IPD Turbo cam. I bet the longer, bent-end feeler gauges would be easier to use. Mine are straight, and not quite long enough, so I sort of have to bend it to slide it in, especially when a valve cover stud is in the way. The too-loose are easy to tell, but sometimes it's hard to tell if it's too-tight vs. just right. I'll go back down one feeler and try again, making sure a thinner feeler is slipping right in and feeling too loose, then go back up to the one that felt like it interfered enough to deem it not too-loose. Sometimes I go up one thicker and make sure it really stops when it hits the cam, before shoving in.
 
idle at the beginning and around 24sec, sounds like exhaust leak.

close up, sounds like valvetrain.

super close up around 12sec, sounds like noisy injectors through a stethoscope.

:e-shrug:
Noise *only* occured after new shim install. Even with the iPd turbo cam and 2 loose clearances, it was rather quiet. The noise is far more noticeable with revs.

I don't worry about valve noise if the clearances are right. But I've never heard a dropped valve. Rather, when the end of the spring breaks off. I think mrBill had some top end noise. Found several upper retainers cracked in half and the only thing holding them together was the follower bucket. If clearances are right, I'd be looking for other signs of damage, and if nothing is found, I'd live with it.
Clearances are right and what type of damage does one look for? Cam lobes looked okay I think.

How do you measure the valve clearances? Do you use straight or bent feeler gauges? Where do you have the cam lobe pointed when you measure? What does "too tight" feel like when the shim doesn't fit?
I use the bent style that does not skip any sizes at all, they are fantastic.

I was measuring mine last weekend after swapping the M cam for an IPD Turbo cam. I bet the longer, bent-end feeler gauges would be easier to use. Mine are straight, and not quite long enough, so I sort of have to bend it to slide it in, especially when a valve cover stud is in the way. The too-loose are easy to tell, but sometimes it's hard to tell if it's too-tight vs. just right. I'll go back down one feeler and try again, making sure a thinner feeler is slipping right in and feeling too loose, then go back up to the one that felt like it interfered enough to deem it not too-loose. Sometimes I go up one thicker and make sure it really stops when it hits the cam, before shoving in.
If it slides with 0 resistance at all, I step it up .001" and try again. A hair of resistance is just right for getting accurate measurements IMO. And even if I was .001" off, everything is well within spec at .016" (or .014", whichever is directly in the middle of spec is what I targeted, that way any slight variations would still leave me within spec). I am 10000000% sure that all 8 clearances are near perfect. It's either something broken or more than likely simply the shim material and cam profile. I can't think of any reasons as to why it would only start right after the shim install.
 
Ok here is my two cents suggestion. These are solid follower engines. Modern oil doesn't have as much zinc additive as old oil did. With new followers and an oil with reduced zinc the new valvetrain has less of the additive in the oil that it was designed for. So the new followers are louder. if you add some zince additive it may help. Not a lot of the additive since it can shorten the life of the converter. At least that was the engineering behind reduction of zinc in the motor oil. That zinc additive gets burnished iinto valve train parts over time. Your old shims probably had a good amount on them since they were in there 30 years or so.

Every other oil change or so I add stp to my engines since that is easy to get and is supposed to be a mix that wouldn't cost me the converter. lol.
 
I like the bent feeler gauges and kind of setup .014, .015, .016 and use them near to each other as a go easy, go right, and no go. Shim pliers are better than picking at it or using a magnet to change shims.
 
They valves seemed even in their sound. I wouldn't mess with it and if you want you can add snake oil to help it out. Snake oil with zinc though.
 
They valves seemed even in their sound. I wouldn't mess with it and if you want you can add snake oil to help it out. Snake oil with zinc though.

Got it. Thanks! I may add some zinc just for peace of mind. It really isn't a great sound.

Any ill effects of adding zinc?
 
Just use the recommended amount and no more. It can shorten the service life of converters which is why the epa made the oil makers reduce the amount. At least that is the lore as I understand it. You can also get high zinc oils from Summit and Jegs. They are listed as racing oils or off road oil. But they are good for old road cars that need that lubrication. Stuff like old pushrod beetles and porsches as well as V8 classic stuff.
 
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