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Dirt-worthy 245

Coliningus

Coliningus

That Guy
Joined
Sep 30, 2016
Location
Ventura, CA
Hi all, this is a copy paste of a message I sent to a resident TB expert on offroad 240 stuff, but if you all have any insights they would be much appreciated and I'm sure it would help other TBers with similar goals!

The car currently: 1989 245. I am in the middle of AW70-to-T5 swap (just got the clutch assembly in a couple nights ago, doing the trans swap next weekend), which will include the adjustable panhard and torque rods from IPD w/ poly bushings and 1 pc. mustang driveshaft. I also just swapped in the IPD rear overload springs yesterday. Putting in the curt class II hitch once I get the right bolts (curt supplies only partially-threaded M14x2x120 bolts and if your frame has the weld nuts you need fully-threaded, in case it helps anyone).

My ultimate goal is a fun daily driver that is also capable of hauling a 250lb dirt bike and a bunch of camping gear out to the Mojave desert every month or two during the October-May desert riding season. This includes driving on some rutted, soft dirt roads. I've taken my wagon to the desert but have yet to do it with a dirt bike on the back. I actually just swapped in the IPD sport exhaust because I cracked my old rusty muffler scraping bottom on my last desert trip a couple weeks ago.

Shocks seem like and obvious next move, but I am unsure of what to get with this goal in mind; any specific suggestions here? I also plan to replace the rear trailing arm bushings with OEM rubber, but am open to suggestions of poly as well. Any other recommendations such as sway bars, or front suspension components with this application in mind?

Thanks, as always TB!
 
For my winter car I ran overloads with billy tourings. This was with weight in the back for traction. Thought it was fine. You could probably go HD's with the thicker pistons if you want something more durable.

I used GT springs in the front since they only "lowered" the car by like a half inch or something appreciably minor and I was interested in ground clearance.
 
I've heard enough bad things about the billy tourings to want to avoid those but I am leaning toward billy hd's. Hopefully the stock valving isn't too soft as I really don't want to pay for revalving anything (altho I'm sure they gotta be firmer than 200K+ originals).

As for front suspension I was thinking GT/diesel springs, maybe with a spacer and billy HDs, and then thicker sway bars to come later if I want to tighten it up further.
 
I've been quite happy with my 240's off-road capacity. Would go quite well if it wasn't lowered (only slightly but still).
Some form of limited slip diff helps a lot. I use the TrueTrack, which works fine for me but is a whole can of worms. Cheaper is the G80 locker found in various rwd Volvo's.

I'd suggest you keep as much articulation as possible (talking rear axle). Stock rubber bushings or better yet the (Kaplhenke) Hybrid torque rods and trailing arm bushings. Using similar stuff and I'm really impressed at how the car handles/drifts, how nicely the rear axle follows the bumps now. I'm not a big fan of the full poly-bushed TQ rods. Small rear sway, if any. Stock one probably won't hurt, i'm going back to stock (coming from 22mm ipd).

No direct experience with 240 overload springs in the back but on an 850 i'm using Lesjof?rs Overloads and Bilstein B6 shocks and that is a very good match, firm and still super comfortable. I'd be wary of shocks with little damping then. On my 240 I fixed some spacers from round poly-something stock and added 30mm of ride height, easy.
 
Good to see a fellow dutch Volvo nut and with some excellent info to boot.

I'm not quite ready to dive into diff swap madness but I'll be there before long I'm sure.

I already have the ipd torque rods and I think for the daily drive side of life the tight response from the poly will be nice but I'll definitely look into the hybrid trailing arm bushings.

Any specific part numbers or damping figures from your billy B6s?
 
Coliningus said:
Hi all, this is a copy paste of a message I sent to a resident TB expert on offroad 240 stuff, but if you all have any insights they would be much appreciated and I'm sure it would help other TBers with similar goals!

The car currently: 1989 245. I am in the middle of AW70-to-T5 swap (just got the clutch assembly in a couple nights ago, doing the trans swap next weekend), which will include the adjustable panhard and torque rods from IPD w/ poly bushings and 1 pc. mustang driveshaft. I also just swapped in the IPD rear overload springs yesterday. Putting in the curt class II hitch once I get the right bolts (curt supplies only partially-threaded M14x2x120 bolts and if your frame has the weld nuts you need fully-threaded, in case it helps anyone).

My ultimate goal is a fun daily driver that is also capable of hauling a 250lb dirt bike and a bunch of camping gear out to the Mojave desert every month or two during the October-May desert riding season. This includes driving on some rutted, soft dirt roads. I've taken my wagon to the desert but have yet to do it with a dirt bike on the back. I actually just swapped in the IPD sport exhaust because I cracked my old rusty muffler scraping bottom on my last desert trip a couple weeks ago.

Shocks seem like and obvious next move, but I am unsure of what to get with this goal in mind; any specific suggestions here? I also plan to replace the rear trailing arm bushings with OEM rubber, but am open to suggestions of poly as well. Any other recommendations such as sway bars, or front suspension components with this application in mind?

Thanks, as always TB!
Click to expand...

I would carry my mopeds on a motorcycle bumper hitch on the 245. The only springs that held up were my Mercedes springs. ipd overloads would still sag like crazy.


http://forums.turbobricks.com/showthread.php?t=288906

Ken gave me some KYB shocks that did the trick.

Where exactly do you ride I go to Stoddard Wells every once in a while.

I may do Gorman this year as well.


heres the hitch mount im talking about, get some gutter mount Yakima/thule racks, put as far back as you can to tie the bike at rhe top.

moto1g-jpg.319019


edit: Mercedes springs, make sure you keep stock sway bar. ipd rear is super stiff, you may like it, I did not, and returned to a stock rear sway
 
Last edited:
Make sure you get a rear locker. you should already havea 3.73 rear from the auto trans. that gear should be good to go with the t5 for low torque gearing. What cam are you using? T cam is best for stump pulling
 
Awesome info 240240, thanks. Dove springs and spangler are my usual desert stomping grounds.

That hitch mount similar to what I have, a rage powersports 400lb capacity aluminum deal that weighs in at like 20-30lbs (I think). Bike is a YZ250 that's specd at 210lbs dry or so (is that a YZ on the dodge hitch?).

Excellent suggestion on the mercedes springs but gawddam I need new shocks first, my rear is all spring with the ipd overloads right now. Not to mention I just forked over for the ipds. I'll see how they go and if it still sags too much I'll look into the w123s.

T cam is a new suggestion for me; I was looking at the A or VX but I like the idea of focusing on low-end torque as I will spend little-to-no time past 4.5K rpm or so. I'm doing valve clearances and new hushers and seals after the trans swap so I'll swap in a new cam while I'm at it. Are people running the T straight up or slightly advanced on the NA B230?

Still not keen on a diff swap but the G80 is what I would do if anything. Either way that's further down the road (I'm still in the middle of the AW70-to-T5 swap mind you).
 
Coliningus said:
T cam is a new suggestion for me; I was looking at the A or VX but I like the idea of focusing on low-end torque as I will spend little-to-no time past 4.5K rpm or so. I'm doing valve clearances and new hushers and seals after the trans swap so I'll swap in a new cam while I'm at it. Are people running the T straight up or slightly advanced on the NA B230?
Click to expand...

I'm not sure why anyone would use a T cam in an advanced position. It'll do the rev range you're describing above in the normal position. Maybe you'd want to advance it if you'll never exceed 2k rpm, but even then you'd probably rather have a cam more optimized for that. Home backup generator application maybe?
 
John V said:
You may love them but there is nothing say you would not like good suspension even more.

It all depends on what you are used to.
Click to expand...

100% John. I guess it's more about what this guy is doing... for hitting the dirt road once in a while having some Ohlins would be super nice... but then you'd have to add better hand and foot controls because you'd have to drive with only 1 arm and 1 leg (on account of it costing an arm and a leg).
 
I don't have experience with a dirt bike on the back of a 240, but I did put one on my Nissan hardbody and do a cross country trip and some offroading:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1-9G07KY0qWgggd3dNsrCwRv9_JlEFBNt

Are you planning on making a custom 2" receiver? I'm not sure if I would trust a 240 1.25" receiver with an adapter to 2". I haven't seen any carriers for 1.25" receivers.

I ended up needing helper leafs to my truck to get the handling to a point i was comfortable driving it on the highway in traffic. Even then, it had problems on bad concrete segmented highway. Over 50 mph it couldn't handle the rhythmic concrete joints and would oscillate badly.

You won't be able to open your hatch with the bike onboard (you probably know that).

It would be darn cool to put a bike on the back of a 240, but consider that you'll probably be nervous about it all the time. (Well, I would be.) Trailers work pretty well.
 
EivlEvo said:
100% John. I guess it's more about what this guy is doing... for hitting the dirt road once in a while having some Ohlins would be super nice... but then you'd have to add better hand and foot controls because you'd have to drive with only 1 arm and 1 leg (on account of it costing an arm and a leg).
Click to expand...

Yeah but there ARE good alternatives somewhere between the costs of the promo-quality Bilstein poo and the super end of the world wonderful ?hlins.

Poor guy does have a serious problem though.. almost nobody talks any numbers like damping settings, and FEW talk spring rates and especially for longer things and loads way at the bumper..

I gave up on bumper carriers in 1971...

Nice to see he has a YZ with a nice motor+++one that fires every time the piston goes up to the top instead of those odd engines that only fire now and then and twirl around half the time not doing anything..:cheers::cheers::badboy::badboy::badboy:
 
John V said:
Yeah but there ARE good alternatives somewhere between the costs of the promo-quality Bilstein poo and the super end of the world wonderful ?hlins.

Poor guy does have a serious problem though.. almost nobody talks any numbers like damping settings, and FEW talk spring rates and especially for longer things and loads way at the bumper..

I gave up on bumper carriers in 1971...

Nice to see he has a YZ with a nice motor+++one that fires every time the piston goes up to the top instead of those odd engines that only fire now and then and twirl around half the time not doing anything..:cheers::cheers::badboy::badboy::badboy:
Click to expand...

Good to hear the 2-stroke love from you John. Way more fun altho the faster gas burn than my 4 stroke friends can be annoying on longer rides.

On another note, what are some of your good shocks recommendations between softy bilsteins and silk and satin ?hlins with this or similar application in mind? Damping numbers? I'd like to keep around or under $250 including any revalving but maybe that's a pipe dream...
 
tjanson said:
I don't have experience with a dirt bike on the back of a 240, but I did put one on my Nissan hardbody and do a cross country trip and some offroading:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1-9G07KY0qWgggd3dNsrCwRv9_JlEFBNt

Are you planning on making a custom 2" receiver? I'm not sure if I would trust a 240 1.25" receiver with an adapter to 2". I haven't seen any carriers for 1.25" receivers.

I ended up needing helper leafs to my truck to get the handling to a point i was comfortable driving it on the highway in traffic. Even then, it had problems on bad concrete segmented highway. Over 50 mph it couldn't handle the rhythmic concrete joints and would oscillate badly.

You won't be able to open your hatch with the bike onboard (you probably know that).

It would be darn cool to put a bike on the back of a 240, but consider that you'll probably be nervous about it all the time. (Well, I would be.) Trailers work pretty well.
Click to expand...

I have a decent appetite for risk, and since I already have the hitch rack I'm just gonna try it and then get a trailer if I can't stomach it. I'm certainly aware that I'm pushing the 240 past its stated limits but I'll be damned if I'm gonna let that stop me from trying. It would be a sweet setup if the wagon can pull it off.
 
I used Moog CC217 overload springs and Gabriel Ultra shocks on my DD. Many miles with 400lbs of gear in the car and a utility trailer behind it. Rode great while loaded, but a bit harsh with an empty trunk and no trailer.
I swapped back to some stock rear springs (same shocks), and enjoy the softer ride. Loaded up, it sits a bit lower, but not by much.

I've been thinking about going to a bumper rack for the dirt bike as well, but the approach angle would be terrible...
 
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