To lock, or to limit the slip?

[blkaplan]

Originally Posted by aharres

Thanks for the input Ben.

As for lifting the rear inner wheel, I'm not sure how much of a problem it is for my car at speed. Doing fast u-turns on the street, my car will definitely unload the rear inner wheel enough that I can't put any power down until I begin straightening up the wheel. Softening the rear bar would definitely help me here, but I'm also really enjoying how the car is handling with the 21mm rear bar.

So let's take the fast u-turn case: in the middle of the turn when my rear inner wheel is unloaded, can I stab the throttle and get the rear end to kick around for a fun little power slide on exit?

It seems to me that in this scenario, the wave device will engage and allow me to have my fun whereas a plain torsen won't be able to do much until I begin straightening the wheel.

It will be very difficult to get to a situation when you are going fast and hard enough on public roads that you will surpass the abilities of the wavetrac. As long as you don't have major setup issues it shouldn't be a problem from my experience.

[BeaverMeat]

Not to hijack this thread... but, I'm in the same realm of choosing a LSD for the Volstang. I chose the TrueTracc over the WaveTrac because it has a better track record of reliabilty. The Wave may be "better" overall, but durability and reliability is more important IMHO... we are Volvo owners, are we not? ;) Plus, ripping apart a diff is beyond my capabilities at the moment.

I have a question for the diff experts. There are two types of TrueTrac offered. 3.73 and up, and the 3.54 and down.

Would it be stupid to use a 3.73 TrueTrac with a 3.31 gear? Whats the difference in the pre-load?

[cwdodson88]

Originally Posted by BeaverMeat

Not to hijack this thread... but, I'm in the same realm of choosing a LSD for the Volstang. I chose the TrueTrac... now, there is two types offered. 3.73 and up, and the 3.54 and down.

Would it be stupid to use a 3.73 TrueTrac with a 3.31 gear? Whats the difference in the pre-load?

I believe that is going to be bolt pattern rather that preload. The 3.54 and down using a smaller diameter or different offset carrier to fit the ring gear, and 3.73 and up using slightly different carrier.

[culberro]

Originally Posted by BeaverMeat

Not to hijack this thread... but, I'm in the same realm of choosing a LSD for the Volstang. I chose the TrueTrac... now, there is two types offered. 3.73 and up, and the 3.54 and down.

Would it be stupid to use a 3.73 TrueTrac with a 3.31 gear? Whats the difference in the pre-load?

Volvo only used the 3.73 and up center section.
Go with the 912A588 part number, as it's a higher preload diff meant for a rear axle application.

[BeaverMeat]

Good to know. I haven't been able to find a solid answer as my Google-fo isn't 100%. lol

[aharres]

Originally Posted by blkaplan

It will be very difficult to get to a situation when you are going fast and hard enough on public roads that you will surpass the abilities of the wavetrac. As long as you don't have major setup issues it shouldn't be a problem from my experience.

Yeah that's what I was imagining. Are the wavetracs still going to be on sale when they come back in stock?


I just picked up some of your studs and nuts and I'm still trying to decide on wheel spacers. I want to space out the front a bit because I have maybe 2 or 3 mm of clearance between the tire and the strut housing at the moment. I think a mild 15 or 16.5 mm spacing will buy me some room without being in danger of rubbing on the wheel arches. The question is, do I want to add the same amount of spacing to the rear, or bump it up to 25 or 32 mm?


What would be the effect of increasing rear track width relative to the front? I guess it should soften the roll stiffness slightly, but I'm not sure what other effects it will have.

[blkaplan]

Originally Posted by BeaverMeat

Not to hijack this thread... but, I'm in the same realm of choosing a LSD for the Volstang. I chose the TrueTracc over the WaveTrac because it has a better track record of reliabilty. The Wave may be "better" overall, but durability and reliability is more important IMHO... we are Volvo owners, are we not? ;) Plus, ripping apart a diff is beyond my capabilities at the moment.

I have a question for the diff experts. There are two types of TrueTrac offered. 3.73 and up, and the 3.54 and down.

Would it be stupid to use a 3.73 TrueTrac with a 3.31 gear? Whats the difference in the pre-load?

Wavetrac has a lifetime warranty. Not sure what Truetrac offers if anything.

[culberro]

Originally Posted by blkaplan

Wavetrac has a lifetime warranty. Not sure what Truetrac offers if anything.

Not much of one, if any. Shop mate had one in his Tacoma, and it wore the diff case out in probably 30k miles. No warranty or support of any kind from Eaton, they said it was all normal wear and tear... OK guys, there's over 3mm of play inside the diff, enough that he thought his wheel bearings were shot on the truck.

[blkaplan]

Originally Posted by aharres

Yeah that's what I was imagining. Are the wavetracs still going to be on sale when they come back in stock?


I just picked up some of your studs and nuts and I'm still trying to decide on wheel spacers. I want to space out the front a bit because I have maybe 2 or 3 mm of clearance between the tire and the strut housing at the moment. I think a mild 15 or 16.5 mm spacing will buy me some room without being in danger of rubbing on the wheel arches. The question is, do I want to add the same amount of spacing to the rear, or bump it up to 25 or 32 mm?


What would be the effect of increasing rear track width relative to the front? I guess it should soften the roll stiffness slightly, but I'm not sure what other effects it will have.

I have not been notified of any price adjustments from wavetrac

If you have 3mm of clearance, its probably fine. if you want to space it out then go for it.

If it were me I would add spacers evenly unless you are trying to tune the grip balance. Too much oversteer? Make the rear wider. Too much understeer? Space the front more.

[mikep]

Originally Posted by 2manyturbos

No, they are a clutch unit that is simply spring loaded. IOW, they don’t lock harder with more power applied to them the way most clutch limited slip units do.

Take a look here. There is a disassembled G 80 and you can see the clutch plates in the picture.

http://www.turbobricks.com/mods.php?content=art0027

Very cool. But weird. Thank you.
And it’s odd that it has the same code as a GM.

Originally Posted by culberro

Volvo only used the 3.73 and up center section.
Go with the 912A588 part number, as it's a higher preload diff meant for a rear axle application.

That is correct. The older high-preload was 411 suffix. The 588 is a harder case, better carrier bolt set up.

[2manyturbos]

Originally Posted by mikep

Very cool. But weird. Thank you.
And it’s odd that it has the same code as a GM.

I also thought the Volvo G80 was a true locker until Kildea on here set me straight.

[Kjets On a Plane]

^yeah, not exactly, but might save your axle splines a little compared to the welded/spool & be a nice fuse/failure point or make the car tolerable to move around the driveway/yard if you have to push it dead/similar?

IDK what the service life of the clutches on an "always locked" G80 is/how well it works compared to a spool/how soon it's likely to scatter under duress as a hacked/molested turd polished thing, but it strikes me as less miserable to move around the yard/less horrible on your suspension bushings for DD use at the very least?

Lasted OK for me with 200hp for wet/snow weather fun/modded it in a weird way (still disengaged above x-MPH (30mph or so with vanagon sized tires on 245), but skinny vanagon tires/early 240 steelies/not that likely to 'splode it/not sure I'd call it a "performance" application/anecdotal.
Thought it was pretty predictable, but my driver skills aren't "all that" / rarely a hot shoe at any motorsport event to the extent apples-apples comparisons are possible.

[BeaverMeat]

Originally Posted by blkaplan

Wavetrac has a lifetime warranty. Not sure what Truetrac offers if anything.

So who is going to pay the labor?

[blkaplan]

Originally Posted by BeaverMeat

So who is going to pay the labor?

Probably the same person who will pay for the labor and parts for a truetrac?

[Fred Gwynne]

Any comments on a quaife differential?

[tjanson]

How about Auburn Gear Select-A-Loc? It's a clutch type with a e-locker feature that you can engage at up to 30 mph. $720 from Summit.

https://auburngeardiffs.com/aftermarket-catalog/

[JohnMc]

Probably good for hooining around. Selectable full locking. Heh, I did a 5 minute mod on my Toyota's factory rear e-locker so I can use it in 2HI. That's entertaining on rainy slick roads.

[aharres]

So I hear people talking about wearing out the truetrac on long sweeping turns (on a race track pushing a lot of torque I assume) Is this a real concern? Given that my plans are to build a hot na motor which won't be putting out a ton of torque, will the truetrac be reliable enough to last 5+ years of daily driving and hootin?

[Fred Gwynne]

I realize you folks are chatting about LSDs but since this thread has been relatively inactivate then I think it is okay for me to bring up the Yukon Grizzly locker.

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/y.../245/year/1987

Do any of you think this locker would work and it was be easy to install? I have done a good deal of research but I just can't figure out and understand the differential specs of a Volvo 240.

[culberro]

Originally Posted by Fred Gwynne

I realize you folks are chatting about LSDs but since this thread has been relatively inactivate then I think it is okay for me to bring up the Yukon Grizzly locker.

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/y.../245/year/1987

Do any of you think this locker would work and it was be easy to install? I have done a good deal of research but I just can't figure out and understand the differential specs of a Volvo 240.

Ran a cheap Spartan Locker in the rally car. Huge upgrade over a welded axle if you like easy turn-in, and the axle snapping stopped which was a huge plus.

The Aussie Locker and Spartan Locker easy install, as you don't have to mess with re-shimming the diff.

Yes they're a little noisy when in a parking lot, but not too bad.

Also, there's this cheap boy for a helical diff: https://www.summitracing.com/parts/pwt-gt443027

[Lankku]

Spartan is so rough in tight corners that many(myself included when I tried one) have moved on to Truetrac or other solutions. Also it creates a lot of play on to the driveshaft movement, really nice clunks when going on/off power. With an automatic it's not that bad because of the nature of the transmission.

Years ago I had two different, similar type, lockers and they behaved much better.

[James M]

Was into the idea based on price but I don't need more clunks

[classicswede]

Originally Posted by Fred Gwynne

Any comments on a quaife differential?

I stock the Quaife diffs and they are a very nice piece of kit. I like them as they do have a full parts warranty. They are manufactured here in the UK with a high level of quality control. Good enough to be OEM fitment Ford, GM, BMW etc. Yes you can buy other Torsen diffs made in China, Taiwan, India etc for less and it can be hard to justify the extra cost.

The real thing is choosing the right diff for you

Road car and you do not want to get stuck on lanes when passing cars on the grass, want grip on gravel etc then the G80 is the boy for you. They are perfect for low speed traction

Road car with some track day work etc then a Torsen type like Quaife are the way to go

Pure event car then a plate diff like Gripper is the choice to make

[Fred Gwynne]

Thanks for your thoughts!

[Fred Gwynne]

Originally Posted by culberro

The Aussie Locker and Spartan Locker easy install, as you don't have to mess with re-shimming the diff.

I live on a long dirt road in a commune and it is the commune folk that actually plow the road. I appreciate their work. They do us all a favor. Not knocking them at all but it wouldn't break my heart to have a town plow truck clean the road up after a snow storm. Last week a guy in his Tacoma avoided a xc skier in the road and ended up down the hill and into my yard.

Although my 240 has the suspension tuned to a pretty good degree for aggressive driving on pavement I've got that Aussie locker stuck in the back of my head. Inexpensive and easy to install. I've never broken apart a diff before. I'm curious to try. Would the installation of an Aussie locker affect my driving big time on dry roads? If I came into corners fast but kept the throttle steady the whole way through then would I be alright? Or would I be increasing the likelihood of flying off the road? I have no interest in the auto-x stuff. Just long fast sweeping turns. Thanks for reading this long post and all comments are appreciated.

FYI, I'm thinking about the locker to help me pass through the snow covered and hilly roads on the commune.

Thanks!



Edit: This is making me think the heck with it https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/fo...s/81337/page1/