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Old 02-22-2021, 03:18 AM   #1
90volvo
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Default 90plus vs c.header vs Jpipe

Like it says, 90 plus ported manifold vs cutom header vs Na manifold with Jpipe. The engine package is ported head with oversize valves, RSI stage 3 camshaft, Klracing intake, big ebay intercooler, MS2, ID1000cc injectors, E85 fuel, Afr gauge, boost gauge. Engine has aftermarket h beam rods. turbo is open for advice. Goals- hit somewhere above 350 hp. Street driven with auto box with 3.73 gears. So, what you do?

My thoughts
90 plus would be easy and reliable. But might not flow better than the header.

Custom header with external wastegate- probably make more power and run more boost. But will be hard on plug wires and a pain to change plugs.

Jpipe with NA manifold.- The Jpipe I built has 1 3/4 pipes off the manfold and go to the turbo flange top front. I think it will be restrictive considering you have 4-1.5 runners in the manifold dumping into 2- 1.75 pipes. But maybe I am wrong. Lookiing back at header designs, exhuast gases expand when as they get cooler? But this set up is cheap, pretty easy to weld any kind of turbo flange on it. You can twin scroll it too.

I searched but never found anybody comparing all 3 options.
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Old 02-23-2021, 08:22 PM   #2
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I went with a custom header, there was no problems with the plug wires, and you can always put heat sleeves on them if it turns out to be a problem.

I used an internal wastegate exhaust housing and mounted the wastegate on the down pipe.

Lessons learned: do not use studs, use bolts on the turbo mounting flange. And skip the header wrap, that stuff doesn't last long and then makes a huge itchy mess.





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Old 02-23-2021, 10:57 PM   #3
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I you make tubular header it's same to make it twinscroll, because everybody knows that best all-round turbocharger is a holset's hx35 super which is a twin scroll turbo...

That's only my opinion.
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Old 02-23-2021, 11:46 PM   #4
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I'd ditch that pos ebay intercooler and get something that will actually cool that charges air. Something from Treadstone or Garrett.

The group A cars made 350hp on the "old" exhaust manifold. A ported 90+ to match a t3/t4 50 trim would get you there.

On E85 boost that bitch to the moon.
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Old 02-24-2021, 07:38 AM   #5
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I don't know why you're trying to reinvent the wheel (Only the Asperger side of me would say that...) with any external manifold other than just the 90+. It's an old school turbo choice, but a garrett t40e 50 trim will get you there on a plain ol 90+..... I'm sure there's more modern variants for more $$$.

IMHO the real reason for going with something other than the 90+ (log manifold, j-pipe, etc) is if you want an external wastegate to get that amazingly consistent boost control in the form of a spring.

Even a basic log manifold will do it. Back in 2004 -land people were adamant that only long tube headers could be used for turbo swaps and the stock logs were crap... until a bunch of people came along and made excellent power on log manifolds. Heck even the pre-90 turbo log manifold has a great flat spot on it to weld a pipe to an external gate.

I don't know what car you're putting this in but the real consideration for me would be packing constraints. I had an NA manifold J-pipe setup which was pretty tight clearances all around.... takes up a lot of room. Whatever you design, make it such that you can get things in and out without having to invent or fabricate special tools that work on one and only only bolt.

all hail the kludge pipe... (BTW that's an old T3 60 trim machined for a t4oe 50 trim wheel and the turbine housing for a stage 3 wheel.)


edit... if you do the j-pipe to the NA manifold... which is super easy... brace the hell out of it. It's the equivalent of holding a 100 pound weight out at arms length... it's begging to fall off. Oh... and if you do consider the j-pipe, then the turbo you want is the EVO8 16g6.... check out Sam's (deathwagon) setup from years ago.

Last edited by 740atl; 02-24-2021 at 02:43 PM..
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Old 02-24-2021, 10:13 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvelous3 View Post
I'd ditch that pos ebay intercooler and get something that will actually cool that charges air. Something from Treadstone or Garrett.

The group A cars made 350hp on the "old" exhaust manifold. A ported 90+ to match a t3/t4 50 trim would get you there.

On E85 boost that bitch to the moon.
I've held a treadstone core that looked identical to a CX Racing core..
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Old 02-24-2021, 07:13 PM   #7
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Thanks for the info. Not trying to invent the wheel. Over last few weeks of bad weather I got bored and built a J pipe. And done some swaping here and there.
So, I have all three options available. Plus, I have a Evo 8 turbo with upgraded turbine housing (9), GTX3076r (ebay but still ball bearing) and a GT2971(dont know much about but has t28 flange). The header is decent probably equal length diffently custom built. So been kinda stumped what to run. Keep in mind I have 3 volvo 240s. So extra parts wont go to waste. But focusing on the best car at this time. Here my set up.

Kl racing intake
ported head with o.s. valves
3 inch ex.
RSI stage 3 cam advanced 4
AW71 seems to be holding up
3.73 gear posi
8.8 to 1 comp. Low milage engine. With H beam rods.
ebay 3 inch intercooler (I know gonna get a KL or treads.)
E85 w/1000cc injectors.

My goal- is to beat 2008 corvette at the track. High 12 would diffently do it or maybe low 13.
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Old 02-25-2021, 03:22 AM   #8
Jussi Alanko
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You need the biggest turbo to beat that vette. Gtx3076r fits your bill...
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Old 02-25-2021, 03:00 PM   #9
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RoadRacer4Life ran a J pipe/na mani early on in the DeathWagon thread when it was still a reblock.
IIRC he had pretty good results.

Josh at Yoshifab apparently made really good power on a ported 90+ on both a 8v and 16v.

For packaging a bigger turbo, I'd argue the J pipe/na mani is superior because it gives the opportunity for some twin scroll action and raises it way up versus the 90+ down low.
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