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T3/T4 not spooling in first

Pinging sounds like a box of marbles.

What's your fuel system? I'm guessing stock since you can't afford spark plug wires. You should probably turn the boost down before you break something.
 
Sounds like your timing belt may be off a tooth. That would explain a lot of things, including why it wakes up at 4800.

Off a tooth in the cam?I highly doubt it my timing cover is still off so I can see the marks line up on gear and cover. One off on the crank? Alright I did check using the harmonic balancer and timing scale when I did it so I gues the balancer could have slipped a bit? But wouldn't that make my base timing adjustment off also. which way should I try adjusting the crank? if the belt were to stay in the same place should the crank go a tooth clockwise or counter clockwise? How would I set base timing? Is there any way to confirm you are at tdc?

But wait if I did get the crank and engine a true tdc wouldn't my can then look like it was off? Could I just adjust that instead? Is one tooth on the cam gear equal to a crank tooth? This is so confusing.

Edit: I've thought about it and I'm pretty sure a tooth is a tooth whether it be on the crank or the cam gear so on that note, I might just try setting the cam gear off a tooth (clockwise to advance timing?) and just see if it's better. If it is I'll just look at where the balancer timing mark hits when the cam is ligned up with the back cover to determine how offset the mark is then knowing that offset, I could set base timing using the old balancer mark by accounting for the offset. More of a guess and check method

Pinging sounds like a box of marbles.

What's your fuel system? I'm guessing stock since you can't afford spark plug wires. You should probably turn the boost down before you break something.

I'm using browntops on lh 2.2
 
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I'm NOT recommending setting it off a tooth, I'm simply recommending you VERIFY it is correct, with the cam and crank both at TDC.

Well when I check, the cam lines up with the timing mark and the tdc mark on the pulley lines up with the 0 degrees but that could have slipped. Is there any harm in trying it a tooth forward just to see if it runs more normally?
 

This is about the summation of everything, yes.

To those who find this thread in searches: understand why you do “stage zero” and realize the effects of it, otherwise you’ll end up making threads like this.

Don’t make threads like this in 2017. What’s left of it, anyways.
 
Alright so I've made a little progress by adjusting timing. What I did was I aligned the cam gear with the timing mark on the back plate by turning the crank via the crank bolt (this also aligned the mark on the harmonic balancer with the 0 degrees marking although it did seem to be off a bit like maybe half a tooth?). I then loosened the tensioner and removed the belt off the cam gear. I turned the cam gear a tooth clockwise and put the belt back on. I then realigned the cam gear spot with its timing mark. I then looked at the harmonic balancer, the mark on the balancer was as expected no longer in line with the 0 degree mark, but assuming I had corrected the skipped tooth, the engine should have been at tdc if the cam was ligned up which it was. So I marked on the harmonic balancer in line with the 0 degree mark to essentially make a new, correct timing mark (balancer may have slipped a bit. I couldn't use the crank pinion key to align for tdc because my lower timing cover is still on). I then used my new mark to set the ignition timing to 14 degrees btdc (didn't require much distributor rotation).

I've read that advancing cam timing should move the powerband down which is what I wanted (car was sluggish until 4800 suggesting I skipped a tooth). I assumed shifting the cam clockwise was advancing the timing.

So after performing this change I will list what has now happened so you guys can see what you think.

Good:

- acceleration is more consistent now. Boost no longer climbs super rapidly after 4800rpm and boost is now built consistently throughout the rpm range.
- vacuum is now 20mmHg warm where as it was only 18mmHg before

Bad:

-idle rpm is no longer consistent (climbs to 2000-2500 on its own and only a blip of the throttle will drop the it back down where it begins climbing again. This also happens driving while stopped) could this be part of the ECUs "learning procedure"?

- engine began misfiring at idle which was only fixed/improved by richening up the base mixture (wideband read 13.0 at idle once misfiring had stopped).

So what do you guys think? Had I skipped a tooth before or am I now running my cam advanced like 10 degrees? LOL
 
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Alright so I've made a little progress by adjusting timing. What I did was I aligned the cam gear with the timing mark on the back plate by turning the crank via the crank bolt (this also aligned the mark on the harmonic balancer with the 0 degrees marking although it did seem to be off a bit like maybe half a tooth?). I then loosened the tensioner and removed the belt off the cam gear. I turned the cam gear a tooth clockwise and put the belt back on. I then realigned the cam gear spot with its timing mark. I then looked at the harmonic balancer, the mark on the balancer was as expected no longer in line with the 0 degree mark, but assuming I had corrected the skipped tooth, the engine should have been at tdc if the cam was ligned up which it was. So I marked on the harmonic balancer in line with the 0 degree mark to essentially make a new, correct timing mark (balancer may have slipped a bit. I couldn't use the crank pinion key to align for tdc because my lower timing cover is still on). I then used my new mark to set the ignition timing to 14 degrees btdc (didn't require much distributor rotation).

I've read that advancing cam timing should move the powerband down which is what I wanted (car was sluggish until 4800 suggesting I skipped a tooth). I assumed shifting the cam clockwise was advancing the timing.

So after performing this change I will list what has now happened so you guys can see what you think.

Good:

- acceleration is more consistent now. Boost no longer climbs super rapidly after 4800rpm and boost is now built consistently throughout the rpm range.
- vacuum is now 20mmHg warm where as it was only 18mmHg before

Bad:

-idle rpm is no longer consistent (climbs to 2000-2500 on its own and only a blip of the throttle will drop the it back down where it begins climbing again. This also happens driving while stopped) could this be part of the ECUs "learning procedure"?

- engine began misfiring at idle which was only fixed/improved by richening up the base mixture (wideband read 13.0 at idle once misfiring had stopped).

So what do you guys think? Had I skipped a tooth before or am I now running my cam advanced like 10 degrees? LOL

If you don't know what your doing you won't get it timed without removing the lower cover.

If your idle is funkie you have a leak somewhere.
 
Did you check the ignition timing after changing the cam timing? Remember, cam driven dizzy on the 7/9's, you just changed the cam position in relation to TDC so you need to adjust the ignition timing since 2.2 still runs timing based on dizzy position. Fix that, may address your idle issue.
 
Well when I check, the cam lines up with the timing mark and the tdc mark on the pulley lines up with the 0 degrees but that could have slipped. Is there any harm in trying it a tooth forward just to see if it runs more normally?

Don't rely on the timing mark on the crank pulley. Use the notch in the crank gear timing belt guide washer.
 
Alright so I've made a little progress by adjusting timing. What I did was I aligned the cam gear with the timing mark on the back plate by turning the crank via the crank bolt (this also aligned the mark on the harmonic balancer with the 0 degrees marking although it did seem to be off a bit like maybe half a tooth?). I then loosened the tensioner and removed the belt off the cam gear. I turned the cam gear a tooth clockwise and put the belt back on. I then realigned the cam gear spot with its timing mark. I then looked at the harmonic balancer, the mark on the balancer was as expected no longer in line with the 0 degree mark, but assuming I had corrected the skipped tooth, the engine should have been at tdc if the cam was ligned up which it was. So I marked on the harmonic balancer in line with the 0 degree mark to essentially make a new, correct timing mark (balancer may have slipped a bit. I couldn't use the crank pinion key to align for tdc because my lower timing cover is still on). I then used my new mark to set the ignition timing to 14 degrees btdc (didn't require much distributor rotation).

I've read that advancing cam timing should move the powerband down which is what I wanted (car was sluggish until 4800 suggesting I skipped a tooth). I assumed shifting the cam clockwise was advancing the timing.

So after performing this change I will list what has now happened so you guys can see what you think.

Good:

- acceleration is more consistent now. Boost no longer climbs super rapidly after 4800rpm and boost is now built consistently throughout the rpm range.
- vacuum is now 20mmHg warm where as it was only 18mmHg before

Bad:

-idle rpm is no longer consistent (climbs to 2000-2500 on its own and only a blip of the throttle will drop the it back down where it begins climbing again. This also happens driving while stopped) could this be part of the ECUs "learning procedure"?

- engine began misfiring at idle which was only fixed/improved by richening up the base mixture (wideband read 13.0 at idle once misfiring had stopped).

So what do you guys think? Had I skipped a tooth before or am I now running my cam advanced like 10 degrees? LOL

The timing mark on the crank pulley is different than the crank sprocket timing mark by 15 degrees.
 
I indeed reset my ignition timing using my new mark. Thinking of creating a piston stop to find true tdc to mark exactly on the harmonic balancer.

The front timing cover (the part that holds the crank and intermediate shaft seals) has a TDC mark. The crank sprocket belt guide washer has a small notch to align with the TDC mark on the front cover.
 
I see, I just don't have the tool to hold the crank pulley so I can remove the bolt. Is there any other way to do this? I could see using the starter motor the crack the bolt off but not tighten it back on...
 
Alright, discovered that I had indeed messed up what was already correct. Timing is back to how it was and late spool continues. I have done some tests and it seems as though in second, the max boost I can create is around 17/18 psi. I have tried setting my boost controller above this but it has refused to go over. Car still builds 10 psi at around 4500 slowly, then rpms shoot up to 6k and boost to 17psi almost instantly. Would a video help?
 
My vote at this point is the knucklehead forgot to put the seal ring in the wastegate. Or you?re blowing the WG open with such a wussy spring in it.
 
Wastegate ring is definitely back in and the wastegate is sealed. I have my EBC set to not begin opening until around 15psi so that shouldn't be an issue as long as the EBC is doing its job.
 
Update: did some research and I'm starting to think that it might just be because of how large my turbo actually is. With a 60 AR cold side .60 trim comp wheel, and a .63 ar exhaust side with a stage 3 turbine this much lag should be expected?
 
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