home register FAQ memberlist calendar

Go Back   Turbobricks Forums > Mechanical > maintenance & nonperformance

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-17-2017, 10:15 PM   #1
arjunsw
Newbie
 
Join Date: May 2017
Question '82 Volvo 240 Resto/Stage 0-1

Hi All,

I have my grandfathers '82 Volvo 240 station wagon, and i've been wanting to restore it in an attempt to learn more about cars, and to drive a manual. Im posting to see if you guys can help me fix whats wrong, and point me in the right direction about all this. It has run within the past 6ish months, but its been sitting because of a dead battery. I have the new battery, but want to change the oil, and change the pos battery terminal before i start driving it. I think the engine is the B21F too?

I'm willing to learn as much as I can, and am pretty decent with electrical work. I have the basic tools, and would be willing to buy some that are more useful too. I also have a mechanic friend who can do more complicated things, if need be.

if this isn't the right format or place, let me know i can fix it!

Things that i've found so far:
  • Pos battery terminal needs replacing
    -, its pretty rusted and much smaller than the Neg battery terminal. I think I can do this easily, as long as i can find a good replacement
  • Suspension seems wallowy/really loose
    -when I sit in it, the suspension drops a lot, and wobbles around
  • AC conversion
    -Im in California, so in the summer it can get pretty hot. Pretty sure just the fan runs currently.
  • Oil change
    -will be my second time doing an oil change, just need to get a filter, was thinking Bosch or Mann.
  • New paint all around
    -at first I thought it was clear coat, but others told me to splash water on it to see if it would turn back to the original color, it didnt.
  • Dash & Front window cracked
    -dont know how to do either of these haha, but dash seems difficult, or so ive heard
  • Front grill fitment
    -currently its held in by zip ties, if i could get it really clipped in that'd be great.
  • Trim pieces
    -some trim pieces are missing, one was also superglued on, will need to attach that properly

This list isn't exhaustive, and i'm definitely a beginner, so please, let me know what you think or if you can help me!
arjunsw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-17-2017, 10:43 PM   #2
ZVOLV
<Master Tech>
 
ZVOLV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: California
Default

I had my 1990 240 on the lift today; I noticed torn engine mounts (the cheap ones fail very quickly), coolant coming out of the evaporator drain=bad heater core, and some various small leaks. I recommend paying the hour labor at a shop to have them put it in the air and do an inspection. A lot of stuff cannot be detected from the top.

1. Battery cable- I recommend a good junkyard replacement. Aftermarket stuff is awful.

2. Suspension- see above. Best checked from below. And by a pro.

3. AC- it's r12. I'm not experienced at r134 conversions, but you need to figure out where it leaked out and if the compressor works at a minimum. See if the center of the compressor spins to start.

4. Oil change- yep.

5. Cosmetics- clean flame trap is a member that has a great write up on how to pull the dash.
__________________
No Start Thread
ZVOLV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2017, 03:35 AM   #3
arjunsw
Newbie
 
Join Date: May 2017
Default

1. so this would be going to the junkyard, cutting a nice replacement on, but when i go to reconnect it to mine, would it be soldering or welding or something? Since the new pos terminal already has wire inside of it?

2. That makes sense. I can still get underneath it to look with jack and jackstands, and i'm pretty mechanically inclined, but if need be, i can take it to a pro once i have a couple things for them to do, other than making several trips.

3. So find the green book and dig in the engine bay to find the compressor, and then see if it spins?
arjunsw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2017, 01:47 PM   #4
ZVOLV
<Master Tech>
 
ZVOLV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: California
Default

No cutting of battery cables is the goal. Bolt in a nice replacement. It's quality work like this that will make the car reliable. If you cut and try to crimp on some aftermarket junk it will fail quickly.

AC- it has taken me a while to learn it. I can't type it all out right now, but for a start shove your hand down there and see if the compressor is seized or not.

Do the struts and shocks. Do all blown bushings. It will make the car safe and pleasant to drive. It will also put your mechanical skills to the test.
ZVOLV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2017, 03:05 PM   #5
Tuff240
240 Ninja
 
Tuff240's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Central California
Default

You can buy new oem style battery cables:

https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/vol...40-242-244-245

https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/vol...40-242-244-245


Worked fine in my car:

__________________
"The Parts Counter Guy"
Tuff240 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2017, 03:33 PM   #6
Khrrck
Professional Amateur
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Beaverton, OR
Default

Regarding the paint, if you don't yet have the spotty/patchy look of peeling clear coat, it can probably be buffed and waxed back to a good (although not factory new) state by a competent detailing shop. We can tell you more if you take a couple photos (dry, in good sunlight) for us to look at. Touch-up paint for scratches and dings is available still. Paint code should be on a plate riveted to one of the strut towers.

General stuff before you start it - Pull the spark plugs out and see how clean they look. Never hurts to have replacements on hand. Check color of the transmission fluid if it's an automatic. Replacing the coolant might be a good call too. System takes ~9 qt - a gallon of antifreeze and a gallon or two of DISTILLED water from the supermarket will set you up, since you won't get ALL the old coolant out by draining it.

Look through any records from your grandfather and try to determine when maintenance items (timing and accessory belts, air and fuel filters, etc) were last done. If you don't see it in there, presume it's not been done and should be taken care of in the next couple months.

Cracked front window - is it the windshield or one of the doors? Door glass is user replaceable and can still be found in the junkyard. Windshield is generally not but still obtainable by auto glass shops. Check to see if your insurance has glass coverage, which will cover most of the cost of a windshield replacement.

Suspension - I'd get the expert to look at it and determine what you need before you start buying parts. But just FYI, rear shocks are fairly easy to replace yourself with the car up on stands. One bolt on each end. Penetrating oil may be needed to loosen them up. Your mechanic friend may be able to press new bushings into individual parts for you. Front struts are a job I still really don't want to deal with.
__________________
'87 240 budget wagon.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirty Rick View Post
Navigating the Siskiyous in a 3 wheeled Volvo will not end well.
Khrrck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2017, 07:06 PM   #7
arjunsw
Newbie
 
Join Date: May 2017
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZVOLV View Post
No cutting of battery cables is the goal. Bolt in a nice replacement. It's quality work like this that will make the car reliable. If you cut and try to crimp on some aftermarket junk it will fail quickly.
So when you say bolt, do you mean something like this ?http://g01.a.alicdn.com/kf/HTB1O6ZjG...Xq6xXFXXXa.jpg

Currently my terminal looks like this, so I don't know how I would remove it, without cutting the wires. Could un-crimping it work, without smashing the wires inside?

Any idea of what to look for if I take a peek at the suspension?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuff240 View Post
Dang, your engine bay looks so clean! How long did it take to get it that way??


Heres a picture I have of the hood, it looks like this all around the car too, on the sides and roof.



Spark plugs is a good idea, didnt think of that before. my dad has been keeping it running with the help of a volvo mechanic too, so he says he's gotten diff oil and things like that changed. You can see a bit of the belt in my picture of the Pos battery terminal too.

Its the front window, yeah I could probably get that done through insurance, I might know a mobile glass guy too. Any idea of what to look for in suspension?

Thanks for the help everyone!

Last edited by arjunsw; 06-19-2017 at 01:22 AM..
arjunsw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2017, 07:23 PM   #8
Tuff240
240 Ninja
 
Tuff240's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Central California
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by arjunsw View Post
Dang, your engine bay looks so clean! How long did it take to get it that way??
6 months of nights and weekends.

Judging by your battery terminal pic and you saying it's an 82, you have the rare optional LH1.0 efi.
Tuff240 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-18-2017, 07:26 PM   #9
Tuff240
240 Ninja
 
Tuff240's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Central California
Default

Personally, I'd just buff it all out and rock the patina look. It looks great on that color. If you want it all shiny and perfect with new paint, it will be expensive and a lot of work.
Tuff240 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-19-2017, 01:19 AM   #10
Khrrck
Professional Amateur
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Beaverton, OR
Default

Battery terminals - You just disconnect the cable at both ends and replace the whole thing. You don't replace just the terminal.

That paint's not really "fixable" but you can make it look passable. The splotches will always be there until you repaint.

What I can see of that belt looks good. If it's been getting care from a proper mechanic presumably the maintenance schedule has been followed and the normal "tune up" parts are handled. Give him a call and see what's been done in the last 12-24 months or so. If the coolant and ATF aren't due to be changed yet I would probably just check them for normal appearance and call it good.

Suspension - ZVOLV will be able to summarize better than I, since he's a real mechanic. Basically you want to check all the rubber bushings to see if they're squashed, split or torn. Wheels shouldn't have any play in weird directions. DON'T SHOVE ON ANYTHING WHILE YOU'RE UNDER THE CAR! No weird clunking noises while turning the steering full to either side and/or moving forward and backwards.

"Bounce" the front or rear of the car by shoving on it by hand - once you let go, it should return to normal ride height quickly, and stop with little or no additional bouncing.
Khrrck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-19-2017, 03:13 AM   #11
arjunsw
Newbie
 
Join Date: May 2017
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuff240 View Post
Judging by your battery terminal pic and you saying it's an 82, you have the rare optional LH1.0 efi.
This is the ECU? is having that good or bad haha, there are only 2 links on google and the redirect to this forum.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuff240 View Post
Personally, I'd just buff it all out and rock the patina look. It looks great on that color. If you want it all shiny and perfect with new paint, it will be expensive and a lot of work.
I hadn't really thought about this before, but it makes sense. What does the buffing do? And would i still have to clear coat over it or something like that?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Khrrck View Post
Battery terminals - You just disconnect the cable at both ends and replace the whole thing. You don't replace just the terminal.

If it's been getting care from a proper mechanic presumably the maintenance schedule has been followed and the normal "tune up" parts are handled. Give him a call and see what's been done in the last 12-24 months or so..

Suspension - Basically you want to check all the rubber bushings to see if they're squashed, split or torn. Wheels shouldn't have any play in weird directions. DON'T SHOVE ON ANYTHING WHILE YOU'RE UNDER THE CAR!

"Bounce" the front or rear of the car by shoving on it by hand - once you let go, it should return to normal ride height quickly, and stop with little or no additional bouncing.
Ah, okay. that seems like the more permanent/ future proof option at this point. and ill get some experience poking around in the engine bay too haha.

Yeah, ill try to follow up with him, just asked dad briefly and he remembers spark plugs and pieces like that being changed too.

oh awesome, good to know. I definitely want to have some grasp on it so that seems like a good starting point. I'm assuming no shoving to keep it steady on the jack stands and not fall?

This i have done, and it wasn't like it shook for a minute or something, but it did take a few seconds to resettle.


I'm going to try to order some basic parts, like the battery terminal cable and filters this upcoming week so i can hopefully get it on the road soon!
arjunsw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-19-2017, 01:14 PM   #12
ZVOLV
<Master Tech>
 
ZVOLV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: California
Default

Start with front end steering and suspension. On cement, Jack the front end up using the plate on the center of the crossmember. Jackstands on each side on the jacking points. Chocks under rear tires.

Then start with wiggling the wheels from the side and from the top to feel for play. Lateral play is tie rods or steering balljoint slop. Vertical is wheel bearings. I do this on every car I put in the air.

Then get under it and look for leaks. Your vehicle will not look like tuff 240s. Look at the balljoints and bushings for tears. Look for leaky struts. Look for torn engine mounts.

Clean as much as you can. Throw cardboard down and soak the engine in simple green and brush, rub, spray, blow as much gunk as you can outta there.

Change the trans fluid, power steering fluid, brake fluid, coolant and oil.

Inspect the brake pads.

Then put the rear end up and look for torn bushings. Chock the front tires! And for safety any time you pull a wheel, throw it under the car in case it falls. I have dropped cars and trucks. Wiggle the driveshaft and look for slop. Look for bad trans mount.
ZVOLV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-19-2017, 03:06 PM   #13
Khrrck
Professional Amateur
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Beaverton, OR
Default

This is the sort of thing I was talking about re: stuts and shocks. Obviously it usually won't be this dramatic when worn out. If you aren't losing traction and the struts aren't completely blown/leaking I would personally feel comfortable driving around still.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1W-UMx0qs6w

Rear shocks are easy to replace IF the bolts aren't rusted solid. Did it by myself in a parking lot. Fronts are much more of a pain. Requires spring compressors and some special wrenches. Would avoid if possible.
Khrrck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-19-2017, 03:23 PM   #14
ZVOLV
<Master Tech>
 
ZVOLV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: California
Default

I did the struts on my 400k mile 240 and they said Volvo on them still; likely the originals! Ride is much more stable on the freeway now.
ZVOLV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-19-2017, 05:44 PM   #15
504
below the surface
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: New Orleans
Default

Get a copy of the Bentley repair manual (around $50) and a copy of the Haynes manual, which can be found for around $5 used.
504 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2017, 03:18 PM   #16
arjunsw
Newbie
 
Join Date: May 2017
Default

Sorry for the delay, I got caught up in some other things. My first oil change on another car did go well though!

So far I haven't gotten under the car, but did roll it up the driveway. It looked like there was a leak under the car, my first guess was coolant, because the coolant level was low, and it didn't look dark like oil.

I have some other questions too,
Will i need a new crush washer for the drain pan bolt when i change the oil? If so, where could i get one?
And when i look at parts online, i can never find the '82 240 DL, but i can find the '82 242 DL. Are the 240 and 242 parts interchangeable?
Can I use either the green or orange coolant? Or is there a specific coolant I should be using?
arjunsw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2017, 03:28 PM   #17
ZVOLV
<Master Tech>
 
ZVOLV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: California
Default

Good practice is to swap the washer, but if it's not leaking don't trip.

Green coolant. Just buy the 50/50. Installing tap water will introduce minerals that you don't want in there.

Last edited by ZVOLV; 06-28-2017 at 12:44 PM..
ZVOLV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-27-2017, 03:41 PM   #18
Khrrck
Professional Amateur
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Beaverton, OR
Default

My local hardware store has the copper crush washers - or any auto parts store should have 'em. I always replace them, they're like 25c.

Put down a sheet of white paper on top of some cardboard and stick it where the leak is. See what color it is - green, brown, red, clear?

Most parts are interchangable between 242, 244 and 245 of the same year. Bodywork and interior parts may not change over but the suspension, engine, etc are overall the same.

I use generic green coolant. 50/50 premix to top up is quick and easy. If you're draining and filling the whole thing, I would buy a gallon of distilled water and a gallon of 100% coolant.
Khrrck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2017, 08:23 PM   #19
arjunsw
Newbie
 
Join Date: May 2017
Default

Whew! Definitely took my time with this one hahah. But i finally got all the tools and parts, and got it up and running today! It almost stalled, but after giving it some gas and running it for 5 to 10 minutes it sounded great! I felt like i could hear the fuel injectors too, am i going crazy or is that normal?

Also, turns out i made a mistake with the title, as its not a 240, its a 245, B21F engine, with a M46 transmission, and LH 1.0 EFI

The things that I did were
  • Put fuel/carbon cleaner in tank, going to fill it up with 92 octane just to be safe
  • checked the transmission oil, there was a small drip coming from the bottom of the bell housing, Tightened the closest bolt. Checked it's oil level, was still very full so i didnt fill it anymore, changed the check port bolt's washer.
  • changed oil, had to buy a 1 inch socket since my set only went up to 7/8ths. Cranked it to 35 ft/lbs.
  • filled with coolant, had concentrate and distilled water on hand so used that instead of 50/50 mix. Ran it to mix it up, and used a weight tester to see how it was doing, looked good.
  • found the big leak, it was actually just old oil on the steering rack. The one i thought was coolant was the transmission oil. Ill have to double check some more just to be safe, but those were the two that were actually dripping.

Some things i'd like to do next
  • Tachometer. There's no tach in there right now, do i really need one? I was thinking of using a set like this so i could still have a clock.
  • R12 to R134a, im sure someone else on the forum has already done such a thing, so ill look into that. I still have to double check the compressor.
  • Clean the engine bay, its pretty dirty. Ill have to douse it in simple green and do what ZVOLV said. That way I can try to find leaks better too.
  • Ill check spark plugs and brake pads as well, just to be safe. Theres still a lot of tread on the tires too, hopefully there not too dry rotten.
  • New one: restoring the chrome/shiny bits. the pieces around the window have dulled and have turned black, is there any way to restore them?

This is all i could think of right now, ill add more or post again if i remember more. Hopefully its okay that i keep bumping this thread instead of making new threads!

Last edited by arjunsw; 08-12-2017 at 01:11 AM..
arjunsw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2017, 09:34 PM   #20
TestPoint
Board Member
 
TestPoint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Ellijay
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by arjunsw View Post
  • R12 to R134a, im sure someone else on the forum has already done such a thing, so ill look into that. I still have to double check the compressor.
Connect a refrigerant meter to the low side of the system to see if you still have some/any pressure if the system has been converted. That can be as simple as one of the built in gauges on a refill can.

If the A/C has NOT already been converted to R134a the simple solution is to use one of the R12 replacements. They are compatible with the minerial oil used in the early systems. It is hard to find a shop that still has the R12 recovery equipment.

Any system this old and not functioning needs to have the dryer and expansion valve replaced which means that the system should be evacuated and all the 'O' rings replaced. Only after you get all that back together can you tell how much noise the old compressor is making. That means that a complete update is probably in your future.
__________________


1982 Volvo 245 with a Ford 302 V8

Ford V8 Conversion Manual -
http://forums.turbobricks.com/showthread.php?t=250257

Bertone Restoration - http://forums.turbobricks.com/showthread.php?t=256460
TestPoint is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2017, 10:54 PM   #21
arjunsw
Newbie
 
Join Date: May 2017
Default

Luckily I still have an old r12 manifold, should I try using that to test the pressure?

Is the r12 replacement just a conversion kit? I know that while my grandfather had it, he had disconnected the A/C to keep the load on the engine low(?), So it hasn't been used much.

So the best option, given that the old compressor doesn't work, is just a replacement of everything sans hoses?
arjunsw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-12-2017, 07:15 AM   #22
TestPoint
Board Member
 
TestPoint's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Ellijay
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by arjunsw View Post
Luckily I still have an old r12 manifold, should I try using that to test the pressure?

Is the r12 replacement just a conversion kit?

So the best option, given that the old compressor doesn't work, is just a replacement of everything sans hoses?
Any way you can get a gauge on the suction side.

The kit is just the low/high fill/test ports but that is not all to the conversion. The mineral oil used in R12 systems is not compatible with R134.

If the compressor is indeed dead a complete rebuild is really called for. The mineral oil is spread throughout the system and needs to be flushed. The dryer needs to be replaced if the system is opened. The expansion valve is certainly clogged in a 30+ year old system.
TestPoint is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:18 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.