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Old 11-10-2017, 11:25 PM   #1
stiligFox
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Default Front Sway Bar 960

So I’ve run into a conundrum -

A couple years ago I installed a 25mm front 9/7xx sway bar and the matching rear bar in my wagon. (1992 6cyl 960) The bar seems a bit different that the ones in the pictures in that it sticks out pretty far.

It fits but when you lift the car up, the bar rests on the engine block and oil filter, meaning that to change the oil you have to raise and lower the car several times. My mechanic said it shouldn’t be an issue driving unless I’m getting air going over a bump (I wish I had that much power).

So I know these things are designed for 4cyl cars and IPD will say they aren’t compatible with 960s. I originally had a 19mm bar in there, and I’m thinking of putting a Volvo 23mm bar in so that everything will be in the right place.

Will a 23F/25R set up handle much (if any) different than the 25F/25R iPD bars? Any concerns mixing Volvo and iPD?

Thanks guys!
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Old 11-11-2017, 08:52 AM   #2
DET17
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I've had good luck with a 25mm IPD front and factory wagon 19mm rear. Many others report the same findings (thread by Jerry perhaps less than a year ago in PF). I've always been told the early 960s are dead nuts identical to the 940s insofar as front sways and many other items. I think it's 96+ that might be different.

BEWARE of bent "used" IPD sways..... I got a rear bar from a junkyard car in AZ. If you still have your stocker 24mm front bar, let's see a picture of them side by side.

Last thing - I was taught from the Herb Adams suspension guide, that front sways should be "neutral" installed at ride height. With the Cloud on front stands, loosen those front sway links, and then sneak up on either side of the bar with the adjustment nuts. Are your end links adjustable or fixed? I think there are at least 2 type used on the 9 series. I run some MVP adjustables.... pics should be in my build somewhere.
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Old 11-12-2017, 06:31 PM   #3
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Well - the reason I'm wanting to switch back to an OE bar is because while it works fine it seems when all four wheels are on the ground, the tires rub on the bar when turned all the way, and the oil filter is inaccessible. Here's my original 21mm bar:


And the IPD bar I installed:


As you can see the iPD bar sticks out further in the front, and that's what's hitting the engine block and blocking access to the filter when the car is up in the air. Does anyone here know if IPD ever made a bar that fit 960's properly? I see they've started producing them again, but the site still says it is incompatible with my car specifically.

So yeah - main questions is, will the car handle much differently going from 25mm in the front and 25 in the rear, to 23mm in the front and 25 in the rear? Will I notice much at all?

Thanks guys!
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Old 11-14-2017, 08:33 AM   #4
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i think the car will handle noticeably different but only when driving on the limit or on slippery surface. Remember that going from a stock bar to an IPD bar is very noticeable so going back the other way will also be very noticeable. Specially when you keep the rear IPD bar.
the car will lift the inner rear wheel earlier when rounding a sharp corner. This could result in earlier oversteer. (back-end losing grip)

the thing with s/bars is that they are a matched set and they provide a balance. (OEM chassis developers most often make a concious design choice to have a balance that favors understeer, just because it is the safest setup for avaridge skilled drivers)
if you change 1 s/bar that balance will change as well, it depends on what kind of change you made if that change is for the better or worse.

Last edited by Janspeed; 11-14-2017 at 08:42 AM..
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Old 11-14-2017, 12:10 PM   #5
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If changing back to the front 24 mm bar you still have the option of a 19 mm rear bar.
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Old 11-16-2017, 12:15 PM   #6
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Thanks guys!

Since I only do day to day driving and generally max 80 on the highway, will the bigger back sway still be safe? Or should I get he 19 rear? (Keep in mind for the first 20 years my car had no sway at in the back and would fish tail a lot in the rain)

I feel going from 25 to 19 in the back is going to be a massive change if I do that...
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Old 11-16-2017, 01:57 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lummert View Post
If changing back to the front 24 mm bar you still have the option of a 19 mm rear bar.
The 19mm rear bar actually gives the rear suspension the chance to "articulate".... and work.

While the 25/25 might create nice drift machines, for all purpose (and surface) driving, I'll always vote for a 19mm rear bar with a 24/25 front. TB voice of experience/urban legend says that a difference of 5mm F to R is the right ratio for brick RWD performance.
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Old 11-16-2017, 04:50 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DET17 View Post
The 19mm rear bar actually gives the rear suspension the chance to "articulate".... and work.

While the 25/25 might create nice drift machines, for all purpose (and surface) driving, I'll always vote for a 19mm rear bar with a 24/25 front. TB voice of experience/urban legend says that a difference of 5mm F to R is the right ratio for brick RWD performance.
I'm also running 24mm/19mm f/r.
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Old 11-16-2017, 10:26 PM   #9
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I've got a 25 rear 19 front
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Old 12-31-2017, 01:49 PM   #10
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Late response, but I installed the '92-'94 960 24mm sway to my '91 745. And added a 19mm to the rear since the wagons don't have one. It does help to level out the car without any surprises.
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Old 12-31-2017, 02:48 PM   #11
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A 23 front paired with a 25 rear will likely make the car oversteer/tail happy.
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Old 12-31-2017, 03:11 PM   #12
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More sway bar will (all other things being equal) make that end of the car LESS grippy. For max grip you need suspension movement. Sways resist suspension movement, therefor taking away grip.

Sway bars are installed to keep the car "flat" through the corners, which means Mom doesn't spill her box of wine on the way home from the market.

To make a dorifto car, max those sways out so the back end can slide around. To make a rally car that can grip in the dirt, toss those sways in the garbage and let the car get it's lean on.
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Old 01-02-2018, 02:57 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by 2manyturbos View Post
A 23 front paired with a 25 rear will likely make the car oversteer/tail happy.
Ding; this is my experience.
It kinda looks to me like the pic of the IPD bar may be the 'drop' bar for the V6 cars. The 'regular' IPD front bars I have had, and I have had/now have about 6, all have been about the same bends as the stocker.
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Old 01-02-2018, 12:49 PM   #14
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^^ That's exactly what he has there, a "drop" bar. Take a look at this for sale thread and you will see that a set of standard bars copies the bends of the OEM 4 cylinder bars.

http://forums.turbobricks.com/showthread.php?t=338534
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Old 01-02-2018, 05:43 PM   #15
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Huh, thanks for all the new responses guys! I had my original 21mm front bar and a OEM rear 19mm bar put on - I have a 22mm OEM front now but it needs a little prep work first.

So I've got a V6 bar then - what kind of car does it go to? The only V6 7/9 series that I know of are the few 780s with the V6 engine...

Also - does this mean that a regular iPD bar will fit around my 6 Cyl? I don't think so as IPD still lists it as incompatible with my car... Honestly I'm happy with what I have now

Thanks guys!
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Old 01-02-2018, 06:12 PM   #16
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V6 or V8 conversion bar, also, diesel.
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Old 01-02-2018, 07:45 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stiligFox View Post
So I've got a V6 bar then - what kind of car does it go to? The only V6 7/9 series that I know of are the few 780s with the V6 engine...

Also - does this mean that a regular iPD bar will fit around my 6 Cyl? I don't think so as IPD still lists it as incompatible with my car... Honestly I'm happy with what I have now
760 has had V6 and few early 960. Also I think some of the 960 special models like ambulance, hearse, etc.

I've now done four whiteblock conversions into a 740 originally with a redblock. Stock 4cyl front swaybar goes nicely if engine mounts are in good shape and car a little lowered(angle of the swaybar changes). If they are tired, engine almost resting on crossmember, then there is barely enough space between oil pan and swaybar. If there is not enough clearance, you can drop the bar a bit if your car is not lowered a lot.
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Old 01-10-2018, 03:19 AM   #18
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Hey all! I have an interested buyer but my question is - so if this “drop” bar is meant for bigger engines, would it work for a regular 940? I’m not sure how redblocks are laid out down there..
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Old 01-10-2018, 01:50 PM   #19
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Yes it will.
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Old 01-11-2018, 01:17 AM   #20
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Thanks!
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