home register FAQ memberlist calendar

Go Back   Turbobricks Forums > Mechanical > projects & restorations

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-20-2019, 03:20 PM   #1
fatcatbestcat
Board Member
 
fatcatbestcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Toronto, ON (Canada)
Default Hacked: Getting a '67 144S Back On the Road

Right, before we get to the images, some backstory. I was looking for a project car to fill my time, and I'd gotten into the routine of checking my local Kijiji classifieds for unwanted projects. I narrowed it down to these three cars;

1) A 1969 Buick Riviera with a 425 - $800 (it sold like, the day after the ad was posted)
2) A 1976 Mercedes 300D which was mint, just in pieces (sold the day I called the seller up)
3) A 1996 Impala SS (the owner never got back to me)

So then, Kijiji refreshed, and applied filters that I hadn't checked before (usually, I filter out cars under $500 to get rid of those plebs with '59 Impalas listed for $59). The first ad that came up was for this car, a 1967 Volvo 144S. For $200. I rang the seller up and he confirmed the price was accurate. I drove up the next day to see if it was legit, and a month later, it was delivered. In total, for the car, the parts included, the U-Haul trailer fee and gas money cost me $530.

I realize I'll probably spend well over ten times that on it, but hey, it's a neat car.
The car's a '67, but the previous owner swapped in a B20B, M41 O/D transmission and a later-model rear-end.


The grill is held in with nothing but hopes and dreams. This car came with ZERO fasteners or bolts.


The engine. Note that I have a fiberglass FR fender, and a mismatched steel FL. Also, the tires are 165 spares.


Apparently the fiberglass fenders take different bolts than the steel ones. Fun.


While the interior is terrible, the floors are rust-free.


Some of the parts included with the car. I need to find a new rear bench (since this one doesn't exist).


The car came with five of those steelies (with Volvo hubcaps) and five of those 'Corona' rims.


This is definitely the car's worse side. You can see how small my garage is.


The view from the driver's seat. Note the original blue paint. Hopefully I don't get hantavirus or something.


This is the worst of the rust on the car. I have patch panels, and a welder.


I just had to resize like six images. RIP
__________________
Send help
fatcatbestcat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2019, 03:26 PM   #2
hiperfauto
The Librarian
 
hiperfauto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: So Cal
Default

Something's fishy. The car has a '72 wood grained dash and short shifter but the door handles are '67-'71.

What's the VIN #?
hiperfauto is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2019, 03:30 PM   #3
fatcatbestcat
Board Member
 
fatcatbestcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Toronto, ON (Canada)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hiperfauto View Post
Something's fishy. The car has a '72 wood grained dash and short shifter but the door handles are '67-'71.

What's the VIN #?
According to the registration, it's a '67, but I'll look again.
Ok...on the paperwork, the VIN is 11930.... that doesn't seem right.
fatcatbestcat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2019, 03:53 PM   #4
hiperfauto
The Librarian
 
hiperfauto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: So Cal
Default

It could be correct. 11930 is in the range for a '67 144.



Was the dash swapped and a late tunnel welded in?
hiperfauto is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2019, 04:09 PM   #5
fatcatbestcat
Board Member
 
fatcatbestcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Toronto, ON (Canada)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hiperfauto View Post

Was the dash swapped and a late tunnel welded in?
I have no clue. I only know of the engine/trans/diff swap and the grill being different.
fatcatbestcat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-20-2019, 04:29 PM   #6
hiperfauto
The Librarian
 
hiperfauto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: So Cal
Default

The grill is correct for a '67 but the front panel has been swapped for a later one. Early front panels didn't have the vertical vent slits between the bumper brackets.
hiperfauto is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2019, 12:33 PM   #7
fatcatbestcat
Board Member
 
fatcatbestcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Toronto, ON (Canada)
Default

Update:

Been a while since I've really done anything to the car, I've instead been doing mostly research and doing parts runs, as well as figuring out exactly what I'm going to need for the car.
My biggest obstacle at the moment is finding bolts and fasteners for the car, since the car came with very few (if any). Every time I try and mount a part to the car, I cry because I need to pay $60 to get two or so bolts shipped direct from Europe. What I SHOULD do is make a list of all the bolts I'm missing, and actually, that's what I will do.

-Bolts for the fenders (the FR is fiberglass and takes different bolts from the steel FL)
-Hood hinge bolts
-bolt to mount the hinge to the hood
-Seat mounting bracket bolts
-probably some more that I haven't found yet

EDIT: I also figured out what's going on with the car (in terms of mismatched parts).
The body shell and doors are from a '67 car (a factory 144S), but sometime around 1981, a previous owner painted it red (it was originally blue), swapped in a B20 and M41 from a '69 car, and replaced most of the interior components with 70's parts. The grille is from a '69 144S, apparently.

In the meantime, I got some really important parts as well as some aspirational items that I'd like to put on the car, but really don't need to.

-Vital: brand new bosch starter
-Vital: brand new fuel pump - no bolts for it >:(
-NE: MSD 6A Box
-NE: 'D' profile cam
-NE: used B20F cylinder head (I'm probably going to have it shaved down to try and get 10.5:1 compression so I can make that extra 3 horsepower)
-NE: Cloyes aluminum timing gear set (when I change the cam, I might as well)
-NE: Linkage kit for the redline DCOE manifold that came with the car - despite them being the same brand and the salesperson assuring me that it's the right kit, the heim joints are way too big, so I'll probably either get new joints, or drill the manifold's holes bigger.
-NE: vibration mounts for DCOEs

On a side note, I got the airbox off, and found a hole in the air cleaner element. Looking further, I found a squirrel's nest inside the airbox. The carbs seemed to be stuffed with stuff, so that'll be fun.

Last edited by fatcatbestcat; 11-08-2019 at 12:48 PM.. Reason: yes
fatcatbestcat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2019, 03:17 PM   #8
Duder
Comes with a free Frogurt
 
Duder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Torrance, CA
Default

Do you have a bolt supply house or well-stocked hardware store somewhere in driving distance? I find that's the most cost effective way to get a bunch of hardware quickly for a project. Get a set of thread gages so you can check the nut plates and threaded holes in the car to determine needed thread size & pitch, then estimate lengths and make a list. I don't think you need to be ordering most of your nuts & bolts from Sweden unless there are some really unique / specific ones that are missing.

Vintage Volvos used a lot of Imperial fasteners with a few metric sprinkled in, and then at some point they went full metric. I'm sure Ian can chime in with the year (or year range) that changeover happened, but I think a 1967 car should be mostly Imperial (inch) fasteners. Are those commonly available at your local hardware store in Candanavia? For stuff like fenders, lights, and cosmetic parts a lower grade should be fine. Use Grade 8 for anything safety related, Grade 5 should be fine for most mechanical parts.

Looks like it should be a fun project...
Duder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2019, 03:45 PM   #9
Tfrasca
Board Member
 
Tfrasca's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Ben Lomond, CA
Default

Nice find. Really weird that all the fasteners are gone. My '68 had all imperial fasteners, by the way.
Tfrasca is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2019, 11:28 AM   #10
fatcatbestcat
Board Member
 
fatcatbestcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Toronto, ON (Canada)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duder View Post
Do you have a bolt supply house or well-stocked hardware store somewhere in driving distance? I find that's the most cost effective way to get a bunch of hardware quickly for a project. Get a set of thread gages so you can check the nut plates and threaded holes in the car to determine needed thread size & pitch, then estimate lengths and make a list. I don't think you need to be ordering most of your nuts & bolts from Sweden unless there are some really unique / specific ones that are missing.

Vintage Volvos used a lot of Imperial fasteners with a few metric sprinkled in, and then at some point they went full metric. I'm sure Ian can chime in with the year (or year range) that changeover happened, but I think a 1967 car should be mostly Imperial (inch) fasteners. Are those commonly available at your local hardware store in Candanavia? For stuff like fenders, lights, and cosmetic parts a lower grade should be fine. Use Grade 8 for anything safety related, Grade 5 should be fine for most mechanical parts.

Looks like it should be a fun project...
I probably quoted too much there, but my local hardware store seems to have certain bolts, but not in nearly the quantity that I'm going to need them. I'm sure if I go downtown, I'd be able to find what I need though. Also, it does appear that most of these bolts are imperial.

An obstacle that I'm running into is the FR fender (the white fiberglass one) using a different bolt pattern from the FL. I have, like, 2 bolts to start with for the FL at least, but the only thing holding the FR in is hopes and dreams.
fatcatbestcat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2019, 12:03 PM   #11
Redwood Chair
K-jet For Life
 
Redwood Chair's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: - Stock PSI Or Bust -
Default

McMaster has bags of SS bolts pretty cheap.

Well not TBcheap™ but real world cheap compared to buying onesies at your hardware store.
__________________
Raise The Lowered


Image hosted by servimg.com

Quote:
Originally Posted by hiperfauto View Post
Folks on here don't know a good deal when they see it.
how psi stock cna support?

Redwood Chair is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-2019, 11:16 PM   #12
fatcatbestcat
Board Member
 
fatcatbestcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Toronto, ON (Canada)
Default

Update:

I've been avoiding working on the car since the 11th because it's well below 0 C outside, and there's like a foot of snow on the ground. My PC crashed, so I made myself an excuse to go outside before work. I actually got the chance to function test the carbs a bit. With them mounted on the engine, with all the linkage, the chokes don't open. While the throttle linkage does move, the actual throttle valves are stuck. I took the carbs off, and tried to free them with WD-40 followed by lithium grease and all of my strength. Nothing. Either I'm into a rebuild or replacing them.

Also, my speedometer is in MPH, so that's changing.
The odometer reads 291,000 miles / 404,000 km.

Considering the possibility of buying a non-running 164 as a parts car. Please advise.

(Also for anyone that had read any previous posts about the car, I've dropped any idea of a budget for the car. I'll buy what I need to, but I'm trying to stay reasonable.)

Last edited by fatcatbestcat; 11-13-2019 at 11:18 PM.. Reason: yes
fatcatbestcat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2019, 11:13 AM   #13
vwbusman66
Stößelstange über alles!
 
vwbusman66's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Kingsville, MD
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fatcatbestcat View Post
Update:

I've been avoiding working on the car since the 11th because it's well below 0 C outside, and there's like a foot of snow on the ground. My PC crashed, so I made myself an excuse to go outside before work. I actually got the chance to function test the carbs a bit. With them mounted on the engine, with all the linkage, the chokes don't open. While the throttle linkage does move, the actual throttle valves are stuck. I took the carbs off, and tried to free them with WD-40 followed by lithium grease and all of my strength. Nothing. Either I'm into a rebuild or replacing them.

Also, my speedometer is in MPH, so that's changing.
The odometer reads 291,000 miles / 404,000 km.

Considering the possibility of buying a non-running 164 as a parts car. Please advise.

(Also for anyone that had read any previous posts about the car, I've dropped any idea of a budget for the car. I'll buy what I need to, but I'm trying to stay reasonable.)
Pro tip: WD40 is not a good penetrating oil. Get yourself, at the least, some PB blaster, or some Gibb's or Kroil. WD40 is an excellent water displacing aerosol.

I would soak them in a penetrating oil, and if that fails, soak the bottom portion of the carb (with the throttle shaft) in something like ATF mixed 50/50 with acetone.

Worst comes to worse, google "tom bryant SU carbs" and send him an email. His rebuild cost for a pair is extremely reasonable for the quality of work.
__________________
1971 142 beater/fake racecar
1972 145 sh*t hauler
Quote:
Originally Posted by linuxman51 View Post
the only problem with that is what you define as cheap and fast
Quote:
Originally Posted by propav8r
The incest is implied.
vwbusman66 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2019, 04:19 PM   #14
fatcatbestcat
Board Member
 
fatcatbestcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Toronto, ON (Canada)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vwbusman66 View Post
Pro tip: WD40 is not a good penetrating oil. Get yourself, at the least, some PB blaster, or some Gibb's or Kroil. WD40 is an excellent water displacing aerosol.

I would soak them in a penetrating oil, and if that fails, soak the bottom portion of the carb (with the throttle shaft) in something like ATF mixed 50/50 with acetone.

Worst comes to worse, google "tom bryant SU carbs" and send him an email. His rebuild cost for a pair is extremely reasonable for the quality of work.
Yeah, I figured that WD-40 isn't so good, it's just what I had on hand. I'll probably head to my parts store pretty soon and try and get my hands on some solid rust penetrant.

I looked up tom bryant, and the guy's in Maine. Ground shipping costs alone make me not want to send them out that far. I'll try and find someone local, if I can't get a hold of anyone, I'll start looking at replacement carbs.
fatcatbestcat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2019, 10:19 PM   #15
vwbusman66
Stößelstange über alles!
 
vwbusman66's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Kingsville, MD
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by fatcatbestcat View Post
Yeah, I figured that WD-40 isn't so good, it's just what I had on hand. I'll probably head to my parts store pretty soon and try and get my hands on some solid rust penetrant.

I looked up tom bryant, and the guy's in Maine. Ground shipping costs alone make me not want to send them out that far. I'll try and find someone local, if I can't get a hold of anyone, I'll start looking at replacement carbs.
Where in Canada are you? You may have a better time just un-seizing them yourself and rebuilding them. They aren't that hard to rebuild yourself (if a curmudgeon like me can do it, anyone can).
vwbusman66 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2020, 06:00 PM   #16
fatcatbestcat
Board Member
 
fatcatbestcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Toronto, ON (Canada)
Default

Alright, it's been almost a full year since I've posted at all on this forum. It's the summer now, and I can actually get working on the car again (was really hard to work in the winter because, y'know - cold). A lot of what I've been doing recently has largely revolved around troubleshooting and future plans for the car. The #1 thing on my to-do list is getting the engine running, and I'm hoping that everything else will just kinda fall into place. The car, as far as I'm aware, hasn't run since 2009 and hasn't been on the road since 2002.

It took me a good while to gather parts and enough tools to start taking the engine apart after I figured out it was totally seized. I can't get it to turn with a 4-foot breaker bar. I had some trouble getting the head bolts off too, but a torque wrench set to 150 ft-lbs and some brake fluid (as penetrating oil) did the trick.

Anyway, this is what I found when I took the head off. The rust in #1 just looks like it's on the surface, and peeled off with my fingernails, so I don't think there's any significant cylinder wall damage. No bad ring ridge either. The pistons are completely unmarked (no 'std' or '0.30' markings), which might mean this has never been rebuilt - not sure, but a dial-bore gauge will let me know.







A rebuild shouldn't be that big an issue for me at home. I'll have to get a stand and hoist, sure, but I have most of the parts I'm going to need (B20F head and 'D' cam as well as some timing components I was going to install anyway).

On an unrelated note, the SU carbs I was having trouble with in earlier posts turned out to work fine, but I realized that only after I'd cut the choke cables to remove them. I have Weber 45s, so that's probably going to end up on the car instead of the SUs anyway.
fatcatbestcat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2020, 07:01 PM   #17
GTJordan
Been here for too long
 
GTJordan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Edmonton AB
Default

Where in Canada are you? I have a huge selection of parts for the old cars here in Edmonton.

Jordan
__________________
80 242- 2.5L 16V, NIW intake/exhaust, T5, Porsche brakes, short billies and Kaplenkhe suspension, Trutrack.
Project Thread- http://www.turbobricks.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=324470
GTJordan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2020, 08:05 PM   #18
fatcatbestcat
Board Member
 
fatcatbestcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Toronto, ON (Canada)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTJordan View Post
Where in Canada are you? I have a huge selection of parts for the old cars here in Edmonton.

Jordan
A bit far. Toronto, ON.
fatcatbestcat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2020, 09:10 PM   #19
brickcupra
Board Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Chicago Il
Default Hello Toronto

Hello , fellow turbo bricker !!!!
Im in Chicago but Ive been in Toronto( City) Its a nice city. Ive been to that Island with the ferry and Ive spent the whole day there. I also went to korean town or so.
Nice new project. I have a 92 wagon with a 7mgte, is here.
Good luck and God speed with the car
Take care
DZ
brickcupra is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2020, 04:59 PM   #20
fatcatbestcat
Board Member
 
fatcatbestcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Toronto, ON (Canada)
Default

Great news today - a combination of 3-stage rust oil and a torque wrench managed to break the engine loose. Now I can turn it over freely, and the water pump appears to turn and work as well. Alternator is still stuck, but that's better than having to rebuild the whole engine.

There was a bit of surface rust in the #1 cylinder, but I was able to polish it out with 0000 steel wool, and there's no real scratchiness or cylinder wall taper as far as I can tell. I also hit the piston tops with the wool, revealing a small 'D' stamped into each one. The same thing is stamped into the top surface of the block. Can anyone tell me what that means?
fatcatbestcat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2020, 07:40 PM   #21
hiperfauto
The Librarian
 
hiperfauto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: So Cal
Default

In mass production, machining can vary a little when boring a block so they make pistons slightly under and over size in order to keep tolerances within spec. The blocks are measured after machining and stamped with the letter of the correct size piston to use. The matching letter pistons are then installed.
hiperfauto is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2020, 07:57 PM   #22
fatcatbestcat
Board Member
 
fatcatbestcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Toronto, ON (Canada)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hiperfauto View Post
In mass production, machining can vary a little when boring a block so they make pistons slightly under and over size in order to keep tolerances within spec. The blocks are measured after machining and stamped with the letter of the correct size piston to use. The matching letter pistons are then installed.
Huh. You learn something new every day. Thanks!
fatcatbestcat is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:51 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.