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Old 12-02-2013, 06:04 PM   #26
Bensin
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So, to be clear, first time was flush that caused problems? Drain method changes approx. 3 qts or at least that was happened on my last drain n' change.
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Old 12-02-2013, 06:40 PM   #27
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So, to be clear, first time was flush that caused problems? Drain method changes approx. 3 qts or at least that was happened on my last drain n' change.
My overdrive went away on the first flush using Dex/Merc from O'Reillys.

Did a second flush thinking that doing it twice would mean 3/4 of the fluid would be new, and maybe the first flush would remove some contaminants.

The third flush was based on the fact that since overdrive was slow to begin with requiring the tranny to be warm it had to do with viscosity. This led to the switch to synthetic. Also there was lots of crap in there, so the in line filter was added to be taken out later once the magnet pulled out some of the crud. The pan draining only gets 2-3 quarts so this went out the return line draining then filling until the fluid was pretty ruby red.

This is just data, and wanted to put up my experiences good or bad so that someone else might not blow 100 bucks on synthetic expecting a fix. Got a perfectly working three speed auto now, and it will take a used tranny and teardown of mine to fix properly. As for the merits of synthetic from the get go that has merit and data each way and seems to be a separate discussion that has been brought up a lot.
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Old 12-02-2013, 06:50 PM   #28
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Filter still installed? Remove it...

I re-ringed a B23F and before hooking up to AW71L, I replaced transmission's oil pump ($111.00 or so), and replaced lockup torque converter with rebuilt ($150.00).

Vehicle is 1993-944, with some 1/4 million miles....I have no idea what line pressures were, but with a new pump, it should be close to specs, in theory.

Looking at Viscosity index via Chief Oil:

Dexron II - 164

Dexron III - 197

Dexron VI - 151

Dexron Full Synthetic - 178

Going to Dex-VI from Dex-III might not be a wise idea if your pump was not upto specs.

If line pressure is needed to engage OD...and yours suffer...well!

Dex VI starts out a bit thinner, but is very, very shear stable. MUCH moreso than Dex III. Dex III has been shown to shear to well below the viscosity of Dex VI in well under 30k miles. However, I've also read reports regarding the backwards compatibility of it, aka, some have posted good results, some haven't. I wouldn't ward off it, but would definitely advise that YMMV.


If it's a question of line pressures, get a trans pressure gauge and find the factory pressure specs and start testing.
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Old 12-02-2013, 08:33 PM   #29
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Dex VI starts out a bit thinner, but is very, very shear stable. MUCH moreso than Dex III. Dex III has been shown to shear to well below the viscosity of Dex VI in well under 30k miles. However, I've also read reports regarding the backwards compatibility of it, aka, some have posted good results, some haven't. I wouldn't ward off it, but would definitely advise that YMMV.


If it's a question of line pressures, get a trans pressure gauge and find the factory pressure specs and start testing.

I did get all three sets of the factory manual and can do that. Also, the overdrive is not too deep into the tranny. Repair is now an option, possibly with the engine in place when the motor is yanked in the spring and the car is down for a bit.

This has to be crud in the passages or else not enough pressure.

The final bit of info is that earlier on it took revving it up 75 mph to get the solenoid to engage the first time, then it was smooth after that. It looks like there is some sort of centrigual force speed sensor deep in the tranny. That could also be crud impinged.

Anyway, this thread gave me tons of insight and now just slapping a used tranny with it's problems in there is not the first choice.
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Old 12-02-2013, 11:53 PM   #30
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it took revving it up 75 mph to get the solenoid to engage the first time,...
Line pressure low, maybe.

I had to make a quick mount to replace oil pump. At rear transmission mount, there is 4" or so angle iron that attaches (bolts) to transmission's rear mount and that board. I used an used truck diesel liner to slide over tail-shaft so end of board and liner are level to floor.

Btw, tranny must be in vertical position to take apart

Last edited by 84B23F; 12-03-2013 at 12:12 AM..
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Old 12-03-2013, 12:10 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by 84B23F View Post

Btw, tranny must be in vertical position to take apart
Doh! Another plan goes out the window.

Thanks for that info. Your post and some of the others really gave lots of sound options and things to start troubleshooting.
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Old 12-03-2013, 12:16 AM   #32
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Doh! Another plan goes out the window.

.
Transmission can not stand on rear flange...that's why the board/liner was used.
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Old 12-03-2013, 01:30 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by 84B23F View Post
Filter still installed? Remove it...

I re-ringed a B23F and before hooking up to AW71L, I replaced transmission's oil pump ($111.00 or so), and replaced lockup torque converter with rebuilt ($150.00).

Vehicle is 1993-944, with some 1/4 million miles....I have no idea what line pressures were, but with a new pump, it should be close to specs, in theory.

Looking at Viscosity index via Chief Oil:

Dexron II - 164

Dexron III - 197

Dexron VI - 151

Dexron Full Synthetic - 178

Going to Dex-VI from Dex-III might not be a wise idea if your pump was not upto specs.

If line pressure is needed to engage OD...and yours suffer...well!
As far as the viscosity index Mobil One seems to split the difference (and remember it has nothing to do with Dex VI). Everything right now points to not enough pressure from the pump. When I did the flush the fluid took a while to pump out two quarts. The pressure test will be the objective proof.

Here is the data from the Mobil One technical resources I looked up:

Typical Properties

Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF

Viscosity, cSt (ASTM D445)

@ 40 ºC 36.3

@ 100 ºC 7.4

Viscosity Index 176

Brookfield Viscosity, cP (ASTM D2983)

@ -40º C 10,040

Pour Point, ºC (ASTM D97) -51

Flash Point, ºC (ASTM D92) 220

Density @15.6 ºC g/ml (ASTM D4052) 0.846

Color Red

Last edited by OldGrandpaTune; 12-03-2013 at 01:32 PM.. Reason: data sheet was funky on cut and paste
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Old 12-03-2013, 01:36 PM   #34
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So lots of here and there. What fluid should I buy!!! haha.
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Old 12-03-2013, 03:55 PM   #35
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What fluid should I buy!!! haha.

Viscosity Index - If older transmission, use a higher numbered.

Valoline has suggested their MAXLIFE™ DEX/MERC ATF is good for

GM DEXRON II, DEXRON III and DEXRON VI applications


but their viscosity index is around 156, I would find a Dexron III-H only product; one will take a small pinch on fuel economy, but with Viscosity Index around 190s, it should have good transmission oil pressure.

Transmax DEX/MERC - Meets DEXRON®–III H requirements. Also satisfies requirements of DEXRON®, DEXRON®–III, IIE, and II. Do not use this ATF in applications calling for DEXRON®–VI.



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Old 12-03-2013, 03:56 PM   #36
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230,000klm on the transmission and it's probably got original fluid. Was pink when I bought it, turning brown now 40,000klm later.
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Old 12-03-2013, 03:59 PM   #37
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I talked to a local transmission guy that has done this for 31 years and is all over the AW71. He is going to check out the fluid pressure, cable and other things for free and said all the right things about the transmission so far.

His shop has a jillion five star reviews for both knowledge and fixing only what is required so going to hand this off.

Clint Eastwood as Harry Callahan summed this up well:

"A man's got to know his limitations"
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Old 12-03-2013, 10:08 PM   #38
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Whoa - three flushes! There is much written about synthetic oil being super slippery, and drying up seals because it's so slippery causing leaks, and effectively cleaning out engines, I would guess the same is true for synthetic ATF. An old and abused transmission may not adapt easily to synthetic ATF - too much gunk cleaned out and being moved around? It could be the AW71 just needs more viscosity as note above - it will be interesting what transmission shop finds - keep us posted!
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Old 01-25-2014, 06:56 PM   #39
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I'm curious about how this turns out, too- as of last week my OD started waiting untill ~40mph to engage at light throttle when the car is cold, still shifts great warm. I'm debating swapping with valvoline maxlife, but maybe good old fashioned dex III might be the best bet by the looks of this.
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Old 06-29-2014, 05:24 PM   #40
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Default What is the best ATF for AW70?

Title says it all.

I am looking to do a drain and fill on my trans. I have 120k on my 240 nd 1st to 2nd sometimes goes in to gear a little hard at low speed. I thought by using a high end fluid this would help. Any and all suggestions are welcome. Thanks
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Old 06-29-2014, 08:31 PM   #41
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Title says it all.

I am looking to do a drain and fill on my trans. I have 120k on my 240 nd 1st to 2nd sometimes goes in to gear a little hard at low speed. I thought by using a high end fluid this would help. Any and all suggestions are welcome. Thanks
Here's my recommendation: Amsoil Signature Series multi vehicle synthetic transmission fluid. Product code: ATFQT. I also suggest getting a dealer's membership, and that way you can get all the products available at dealer cost, which is quite a bit less than retail. Usually at least 25%. That all being said, I'll probably catch a bunch of flack here for recommending it, but I'll stand behind all the products that I've used. I've been using their motor oils and other lubricating products for various vehicles and other powerplants since 1982, and I'm a believer. Old thread, but my advice still stands.
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Old 06-30-2014, 04:01 AM   #42
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Here's my recommendation: Amsoil Signature Series multi vehicle synthetic transmission fluid. Product code: ATFQT.

I'll probably catch a bunch of flack here for recommending it
What, something like "I put that Scamsoil stuff in, and now my AT is FQT"?
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Old 06-30-2014, 10:50 AM   #43
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What, something like "I put that Scamsoil stuff in, and now my AT is FQT"?
Yeah, something like that. NO product out there will heal mechanical woes. The best one can hope for is to keep things clean, not break down under heat, and keep seals in good shape. I'm certainly not trying to convert anyone here on the board, (I think I know enough not to bother) just putting in my experience. The first company to mass produce synthetic oil and lubrication products here in the U.S. has some background as well.
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Old 06-30-2014, 12:02 PM   #44
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Yeah, something like that. NO product out there will heal mechanical woes. The best one can hope for is to keep things clean, not break down under heat, and keep seals in good shape. I'm certainly not trying to convert anyone here on the board, (I think I know enough not to bother) just putting in my experience. The first company to mass produce synthetic oil and lubrication products here in the U.S. has some background as well.
I use Amsoil for bunch of things in my 07 s60R , Its great stuff. But since my 240 has never seen synthetic I was not sure if switching from standard dexronIII would cause leaks or cause some junk to break free from the cleaning additives to cause shifting problems. I am looking to keep her running strong...if possible smooth the shift from 1st to 2nd. It sometimes goes into gear hard at low speed. Its doesnt feel bad, but previously you were unable to feel the car shift at all. Which I know is beyond good. So now that I feel the shifts and she is acting her age lol... Im looking to make sure she gets all the TLC I can give her to keep her running great for many more miles.
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Old 06-30-2014, 12:54 PM   #45
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With only 120k, I don't think you'll have an issue. Change out your filter, put on a new gasket, add and flush (IPD style) until fresh fluid is seen, and go from there. Automatics don't (hopefully!) have combustion products, so there shouldn't be a bunch of contaminants flying around in there.
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Old 02-18-2015, 06:41 PM   #46
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Any updates?
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Old 02-18-2015, 09:27 PM   #47
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Sure the OD solenoid has power? My son swapped in a used tranny in our 245 in October and after he was done the OD solenoid didn't work. Ended up that the fuse was blown. Popped in a new fuse and he was rolling down the highway in 4th gear style.

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Old 02-19-2015, 02:35 PM   #48
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Any updates?
Still running around without overdrive. My new motor goes in probably in April. Doing this all outside, and have the motor half built on a stand in my shed.

Guess I could drop it off to do the tranny in advance. There is a guy in town that knows the AW71 inside and out, and he says it can be fixed just dropping the pan and not requiring R and R. Work is intense with some new projects, so I'll get this over there in a week or so.

I am a little embarrassed because the undercarriage is an oil covered mess. Despite fixing every known leak in the motor, doing the PCV and installing a catch can it is like driving the Volvo Valdez.
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Old 02-21-2015, 01:24 AM   #49
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With a worn out engine it will leak.
More often than not oil passages at the solenoid are blocked making for no overdrive when all is well with it electrically.
Easy box to do. Keep track of everything.
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