home register FAQ memberlist calendar

Go Back   Turbobricks Forums > Mechanical > projects & restorations

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-10-2013, 04:56 AM   #101
Duder
His Dudeness, El Duderino
 
Duder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Torrance, CA
Default

And since Eric reminded me, I tried pulling off the front Commando to get an idea of just how heavy these diving boards are, and how it would affect the static distribution to swap to later, lighter bumpers.

With no front bumper whatsoever, including no bumper shocks, here's what it looked like:

Config. E
LF 751 RF 750
LR 660 RR 660
Total 2820
Cross 1410 50.0%
Left 1411 50.0%
Rear 1320 46.8%

That sucker weighs 40lbs by itself! I haven't even gotten to the rear yet..

I did slap an '84 front bumper on however.

Config. F
LF 763 RF 766
LR 659 RR 657
Total 2844
Cross 1425 50.1%
Left 1422 50.0%
Rear 1316 46.3%

So the lighter front bumper weighs 24 lbs total, and there's a 16 lb reduction by swapping from a Commando to an UnCommando. I'm assuming the rear will show a similar improvement but I haven't done it yet. In addition to lightening the car this of course also reduces polar moment of inertia pretty significantly since the bumpers are at the extreme ends of the car.





The car looks a million times better too. I kept putting off this swap because I thought for some reason these later black plastic covers were in worse shape than they really are. Sure there's a few light scuffs but they are cleaning up very nicely. The rubber Commando trim doesn't even look half bad; it just needs to be trimmed at the ends to lay down nicely on the bumper "wings" since they are longer overall.

Last edited by Duder; 06-10-2013 at 06:22 PM..
Duder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-11-2013, 02:27 PM   #102
Duder
His Dudeness, El Duderino
 
Duder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Torrance, CA
Default

It would be awesome if I could get this sucker down to 2700 lbs or so, as a non-stripped out street car with functional AC, stereo, carpet, etc. Need to figure out more ways to add lightness after the B230FT swap though.

Does anyone have the stock front seat weight handy? I haven't pulled one out of the car yet to check. I would guess around 30 lbs each, maybe more.
Duder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-14-2013, 02:05 PM   #103
Duder
His Dudeness, El Duderino
 
Duder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Torrance, CA
Default

I pulled off the rear Commando yesterday. Here is what the static weight distribution looked like:

Config. G (same as F, but no rear bumper)
LF 772 RF 774
LR 627 RR 627
Total 2800
Cross 1401 50.0%
Left 1399 49.9%
Rear 1254 44.7%

Then I mocked up the '84 wagon rear bumper I have. Right off the bat, the shocks are too short to get the big M12 bolts (or M14, whatever they are) through the ends of the bumper shocks. Still I recorded the weights for reference. I will get the right shocks for it; looks like the aluminum bumper itself is the right size and shape for the sedan.

Config. H (same as F, rear Commando replaced with '84 245 bumper)
LF 764 RF 770
LR 647 RR 645
Total 2826
Cross 1417 50.1%
Left 1411 49.9%
Rear 1292 45.7%
Duder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-14-2013, 02:54 PM   #104
Duder
His Dudeness, El Duderino
 
Duder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Torrance, CA
Default

Just for fun I also tried lifting the rear end and re-weighing to calculate the CG height. The jack I have wouldn't let me raise the rear more than 2 5/8" above where it was on the scales though, so I'm sure the results aren't very accurate. Apparently this works best when you can raise the rear at least 10 inches higher.

Either way though, I'll re-do this next time I have the car on scales and can use a taller jack or a lift to get the rear up higher.

With the rear raised 2.625" higher, the front weights from Config. H became:
LF 767 RF 772

I took those numbers, plus the wheelbase (104.3"), original axle height off the scale surface (12.44") and new height (15.07") and plugged them into this calculator: http://robrobinette.com/cg_height_calc.htm

Which yielded CG height = 19.77" from the ground, assuming it's not on the scales.
Duder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 02:09 PM   #105
Duder
His Dudeness, El Duderino
 
Duder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Torrance, CA
Default

Ok guys, I'm at a sort of crossroads with this car and need some advice from the TB graybeards. You know who you are.

It was just smogged a few weeks ago so I have 2 years to dick around with an engine swap before worrying about getting it BAR certified. I have a complete '94 B230FT ready to be swapped in, minus a few small parts. I really love this 242 but am thinking maybe it's not the best platform for a project car.

I'm now thinking a diesel-titled 245 would be awesome, and also entertaining the idea of an Amazon wagon.

The 245 would be functionally identical to the 242, but now that I have a wife, dog, and baby the wagon body would make road trips and fun drives in the Volvo more practical. I'd likely do a 16-valve head on the squirter block, Tremec TKO 5-spd trans, Truetrac LSD, and coilovers. It would be built as a completely usable street car that could be hooned and taken to track days occasionally - not stripped out or uber stiff. But smog exempt!

I've always loved Amazons, and wouldn't really entertain anything other than the wagon since interior space is much tighter than a 240. I'd be at a disadvantage in terms of engine swap options, space in the bay, space in the tunnel, suspension parts available, and so on. But I love the vintage Volvo aesthetic and would have fun in an Amazon. It probably wouldn't end up being used as much as a 240 in real life though. I have a line on one that's already got some suspension upgrades and no engine.

So any opinions or advice is welcome....my current options:

a) keep 242, do smog-legal B230FT swap and then tinker with it from there
b) sell 242, get 245 diesel and go to town with a 16-valve redblock or T5 perhaps
c) sell 242, get Amazon wagon and do B230FT swap
d) I should have never been born

Background: I have too many cars at the moment.

'66 VW Beetle - for sale, 1641cc, dual carbs, lowered
'86 Toyota pickup - DD and hauling duties
'94 Toyota Land Crusher - camping, towing, offroading
'10 VW Jetta TDI wagon - wife's DD, road trip car
'93 BMW M5 - because M5, why not
'93 BMW 325i - Lemons car, being rebuilt
'66 Volvo 1800S - wife's project, I'm helping, slow progress so far
'81 Volvo 242 - ??

What would you guys do in this situation?
Duder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 02:13 PM   #106
Karl Buchka
Never go full retard.
 
Karl Buchka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Los Angeles
Default

I like B. Option A is enticing because you've already got the car. Starting over on a new shell isn't a trivial amount of work. Although I like C, I would think it's out because that's an even bigger project than option A.
__________________
Fake Race Car
Karl Buchka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 02:18 PM   #107
linuxman51
BRANDSCHUTZVORSCHRIFTEN!
 
linuxman51's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: mont, AL
Default

Well, it's a little too late for option D, as postpartum abortions are still currently illegal. A or B with a nod for B due to fewer issues down the road.
__________________
"They bum rushed them in their own crib, they drank all their beer, they partied with their ladies and they left with the trophy"

Now with in-house Dyno tuning!

Megasquirt Tuning!
Plug and play LH 2.4 Megasquirt, now with stealth mode!
linuxman51 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 02:21 PM   #108
Hank Scorpio
Chubfest 2009 Survivor
 
Hank Scorpio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: The neighborhood with the ******* guitar player.
Default

Option Z: D24 the 242, BAR it, then enjoy exemption.

I had the Amazon and wanted to do what I'm doing to the 245 now to it originally. The upside, smog exemption, the downside EVERYTHING required would have been way beyond my skill set. (floor pan, tunel, interior, major, major reworks involved).

BTW I don't really think doing a BAR legal b230ft swap would be hard at all to accomplish. You can have plenty of fun with a relatively stock looking B230FT. 2871R, T5, chipped ECU or plug and play MS and it'd be loads of fun.
__________________
Hank Scorpio is from the Simpsons. You can call me Doug ;)
Will trade guitars/guitar parts for go fast goodies or stuff I need. Just PM.
www.kauerguitars.com the second best way to upset neighbors and alienate people.
History: Car 1 (242) | Car 2 (t5r) | Car 3 (255)
Hank Scorpio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 02:21 PM   #109
Duder
His Dudeness, El Duderino
 
Duder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Torrance, CA
Default

Thanks for the input. B and C are definitely bigger projects. This 242 shell is a known quantity; that's a good point. I've had it for about 4 years now and know its strengths and weaknesses. Honestly it works fine for family outings, still plenty of space, but a wagon would be better in that regard.

Smog exemption is the incredibly enticing part. I would also entertain a '75 245 as an alternative to a diesel 245.
Duder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 02:23 PM   #110
Duder
His Dudeness, El Duderino
 
Duder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Torrance, CA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank Scorpio View Post
Option Z: D24 the 242, BAR it, then enjoy exemption.
Well played, sir. I'm assuming it would need to be running and driving as a diesel to get the title changed, which would be a project in and of itself, but another good path to consider.
Duder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 02:26 PM   #111
Hank Scorpio
Chubfest 2009 Survivor
 
Hank Scorpio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: The neighborhood with the ******* guitar player.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duder View Post
Well played, sir. I'm assuming it would need to be running and driving as a diesel to get the title changed, which would be a project in and of itself, but another good path to consider.
Honestly, the upside to the diesel is most of it is self contained to the motor (no ECU ect). I think you could really pretty much just swap it in, even if you tow to the the ref and get it done.

OR you can buy the 245 diesel from whatshisfaceinredding on here.
Hank Scorpio is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 02:33 PM   #112
240240
Sit on SantaWookie's lap
 
240240's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: In that neighborhood with the 240 on the jackstands & where tax rate is 1/2 paycheck; la habra, CA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank Scorpio View Post
Honestly, the upside to the diesel is most of it is self contained to the motor (no ECU ect). I think you could really pretty much just swap it in, even if you tow to the the ref and get it done.

OR you can buy the 245 diesel from whatshisfaceinredding on here.
I've got a running 245 diesel chris im gonna post for sale soon. Also have a d24 if you need to do the swap....its a fast swap in all honesty
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by 240240 View Post
Any thread about cut springs, & or +T on a college students budget shall be sent to OT, flogged for 24 hours, participants in said thread shall point the OP in the correct thread link while simultaneously shaming them
240240 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 02:34 PM   #113
Duder
His Dudeness, El Duderino
 
Duder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Torrance, CA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hank Scorpio View Post
Honestly, the upside to the diesel is most of it is self contained to the motor (no ECU ect). I think you could really pretty much just swap it in, even if you tow to the the ref and get it done.

OR you can buy the 245 diesel from whatshisfaceinredding on here.
The one in Redding is what got me thinking in this spiraling loop. That car is a bit more of a project than I really want though, it needs full interior, rust repair, paint, etc.

Hmm, know where I could find a complete D24 to use for said conversion?
Duder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 02:35 PM   #114
Duder
His Dudeness, El Duderino
 
Duder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Torrance, CA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 240240 View Post
I've got a running 245 diesel chris im gonna post for sale soon. Also have a d24 if you need to do the swap....its a fast swap in all honesty
Awesome. I need to talk with you more in that case!
Duder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 02:36 PM   #115
240240
Sit on SantaWookie's lap
 
240240's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: In that neighborhood with the 240 on the jackstands & where tax rate is 1/2 paycheck; la habra, CA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duder View Post
Ok guys, I'm at a sort of crossroads with this car and need some advice from the TB graybeards. You know who you are.

It was just smogged a few weeks ago so I have 2 years to dick around with an engine swap before worrying about getting it BAR certified. I have a complete '94 B230FT ready to be swapped in, minus a few small parts. I really love this 242 but am thinking maybe it's not the best platform for a project car.

I'm now thinking a diesel-titled 245 would be awesome, and also entertaining the idea of an Amazon wagon.

The 245 would be functionally identical to the 242, but now that I have a wife, dog, and baby the wagon body would make road trips and fun drives in the Volvo more practical. I'd likely do a 16-valve head on the squirter block, Tremec TKO 5-spd trans, Truetrac LSD, and coilovers. It would be built as a completely usable street car that could be hooned and taken to track days occasionally - not stripped out or uber stiff. But smog exempt!

I've always loved Amazons, and wouldn't really entertain anything other than the wagon since interior space is much tighter than a 240. I'd be at a disadvantage in terms of engine swap options, space in the bay, space in the tunnel, suspension parts available, and so on. But I love the vintage Volvo aesthetic and would have fun in an Amazon. It probably wouldn't end up being used as much as a 240 in real life though. I have a line on one that's already got some suspension upgrades and no engine.

So any opinions or advice is welcome....my current options:

a) keep 242, do smog-legal B230FT swap and then tinker with it from there
b) sell 242, get 245 diesel and go to town with a 16-valve redblock or T5 perhaps
c) sell 242, get Amazon wagon and do B230FT swap
d) I should have never been born

Background: I have too many cars at the moment.

'66 VW Beetle - for sale, 1641cc, dual carbs, lowered
'86 Toyota pickup - DD and hauling duties
'94 Toyota Land Crusher - camping, towing, offroading
'10 VW Jetta TDI wagon - wife's DD, road trip car
'93 BMW M5 - because M5, why not
'93 BMW 325i - Lemons car, being rebuilt
'66 Volvo 1800S - wife's project, I'm helping, slow progress so far
'81 Volvo 242 - ??

What would you guys do in this situation?
Buy my diesel 245 because you already know where I live
240240 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 02:37 PM   #116
240240
Sit on SantaWookie's lap
 
240240's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: In that neighborhood with the 240 on the jackstands & where tax rate is 1/2 paycheck; la habra, CA
Default

Oh did I mention it has an m46 already on it
240240 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 02:42 PM   #117
240240
Sit on SantaWookie's lap
 
240240's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: In that neighborhood with the 240 on the jackstands & where tax rate is 1/2 paycheck; la habra, CA
Default

Oh. And its registered and runs........and no rust......and it might be the only diesel wagon in the whole state that runs.....and it runs. Did I mention that it runs
240240 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 02:46 PM   #118
Duder
His Dudeness, El Duderino
 
Duder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Torrance, CA
Default

You sir are a crack dealer. I may just have to come check that out. Any availability this weekend?
Duder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 02:58 PM   #119
240240
Sit on SantaWookie's lap
 
240240's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: In that neighborhood with the 240 on the jackstands & where tax rate is 1/2 paycheck; la habra, CA
Default

Pulling an m46 for another fellow tbricker maybe Sunday evening or sat evening.

All the unicorns like to play on my lawn.....
240240 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 03:04 PM   #120
84dlwagon
Board Member
 
84dlwagon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Silverado Canyon, Silverado, ca
Default

Yes this Saturday for sure. Going to the oc volvo club swap meet in the am. But after I am ready.
84dlwagon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 03:12 PM   #121
240240
Sit on SantaWookie's lap
 
240240's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: In that neighborhood with the 240 on the jackstands & where tax rate is 1/2 paycheck; la habra, CA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 84dlwagon View Post
Yes this Saturday for sure. Going to the oc volvo club swap meet in the am. But after I am ready.
I can't go to those events anymore lol....come home with a wagon full of crap swag and an empty wallet
240240 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 03:12 PM   #122
linuxman51
BRANDSCHUTZVORSCHRIFTEN!
 
linuxman51's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: mont, AL
Default

check this out: take the 245, bar it or whatever it is you kalifornistanis do, then take the engine/transmission, swap into the 242, get that one exempted, and PROFIT LIKE A MOFO.

then can has t5 swap AND 16v swap. just ditch the beetle.
linuxman51 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 03:14 PM   #123
84dlwagon
Board Member
 
84dlwagon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Silverado Canyon, Silverado, ca
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 240240 View Post
I can't go to those events anymore lol....come home with a wagon full of crap swag and an empty wallet
Its all good just going to go and all my money is going to you.
84dlwagon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 03:20 PM   #124
84dlwagon
Board Member
 
84dlwagon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Silverado Canyon, Silverado, ca
Default

By the way dig the car.

Last edited by 84dlwagon; 10-30-2013 at 03:26 PM..
84dlwagon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2013, 03:25 PM   #125
Duder
His Dudeness, El Duderino
 
Duder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Torrance, CA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 240240 View Post
Pulling an m46 for another fellow tbricker maybe Sunday evening or sat evening.

All the unicorns like to play on my lawn.....
Cool. Let me know - I can likely get a hall pass to make a run out there to the Habra.

Quote:
Originally Posted by linuxman51 View Post
check this out: take the 245, bar it or whatever it is you kalifornistanis do, then take the engine/transmission, swap into the 242, get that one exempted, and PROFIT LIKE A MOFO.

then can has t5 swap AND 16v swap. just ditch the beetle.
A diesel 245 would already be smog exempt by definition as long as it's titled as such. But yep, the engine could be swapped into a 242, which can then be re-certified as a diesel, and then would be smog exempt from there on out.

The beetle is definitely for sale and needs to go soon; I've had my fun with it, time to pass it on to someone who will drive it more. I'll put an ad up in the market section here once it's ready to go.
Duder is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:45 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.