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Old 11-12-2009, 07:33 PM   #1
GhengisKhan
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Default What to get and what not to get? (suspension)

My fall-break is coming up and now that my 245 is sufficiently boosted I was going to some suspensions work. But I thought I'd ask a couple questions first.

I already have 23mm front and rear sway bars with new polyurethane bushings (made a big difference) firewall braces (didn't make any difference) and I have a strut tower bar on the way.
But I want to know if Bilstein HD struts and shocks will make a significant difference with stock wagon springs (I don't want to lower it). Of course I'll get new upper strut mounts.

Also are adjustable rear torque rods recommended? I'm not going all out, balls to the wall, with my 240, but I'd like a stiff, firm ride for some light autoX in the future.

Right now, besides the sway bars, and the polyurethane bushings, nothing suspension wise has been touched, which means it's all probably nearing 24 years old.

but is there anything else recommended?
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Old 11-12-2009, 07:35 PM   #2
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coilovers the koyote way?
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Old 11-12-2009, 07:50 PM   #3
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you don't need adjustable rear torque rods unless you are going to a single piece driveshaft. Only reason to upgrade to an adjustable unit would be to get rod ends instead of rubber.

If you use poly just put poly in the stock torque rods.

solid upper strut mounts (camber plates) help alot
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Old 11-12-2009, 07:51 PM   #4
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coilovers the koyote way?

are you related to cosmicmonster?? wtf??

coilovers = not to get

they'd offer him 0 advantages besides throwing money away with what he is doing...

Yes to Bil HD's, you'll like them and if your current shocks are shot, you'll notice them even more...
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Old 11-12-2009, 08:00 PM   #5
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Check your big trailing arm bushings [on the axle],and torque rod bushings.
Search '240 Volvo Bilstien' on E-Bay
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Old 11-12-2009, 08:08 PM   #6
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i recomend konis and the camber plates from benny. the stock strut mounts are crap and really take away from the polly bushings in the front. get heim jointed sway bar end links, seam weld the thing and go rallying.
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Old 11-12-2009, 08:53 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blkaplan View Post
you don't need adjustable rear torque rods unless you are going to a single piece driveshaft. Only reason to upgrade to an adjustable unit would be to get rod ends instead of rubber.

If you use poly just put poly in the stock torque rods.

solid upper strut mounts (camber plates) help alot
Good to know, same thing with the adjustable panhard rod? iPd's website suggests it for when you lower your car, I'm not interested in that, but would it do me any good?


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Originally Posted by Mueller View Post
are you related to cosmicmonster?? wtf??

coilovers = not to get

they'd offer him 0 advantages besides throwing money away with what he is doing...

Yes to Bil HD's, you'll like them and if your current shocks are shot, you'll notice them even more...
Coil-overs are a little over-my-head at this point. The front end is pretty bouncy right now...

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Originally Posted by Redwood Chair View Post
Check your big trailing arm bushings [on the axle],and torque rod bushings.
Search '240 Volvo Bilstien' on E-Bay
My 240's been babied it's entire life, but I assume time degrades and wears down the rear end bushings as well?
I searched "240 Volvo Bilstein" and got this but the description doesn't say exactly what comes with it. Should I just play it safe and go with iPd's website?


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Originally Posted by boosted12a View Post
i recomend konis and the camber plates from benny. the stock strut mounts are crap and really take away from the polly bushings in the front. get heim jointed sway bar end links, seam weld the thing and go rallying.
Who's Benny? Koni's are probably out of my price range, I'm only looking to spend $600 or so.

One last question, my 3'' exhaust spools my 13c up nicely, how much bigger could I go without having tremendous turbo lag? This is just for future reference for my own benefit.
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Old 11-12-2009, 09:19 PM   #8
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Bilstein HD struts will make a difference if you're on stock struts. For the rear, I'd use something other than Bilstein HD. Koni red or yellow are good. Bil HD shocks are good if they're revalved stiffer on rebound.

Poly in the torque rods is almost mandatory. Adjustable isn't needed. Only advantage to buying the adj. ones is that they come with poly already installed, so it may be cheaper if you can't install the bushings yourself and/or have to pay shop labor rates.

"Coilovers" can mean a lot of things. Most people don't use the height adjustment except to set the desired height when the springs are installed and to dump it to the bump stops for pictures. The main advantage is inexpensive 2.5" diameter springs that are available in lots of rates and lengths. If you get camber plates and want a lot of camber, the smaller diameter spring allows the strut to be tilted in further, so you can get more camber. Usually -1° to -1.5° is the most you can get from the stock diameter springs and camber plates, but that might be enough for a car mostly driven on the street.
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Old 11-12-2009, 09:51 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by GhengisKhan View Post
Good to know, same thing with the adjustable panhard rod? iPd's website suggests it for when you lower your car, I'm not interested in that, but would it do me any good?
Adjustable panhard bar is useful when you lower your car but you said you are keeping stock ride height, correct? If so you dont need an adjustable bar.


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Originally Posted by GhengisKhan View Post
Who's Benny? Koni's are probably out of my price range, I'm only looking to spend $600 or so.
I am Benny, aka BNE aka beigepower aka trianglesunlimited aka kaplhenke racing.. Koni Sports are 620 a set shipped.

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Originally Posted by GhengisKhan View Post
One last question, my 3'' exhaust spools my 13c up nicely, how much bigger could I go without having tremendous turbo lag? This is just for future reference for my own benefit.
Skys the limit, the 13c will never be laggy.
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Old 11-12-2009, 09:53 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by Redwood Chair View Post
Check your big trailing arm bushings [on the axle],and torque rod bushings.
Search '240 Volvo Bilstien' on E-Bay
If the "axle" bushings are bad... replace them with rubber. not poly
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Old 11-12-2009, 10:06 PM   #11
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15g is a nice upgrade with no noticeable lag.. i would suspect the 19t would also have a similar lack of lag.
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Old 11-12-2009, 10:18 PM   #12
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15g is a nice upgrade with no noticeable lag.. i would suspect the 19t would also have a similar lack of lag.
his suspension needs improvement not his turbooooopooooo

19T doesn't have the response that my t25 had but it doesn't bother me...
still much better.
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Old 11-12-2009, 10:19 PM   #13
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Watching this for stuff that may help me out. Bigger springs and stiffer shocks/struts awaaay!
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Old 11-12-2009, 11:00 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by blkaplan View Post
If the "axle" bushings are bad... replace them with rubber. not poly
He's been converted!!!!!
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Old 11-12-2009, 11:00 PM   #15
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What is the big difference?
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Old 11-13-2009, 02:35 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by towerymt View Post
He's been converted!!!!!
your damn right i have... especially with a torsen or open diff.

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Originally Posted by morganpartee View Post
What is the big difference?
Poly bushings bind which limits the articulation of the rear suspension... limits grip and traction...

the factory rubber stuff pivots and twists which keeps the suspension happy and able to articulate.
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Old 11-13-2009, 02:43 AM   #17
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Old 11-13-2009, 02:13 PM   #18
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Here's my recommendations:
Front:
- Bil's HD struts
- GT Springs, 14.2 mm wire size, keeps the stock height, suspension rock solid, and are at least 20% stiffer than IPD lowering springs. Leigsfors from FCP are cheaper, but you can still get them from Volvo for $90 each.
http://volvowholesaleparts.com/partl...layCatalogid=0
- Volvo OEM optioned hard rubber rear cup bushing on the rear of the A-arm. They are offered for only for the right side bushing, but put them on both sides. These are harder rubber than stock Volvo one's and have better dampening than poly and are just about as firm. Special order from the dealer for $38 each.
- Sway Bar end link bushings on the A-arm, poly if you don't already have them along with poly sway bar bushings.
-Strut mounts from Volvo, not aftermarket. The better quality rubber is worth the price.
-Strut mount braces under the strut mounts. Without these you will punch out the strut towers with Bil's and stiffer springs. The dealer had them for $35 a set last I looked.
-Lower braces as used on the 242GT. I think these are better nose stiffening than upper braces or strut tower braces, worth every penny, ~$60 from IPD, others.
- Add the upper braces, as you already have, and the nose flex will be almost nil
- This combo is an excellent rough road suspension, and works well with the long travel stiff springs and Bil's, great for those crappy TX backroads/dirtroads.

A cheaper way out than Bil's is to find a good used set of the OEM Volvo 242GT gas strut cartridges, but good luck finding these.

Rear:
- Lower rear trailing arm bushings, Volvo rubber, as others mentioned. If you want to go to the extent to replace the front, use Volvo rubber, too. They are very hard and last (also hard to get in/out).
-Springs, rear overload coils, Leijsfors or aftermarket, cheap from IPD, FCP, $90/set.
- Torque rod bushing poly (?) I used Volvo rubber and have no complaints.
- Panhard rod, I use IPD adj only because I bent the stock one with the stiff 25 mm IPD sway bar and the poly bushings are better than stock. I found a big improvement with the bar, but there's no huge benefit from the adjust-ability. If you get one, I would weld the nut or Loctite it in place.
- Shocks, Bil HD, nothing wrong with these, but I always wanted to retro-fit a set of big 965 Nivo's and have much firmer rear shock than the Bil HD back there
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Old 11-13-2009, 02:15 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by towerymt View Post
Bilstein HD struts will make a difference if you're on stock struts. For the rear, I'd use something other than Bilstein HD. Koni red or yellow are good. Bil HD shocks are good if they're revalved stiffer on rebound.

Poly in the torque rods is almost mandatory. Adjustable isn't needed. Only advantage to buying the adj. ones is that they come with poly already installed, so it may be cheaper if you can't install the bushings yourself and/or have to pay shop labor rates.

"Coilovers" can mean a lot of things. Most people don't use the height adjustment except to set the desired height when the springs are installed and to dump it to the bump stops for pictures. The main advantage is inexpensive 2.5" diameter springs that are available in lots of rates and lengths. If you get camber plates and want a lot of camber, the smaller diameter spring allows the strut to be tilted in further, so you can get more camber. Usually -1° to -1.5° is the most you can get from the stock diameter springs and camber plates, but that might be enough for a car mostly driven on the street.
Mix and match shocks and struts? I've never heard of that before. I can attest to Koni's being very nice, me and my brother-in-law installed some all the way around on his Fleetwood and now it handles less like a boat and more like a proper car.


Quote:
Originally Posted by blkaplan View Post
Adjustable panhard bar is useful when you lower your car but you said you are keeping stock ride height, correct? If so you dont need an adjustable bar.

I am Benny, aka BNE aka beigepower aka trianglesunlimited aka kaplhenke racing.. Koni Sports are 620 a set shipped.

Skys the limit, the 13c will never be laggy.
You're Benny? Well maybe you could PM me what all comes with your Koni kit!

Bigger turbo will come much much later, I need to be able to turn and stop before I go fast, right?
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Old 11-25-2009, 07:34 PM   #20
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Okay, due to FCPgrotons 15% off sale I think I'll just get Bilstein's HD's front and rear, are those... going to disappoint me in any way?
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Old 11-25-2009, 07:37 PM   #21
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Yes.
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Old 11-27-2009, 02:25 AM   #22
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no not if you have crap now. i loved mine for a while.
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Old 11-27-2009, 10:12 AM   #23
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I noticed a huge change in handeling characteristics from just getting lowered springs, I know you sed you dont want too, but 1"-2" isn't all that noticeable. you could go shocks, but in my experiance, springs are the starting point.

I used regular ones, but I dont think you'll find coilovers that difficult fyi http://forums.turbobricks.com/showth...kyote+coilover
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Old 11-27-2009, 11:42 AM   #24
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Or, just get stiffer springs. I 4x4'd around yesterday, till I chopped my new springs, and it was stiff and flat through corners.
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Old 11-27-2009, 12:15 PM   #25
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I've got stock springs with Bilstein HD's in the front on the 760. Still comfortable but handles really nice. It's a bit like our 850 Turbo but a bit stiffer. So still good comfort in combination with good handling.
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