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Old 08-17-2020, 02:15 AM   #1
snailmale
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Default B21(FT) 2pc Pulley Disassembly

I'm still learning that the B21 has a few quirks compared to the B230 and now I'm wondering how I can best get the 2pc crank pulley off. I tried rotating the engine (cw!) using a ratchet, but it feels like I'm fighting something, so I'm guessing I'll need to take the AC belt off. One of the individuals I asked in the FB group suggested cutting the V-belt, but I hesitate to do that, since being stranded without a spare could prove annoying where I live at this time of the year.

So is it

1.) Undo the 6-bolts/nuts as suggested in the ipd video joining the 2pc crank

2.) Remove v-belt and pulley

3.) rotate engine to TDC using timing marks (this engine may have jumped time) and remove 22mm bolt

4.) complete disassembly/reassembly per iPd video/Haynes manual

or should I just go ahead and chop the belt off and go on with steps 3 & 4?


Thanks!
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Old 08-17-2020, 02:44 AM   #2
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I've just done the second half of step 3 and removed the pully with the belt still on. Worked well a few times
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Old 08-17-2020, 08:07 AM   #3
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I'm confused. Once you undo the 6 bolts, the pulley should come off, both pieces. There's no need to undo the main crank bolt unless you're trying to get the pulley 'mount' off too.
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Old 08-17-2020, 08:46 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Broke4speed View Post
I'm confused. Once you undo the 6 bolts, the pulley should come off, both pieces. There's no need to undo the main crank bolt unless you're trying to get the pulley 'mount' off too.
Agree.

I know on my B21 there was some rust between the v-belt pulley and the inner section bolted to the crank. It took some penetrating oil and some prying with a large screwdriver/hammer to come off initially.
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Old 08-17-2020, 09:55 AM   #5
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I assume you want to change the timing belt?



To remove the crank-to-ac belt, remove the 6 nuts and the split pulley should come off with some wiggling. There will be shims between the pulley halves, and probably some spares in front of the pulley, that are used to adjust the tension -- more shims=looser, fewer shims=tighter.

Loosen the alternator tensioner arm bolt to get some slack in the 2 alt/pump/crank belts so they can be removed. The 2-groove fixed crank pulley should come off with some wiggling. For re-assembly, pay attention to where the alignment notch is, and where the dowel pin sticks out just a bit.

IIRC, you can get the timing belt through the gap and onto the crank gear if you're careful -- don't abuse the timing belt if it won't slip in easily.
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Old 08-17-2020, 11:30 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Broke4speed View Post
I'm confused. Once you undo the 6 bolts, the pulley should come off, both pieces. There's no need to undo the main crank bolt unless you're trying to get the pulley 'mount' off too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobxyz View Post
I assume you want to change the timing belt?



To remove the crank-to-ac belt, remove the 6 nuts and the split pulley should come off with some wiggling. There will be shims between the pulley halves, and probably some spares in front of the pulley, that are used to adjust the tension -- more shims=looser, fewer shims=tighter.

Loosen the alternator tensioner arm bolt to get some slack in the 2 alt/pump/crank belts so they can be removed. The 2-groove fixed crank pulley should come off with some wiggling. For re-assembly, pay attention to where the alignment notch is, and where the dowel pin sticks out just a bit.

IIRC, you can get the timing belt through the gap and onto the crank gear if you're careful -- don't abuse the timing belt if it won't slip in easily.

That's actually the exact info I was looking for. I've been watching & reading so many different guides before realizing the crank pulley is a little different between my B21 and the usual B230s that everyone else seems to have.

Thanks for the advice everyone. Will give it a shot this afternoon.
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Old 08-17-2020, 02:05 PM   #7
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When reinstalling the pulley only tighten the bolts closest to the AC compressor. Tighten the bolts/nuts a little at time, turn the crank and tighten the other bolts. If you tighten the bolts near the belt you'll bend the pulley. It's also important to leave at least one shim on the outside to act as a washer.

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Old 08-17-2020, 11:00 PM   #8
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Man, I am bad at this. So I'm struggling to turn the crank to TDC clockwise (standing at front looking towards firewall) at #1 before I take the belt off. Will it become much easier if I take the A/C belt off or use a non-deep drive 22mm?

I'm like a 3/8ths rotation away from TDC on the camshaft.
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Old 08-18-2020, 12:40 AM   #9
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Go ahead and take the belts and pulleys off. You can line up the timing marks once the cover is off.

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Old 08-18-2020, 08:00 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snailmale View Post
Man, I am bad at this. So I'm struggling to turn the crank to TDC clockwise (standing at front looking towards firewall) at #1 before I take the belt off. Will it become much easier if I take the A/C belt off or use a non-deep drive 22mm?

I'm like a 3/8ths rotation away from TDC on the camshaft.
Is the car in gear with the parking brake on? This will make it difficult to turn.
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Old 08-18-2020, 03:36 PM   #11
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Is the car in gear with the parking brake on? This will make it difficult to turn.
It might be! (totally was)
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Old 08-19-2020, 01:16 PM   #12
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I'm embarrassed to ask this and derail the original topic, but it is supposed to require some strength to turn with the plugs in, neutral, e-brake off? The engine readily spins in the opposite direction so I don't think it's seized, but I don't seem strong enough to easily turn it CW as I "should" and I'm starting to wonder if I'm fighting the cylinder compression.


But to answer to the original topic of this thread: yes, the crank pulley & belts came off without a fight. I'll get them shined up for the day they go back on the car.
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Old 08-19-2020, 01:24 PM   #13
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Not sure what tool you are using to rotate but leverage helps. Perhaps try a breaker bar if you aren't already. You can also pull the spark plugs to make it easier but I've not found that necessary with mine.
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Old 08-19-2020, 01:25 PM   #14
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Expect some resistance when turning CW with the spark plugs in: much easier with the plugs removed.
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Old 08-19-2020, 02:39 PM   #15
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Yup, there always will be resistance as you're doing the compression stroke, if the plugs are installed. One trick I've found helpful when it comes to removing the alternator belts, instead of loosening the tensioner bracket, remove the fan clutch nuts, and pull the water pump pulley. Belts come off easily with the pulley.

When reassembling and torquing the bolt (if you had to remove it for a crank seal replacement), engage 4th gear with the car on the ground, firmly apply the parking brake, then torque the bolt to 122 ft. lbs. You will feel the car try to push forward. That's normal.
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Old 08-19-2020, 03:10 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snailmale View Post
The engine readily spins in the opposite direction
Just to make sure you aren't fighting something more serious, was the engine running normally before you started the belt removal?

Are you using a 3/8" socket with a wimpy little 8" handle, and poor access? A 1/2" socket on a 18" breaker bar still take some umph to turn it.

If you turn it over slowly, the cylinders will leak down through the ring gaps. It will still be lumpy turning over due to the valve springs, with max valve change in mid-stroke.

I'd try carefully and slowly turning it over in the opposite direction and see if it stops short of a full revolution, which could mean that something in a cylinder is preventing the full rotation (could be broken or bent valves, or something metal got blown into the cylinder).
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Old 08-19-2020, 11:47 PM   #17
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Quote:
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Just to make sure you aren't fighting something more serious, was the engine running normally before you started the belt removal?

Are you using a 3/8" socket with a wimpy little 8" handle, and poor access? A 1/2" socket on a 18" breaker bar still take some umph to turn it.

If you turn it over slowly, the cylinders will leak down through the ring gaps. It will still be lumpy turning over due to the valve springs, with max valve change in mid-stroke.

I'd try carefully and slowly turning it over in the opposite direction and see if it stops short of a full revolution, which could mean that something in a cylinder is preventing the full rotation (could be broken or bent valves, or something metal got blown into the cylinder).

Yup, car ran fine minus some crazy vacuum leaks when I drove it into the garage. I have been using an 18" breaker bar but I didn't want a repeat of the fuel filter scenario where I had just enough strength to sever the hard line!

I'll try going slow when I try again tomorrow.
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Old 08-23-2020, 08:26 PM   #18
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Conclusion to the second part of this thread: I spritzed a little PB Blaster down the spark plug holes after trying and failing to dribble some Marvel Mystery Oil through a small piece of hose. It sat for a few minutes and the crankshaft turned nicely after that.
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