[240] Show us your Panhard mount relocations

[klr142]

Originally Posted by DrZiplok

Just a brief update; the relocation seems to have helped somewhat, but still hasn't fully cured the issue (or made it symmetrical).

We did notice a bit more rear-end looseness (as implied), though some poor tire decisions left us running the whole weekend on less than fresh rubber which made comparison more difficult.

Enjoy the last lap of the weekend, with Racer Simon almost, but not quite, passing the Chotus: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=43bE...ature=youtu.be

Pictures of the relocation? How much did you change it?

I posted some questions and thoughts in the other thread, if you're able to respond: http://forums.turbobricks.com/showpo...0&postcount=43

[DrZiplok]

Originally Posted by klr142

Pictures of the relocation? How much did you change it?

Picture in post #40 in this thread. It's moved ~4" down, about the same as we've lowered the rear.

I posted some questions and thoughts in the other thread, if you're able to respond: http://forums.turbobricks.com/showpo...0&postcount=43

Trying to get my hands on a set of corner scales before weighing (ha) back into that thread, since the question's been asked and I can't answer it yet.

[klr142]

Ah yes, I did see that. Is the panhard rod level with the ground still? If the car’s lowered 4” I assume the rear is indeed lower than it used to be which was one of my questions. Sounds like a legit reason to wait to post on the other thread, I’ll wait!

[JimWilling]

Regarding your axle temps, during a Lucky Dog endurance race at PIR, we saw a max of 265 - 275 deg F from a temp sender plugged into the fill plug. Fast lap was a 1.33, I think? Thereabouts anyway.

The setup: stock steel cover, 3.31 gears, rebuilt (new seals and bearings with about 5 races on them), fresh 200-treadwear 225 width tires, fresh charge of Amsoil Severe Gear SAE 75W140 (which I know is thicker than Volvo calls for, and it's synthetic, which Eaton is somewhat agnostic about), high-preload Eaton Truetrac. Car makes 268hp to the wheels, and 294 ft-lbs. We really have no idea, but stripped and caged, the car probably weighs... 2700lbs? Maybe?

So do with that what you will. I'm looking for a stock aluminum cover, maybe an air scoop, since the cover occupies a somewhat dead space, airflow-wise. We may have to re-evaluate cooling for when we go do longer stints, and certainly any more horsepower. On curvier tracks we may have even higher temps. I wouldn't mind to see temps 20 deg F lower. The problem I see with an aftermarket cover would be any additional depth to the cover. There's about 5/8" between the depth of the existing cover and the panhard bar, so that's a limiting factor.

https://www.redlineoil.com/Content/f...ech%20Info.pdf

The gear oils don't start being corrosive until 300 deg F, and the stuff we're using claims to be stable (well, more stable than whatever they chose to compare themselves with) at 300F, so I'm just going to consider that a ceiling for us.

[klr142]

Originally Posted by JimWilling

Regarding your axle temps, during a Lucky Dog endurance race at PIR, we saw a max of 265 - 275 deg F from a temp sender plugged into the fill plug. Fast lap was a 1.33, I think? Thereabouts anyway.

The setup: stock steel cover, 3.31 gears, rebuilt (new seals and bearings with about 5 races on them), fresh 200-treadwear 225 width tires, fresh charge of Amsoil Severe Gear SAE 75W140 (which I know is thicker than Volvo calls for, and it's synthetic, which Eaton is somewhat agnostic about), high-preload Eaton Truetrac. Car makes 268hp to the wheels, and 294 ft-lbs. We really have no idea, but stripped and caged, the car probably weighs... 2700lbs? Maybe?

So do with that what you will. I'm looking for a stock aluminum cover, maybe an air scoop, since the cover occupies a somewhat dead space, airflow-wise. We may have to re-evaluate cooling for when we go do longer stints, and certainly any more horsepower. On curvier tracks we may have even higher temps. I wouldn't mind to see temps 20 deg F lower. The problem I see with an aftermarket cover would be any additional depth to the cover. There's about 5/8" between the depth of the existing cover and the panhard bar, so that's a limiting factor.

https://www.redlineoil.com/Content/f...ech%20Info.pdf

The gear oils don't start being corrosive until 300 deg F, and the stuff we're using claims to be stable (well, more stable than whatever they chose to compare themselves with) at 300F, so I'm just going to consider that a ceiling for us.

Hello Jim,
What car is this you're referring to? We run the General Leif 142 with LDRL and it seems that ever since we added a rear swaybar, our rear tires, brakes and diff get very hot. We haven't taken temperatures but we will be looking to reduce our rear bias and maybe our rear swaybar with stiffer springs this year. We are also running a TrueTrac but we did get our hands on an aluminum cover. We are also toying with ways to get more cooling to the diff.

[JimWilling]

Originally Posted by klr142

Hello Jim,
What car is this you're referring to? We run the General Leif 142 with LDRL and it seems that ever since we added a rear swaybar, our rear tires, brakes and diff get very hot. We haven't taken temperatures but we will be looking to reduce our rear bias and maybe our rear swaybar with stiffer springs this year. We are also running a TrueTrac but we did get our hands on an aluminum cover. We are also toying with ways to get more cooling to the diff.

Sorry, I gotta remember to log on here more. Old lurker habits die hard when you come out of the shadows.

We're running the old Lemons Death Cab/V8olvo/Death Metal Racing 244 with the Ford 302 in it. I think we pitted a few cars down from you guys a few races ago. We actually just stripped it down to transfer the mechanicals over to a new wagon shell that's a little less haggard. We decided the amount of stress cracking and questionable, QUESTIONABLE items on the car should be a sign to put it out to pasture.

It's also worth saying that right now, we don't have any idea what our suspension setup really looks like. We know we have a Crown Vic/Thunderbird sway bar up front (with Volvo bar ends welded on), and some kinda uncut springs. We added a stock rear swaybar when we ditched the welded diff and added spherical trailing arm bushings.

Part of the transition to the new car will involve characterizing (as well as we can) what we're running. Hopefully that'll explain why the car works as well as it does. None of my drivers report any behavior akin to what the good doctor is describing.

[klr142]

Congrats! I saw your wagon at Russ' shop recently. Good luck with the rebuild!

[Swedishconnection]

I decided to use a wishbone to center my rear end instead of a panhard

[JimWilling]

Thanks klr. We're gonna be stoked to have something that doesn't give us tetanus just looking at it.

We did pull the cell out over the weekend, and to the discussion's point, our rear end is low enough that the panhard bar's axle mount is slightly above the chassis mount. That's without the weight of a 24 gallon fuel cell, of course.

[towerymt]

Originally Posted by JimWilling

We're running the old Lemons Death Cab/V8olvo/Death Metal Racing 244 with the Ford 302 in it. I think we pitted a few cars down from you guys a few races ago. We actually just stripped it down to transfer the mechanicals over to a new wagon shell that's a little less haggard. We decided the amount of stress cracking and questionable, QUESTIONABLE items on the car should be a sign to put it out to pasture.

It's also worth saying that right now, we don't have any idea what our suspension setup really looks like. We know we have a Crown Vic/Thunderbird sway bar up front (with Volvo bar ends welded on), and some kinda uncut springs. We added a stock rear swaybar when we ditched the welded diff and added spherical trailing arm bushings.

Part of the transition to the new car will involve characterizing (as well as we can) what we're running. Hopefully that'll explain why the car works as well as it does. None of my drivers report any behavior akin to what the good doctor is describing.

I drove that car once in 2011 at Sonoma. I can't believe it's still around! It rained all day Saturday and we had no wiper ARMS (let alone blades). On Sunday, the poor handling was truly revealed. It felt like a ton of toe-out and a sticking caliper (or calipers) didn't help. At that point I don't think it had been on a track recently so they may not have known what to expect. I was an arrive-and-drive with Speedycop, I think his cousin(?) owned the car at the time. Does it still have the Jaz fuel cell?

[JimWilling]

Originally Posted by towerymt

I drove that car once in 2011 at Sonoma. I can't believe it's still around! It rained all day Saturday and we had no wiper ARMS (let alone blades). On Sunday, the poor handling was truly revealed. It felt like a ton of toe-out and a sticking caliper (or calipers) didn't help. At that point I don't think it had been on a track recently so they may not have known what to expect. I was an arrive-and-drive with Speedycop, I think his cousin(?) owned the car at the time. Does it still have the Jaz fuel cell?

There's a big part of me that thinks I have to put the history of this car together before we crush the ****er, cause it seems like a lot of people have had experiences with it. Some of them were even positive! I'm kidding, it's been a pretty good car. We just pulled the suspension off it all today to clean up for a new shell. And yeah, the cell too. That's an odd detail to remember though...

I think we got the suspension in a better position than you had it in. I hope anyway. We haven't had OP's lifting problem. Car handles predictably, just a hint of oversteer at the limits, liked lefts and rights, occasionally it'll spit rear brake pads and one time it backed most of the ball joint/strut bolts out.

[DrZiplok]

Today with the second iteration of our Panhard relocation we had a learning. Those gussets in the Grp A photos aren't overkill.

[culberro]

That’s impressive!

[blkaplan]

Originally Posted by culberro

That’s impressive!

thats what i said.

[rb92673]

You have made that car really fast. 7th fastest lap time out of 133 cars last weekend at Sonoma.

[DrZiplok]

Originally Posted by rb92673

You have made that car really fast. 7th fastest lap time out of 133 cars last weekend at Sonoma.

Lots of contributing factors, but we improved our best lap ~8s over the last outing there (2019). All five drivers posted significantly better times, and more importantly all five reported significantly improved fun factor. So, win!

[122power]

I was able to hang with you guys for half a lap! Woo hoo im doin good! Uhhh it wasnt me..... Now i see why lol.
8 seconds! Thats fast!