home register FAQ memberlist calendar

Go Back   Turbobricks Forums > Mechanical > performance & modifications

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 11-24-2007, 02:53 AM   #1
Lord Tentacle
Anime Lord
 
Lord Tentacle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Sydney, AUS/Appleton, WI
Default using an eaton M90 (supercharged 2007 bump)

GM used them extensivly with the 3.8L v6's
so it comes to reason that one might be able to work resonably well with the redblock or even with the whiteblock motors

the m90 is rated to a max of 12,000rpm, knowing i'm going for a happy 7k motor
that gives me a pully ratio of up to 1.7-1.8

i've found some crappy but usefull maps here
http://www.capa.com.au/eaton_m90data.htm

considering it can supply over 550cfm then it would appear to supply more than enough for killing the stock rods

the question comes on how to pick a ratio for it, my goal is to limit it to its rather dam efficient 5psi opperation
is there any good way to guess from the maps what sort of ratio to start with?
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by .:Sven:. View Post
Your not getting naked pics of my GF, and im getting a 3inch. Its settled
Tentacle Wagon-91 940; stuff including paddles and Holset etc... powered by Corn
Tentacle SUV 07 xc90 D5; Has been to Cape York and back and survived (look it up)

recently crushed Volvo's
1990 244, 99 v70 t5, 98 v70 t5, 2002 s80 t6, 98 940s
Lord Tentacle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2007, 03:00 AM   #2
VQ
Not such a PRVert Anymore
 
VQ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Default

The 12,000rpm speed is usually attained with it set up to about 12-14psi, as running one to one rpm's woudn't give much boost.
__________________
VQ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2007, 10:05 AM   #3
Matt Dupuis
Board Member
 
Matt Dupuis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Calgary, Ab
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiebird View Post
the question comes on how to pick a ratio for it, my goal is to limit it to its rather dam efficient 5psi opperation
is there any good way to guess from the maps what sort of ratio to start with?
Eaton has an online calculator that lets you play with ratios & stuff, and should give you an idea of the boost you'll getting out of it. It's not going to be dead-nuts accurate, but it'll be a decent starting point.
Matt Dupuis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2007, 06:41 PM   #4
Forg
Board Member
 
Forg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Retirement Village, Sydney
Default

Would not a reasonable rule-of-thumb be to work-out what RPM GM were running it at on the 3.8L engine, and figure it needs to slow-down by approximately 3.8/2.3 on a 2.3L engine? I think they were only using about 5-6psi, weren't they?
__________________
Officially more comely than Paul Buck.

When I'm cruisin' in overdrive ...
Don't have to listen to no run-of-the-mill talk jive.

Shatner: The Colonel is breakdancing ... gimme a break!!
Rollins: Credit terms raised!
Shatner: I can't get behind any of that!
Shatner: I can't get behind so-called singers that can't carry a tune, get paid for talking, how easy is that? Well, maybe I could get behind that ...
Rollins: Well, I can't!!
Forg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2007, 06:46 PM   #5
MrDoug
"Forty-threee dollars"
 
MrDoug's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: VA
Default

Didn't the 89-95 Ford Supercoupe use the M90 as well?
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by towerymt View Post
"Mah? Is that her first name? Is she Vietnamese?
MrDoug is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2007, 07:26 PM   #6
MikeHardy
The Sirius/Nova Police
 
MikeHardy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: northern Wales, UK
Default

if your going to the trouble of doing this wouldn't you just set the eaton up to hit max it's RPM at the Max RPM your going to run the engine at, then just use MS to tune for what ever boost you end up running, i mean if your gonna do it might as well go all the way.
MikeHardy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2007, 09:53 PM   #7
shaved240
Board Member
 
shaved240's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: California
Default

yea I think he's referring to the m90 that was used on the thunderbird 3.6 v6
__________________
1979 242 Turbo: b230f+16v, Holset HX40, Getrag
1990 745 Turbo: Ipd Bars, Bilsteins, BBS Wheels
2001.5 S4 Avant: Stock for now.
1988 244: b230f+t, M46:PARTED
1995 960: SOLD
1994 945: SOLD


on the hunt for the elusive zf diff.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungledorifuto View Post
ship me that m46 for 40 bucks and im game
shaved240 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2007, 10:01 PM   #8
frostburner
Board Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Default

Just make sure you do your math right, double and triple check so you don't have headaches later, you should get some nice gains at 5-6 psi.
frostburner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2007, 10:32 PM   #9
Lord Tentacle
Anime Lord
 
Lord Tentacle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Sydney, AUS/Appleton, WI
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by shaved240 View Post
yea I think he's referring to the m90 that was used on the thunderbird 3.6 v6
dont put words into my mouth
i wouldn't touch the ford with a 10 foot pole

GM L67 series II 3800 v6
Quote:
Originally Posted by wiki
The L67 is the supercharged version of the Series II L36 and appeared in 1996, one year after the normally-aspirated version. It uses the Eaton Generation 3 M90 supercharger with a 3.8" pulley, a different throttle body, fuel injectors, cylinder heads, and lower intake manifold than the L36 uses. Both engines share the same engine blocks, but compression is reduced from 9.4:1 in the L36 to 8.5:1 for the L67. Power is up to 240 hp (180 kW) and 280 ftlbf (380 Nm) of torque. Final drive ratios are reduced in most applications, for better fuel economy and more use of the engine's torque in the low range. The engine is built in Flint, Michigan. The engine was certified LEV in 2001.

This engine was used in the following cars:

1996-2005 Buick Park Avenue Ultra
1997.5-2004 Buick Regal GS
1996-1999 Buick Riviera (optional 1996-97, std. 1998-99)
2004-2005 Chevrolet Impala SS
2004-2005 Chevrolet Monte Carlo SS
1996-2004 Holden Commodore (VS, VT, VX, VY)
2001-2004 Holden Monaro
1996-1999 Oldsmobile Eighty-Eight LSS (limited)
1996-2003 Pontiac Bonneville SSEi
1997-2003 Pontiac Grand Prix GTP
Quote:
Originally Posted by ravennexus View Post
if your going to the trouble of doing this wouldn't you just set the eaton up to hit max it's RPM at the Max RPM your going to run the engine at, then just use MS to tune for what ever boost you end up running, i mean if your gonna do it might as well go all the way.
not really
that would give me something close to 20lb of boost from talking to some of the GM guys with the 3800v6
going over 5psi requires using an intercooler from the heating of the air, even at 5 psi its still 60-80F
i'm not sure if there is space for the pluming of an air to air intercooler which would meen fabricating some sort of air to water setup to sit between the carger and the plenum
thus is where it gets expensive and complicated
Lord Tentacle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2007, 11:02 PM   #10
thelostartof
unbalanced chemical
 
thelostartof's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Apache Junction, AZ
Default

using the ford unit(same damn thing almost) should allow you to use an intercooler as the fords had intercoolers on them mounted next to the rad
__________________
Chip Feedback Thread / PM LH 2.4 Chip Prices
thelostartof is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2007, 11:10 PM   #11
jutny
Board Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Montclair, NJ
Default

seems like all that work for only 5-6 psi would be.... eh

do it right, intercool it, you know you want to. i got an ebay intercooler in the front of my car without having to move the radiator more than an inch back (and only at the bottom, its angled) so you should still be fine with clearance (which i assume is your concern about intercooling)
__________________
*2001 Audi S4 Avant, Chipped, Exhausted, Suspended. Fun!
*1999 Ford E350 Extended Hi-Top, 7.3 Powerstroke.
*First Gen RX7's, Motorcycles, Mountain Bikes
jutny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2007, 12:53 AM   #12
dbh86
What's a 16V?
 
dbh86's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: San Antonio, TX
Default

Why not use something properly sized?
__________________


'07 MS6 - DD/DSP of doom
'92 245 - Eternal Project

Quote:
Originally Posted by linuxman51 View Post
Incidentally, if we're going to follow this other train of thought, you should install your spare tire while the vehicle is cruising at 55mph, since that's about where it'll be used most often.
dbh86 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2007, 01:13 AM   #13
thelostartof
unbalanced chemical
 
thelostartof's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Apache Junction, AZ
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jutny View Post
seems like all that work for only 5-6 psi would be.... eh

do it right, intercool it, you know you want to. i got an ebay intercooler in the front of my car without having to move the radiator more than an inch back (and only at the bottom, its angled) so you should still be fine with clearance (which i assume is your concern about intercooling)
on an engine that already makes 208bhp adding 6+psi on a DOHC engine with a good intercooler and header should be able to push it up to 300+bhp and make for a really really fun car to drive
thelostartof is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2007, 02:27 AM   #14
Lord Tentacle
Anime Lord
 
Lord Tentacle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Sydney, AUS/Appleton, WI
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by thelostartof View Post
on an engine that already makes 208bhp adding 6+psi on a DOHC engine with a good intercooler and header should be able to push it up to 300+bhp and make for a really really fun car to drive
exactly

i think i'm going to draw this **** out tonight, makes it easier to explain
uggg... i think i know a car a little to well if i can visualize all this stuff easily
Lord Tentacle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2007, 03:21 AM   #15
MrDoug
"Forty-threee dollars"
 
MrDoug's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: VA
Default

Do it! The sound alone will be worth it.
MrDoug is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2007, 04:01 AM   #16
Forg
Board Member
 
Forg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Retirement Village, Sydney
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiebird View Post
going over 5psi requires using an intercooler from the heating of the air, even at 5 psi its still 60-80F
i'm not sure if there is space for the pluming of an air to air intercooler
There is. The Eaton won't just mount-up onto your head &/or intake manifold without any custom messing-around; you'll need some sort of piping anyway, may as well set that piping up to involve an intercooler.
Forg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2007, 04:50 AM   #17
suterman
Board Member
 
suterman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: UK
Default

I was thinking about using a 2:1 ratio so that the SC is doing 12000 rpm to the engines 6000rpm. I was also planning to use a normal SC bypass valve combined with an adjustable cbv, venting to atmosphere to bleed excessive boost, and if there was too much air get a different pulley in the end.

There would be a lot of piping around the place using an air/air IC so I'm planning a water/air cooler.
__________________
1985 Bedford cf. B230e aw71L
1990 240 turbo. b230ft m47 chips
suterman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2007, 06:24 AM   #18
MikeHardy
The Sirius/Nova Police
 
MikeHardy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: northern Wales, UK
Default

i ran this last night on eatons site, it was a well tuned 200hp NA B230 that i made up on dyno2003 sometime back with a maxed out eaton M112

HP is on the left torque is on the right in NM

MikeHardy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2007, 02:45 PM   #19
suterman
Board Member
 
suterman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: UK
Default

Sorry for pinching the photo 740atl


This is an idea for the intercooler I had, it could be made with steel sheet and a heater matrix cheaply enough I reckon,




you get the idea
suterman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-25-2007, 04:18 PM   #20
Boosted2003
Board Member
 
Boosted2003's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Cocoa/Pensacola, Florida
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by thelostartof View Post
using the ford unit(same damn thing almost) should allow you to use an intercooler as the fords had intercoolers on them mounted next to the rad
The m112 from the ford lighting. Yeah, it damn near perfect match to the m90.


Also try gen 3 m90 off the series 3 3.8l v6 (L32)
__________________
2006 VW Passat 2.0t 6 Speed - Current
2005 Dodge Magnum R/T - Sold
2005 Dodge Ram 2500 - Sold
1998 Dodge Ram 1500 - Sold
1990 Volvo 760 Turbo - Sold
Boosted2003 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2011, 02:42 PM   #21
chubsky
Newbie
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Default

What is the displacement for the 3rd gen m90?
chubsky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2011, 02:55 PM   #22
vivalavolvo
Board Member
 
vivalavolvo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Philadelphia
Default

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Adapt...s#ht_500wt_845
__________________
1978 242DL - 1995 855 T5 ARD Green - 1992 Volvo 745
vivalavolvo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2011, 04:23 PM   #23
Harlard
Hurlurd?Harland?Bueller?
 
Harlard's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: PDX
Default

You could run the thing to 11000 RPM and set a wastegate to 6 PSI.

Not efficient but safe
__________________


Herr Harlard am Erstens

1979 242 DL

Quote:
Originally Posted by t8fanning View Post
My knob has a big chunk of steel on it
Harlard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2011, 04:23 PM   #24
Harlard
Hurlurd?Harland?Bueller?
 
Harlard's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: PDX
Default

You could run the thing to 11000 RPM and set a wastegate to 6 PSI.

Not efficient but safe
Harlard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-12-2011, 04:23 PM   #25
Mueller
Board Member
 
Mueller's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Antioch, CA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by chubsky View Post
What is the displacement for the 3rd gen m90?

still 90, no matter what generation....
__________________
.........
Mueller is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:55 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.