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Old 01-08-2020, 11:23 AM   #126
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I cross referenced our findings with yours to make sure I was in the ballpark. Years ago I measured directly off the lobes while the cam was in v-blocks and it was a mess: the cams looked so aggressive I didn't understand how they would even run (or at least idle with a factory quality). There is certainly some deflection and such, I wouldn't recommend anyone try to duplicate a cam with the specs posted here.

6-8 degrees at 0.050" is a lot though.
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Old 01-08-2020, 01:18 PM   #127
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Shoestring, what are the Intake and Exhaust numbers listed on the right lower side of the spreadsheets under the overlap measurements? Maybe I missed their description somewhere. A total lobe area measurement of some sort?

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Old 01-08-2020, 01:43 PM   #128
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Originally Posted by Matt Dupuis View Post
Most of our information agreed for the most part, though the V cam I measured was quite a bit less aggressive than yours was, to the tune of 6-8 degrees at .050".
For what it's worth, I just went back and looked at the charts. Their V cam's measurements pretty closely mirror their measurements for the intake lobe of the IPD VX camshaft.
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Old 01-08-2020, 05:50 PM   #129
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klr142 View Post
Shoestring, what are the Intake and Exhaust numbers listed on the right lower side of the spreadsheets under the overlap measurements? Maybe I missed their description somewhere. A total lobe area measurement of some sort?
Yup. An extremely rudimentary "lobe intensity" measurement.
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Old 01-09-2020, 10:45 AM   #130
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klr142 View Post
For what it's worth, I just went back and looked at the charts. Their V cam's measurements pretty closely mirror their measurements for the intake lobe of the IPD VX camshaft.
I saw that too. All of the cams I tested looked fine, but obviously their history were unknown so they might have experienced different amounts of wear from the ones other people test. Certainly different from the original grind.
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Old 01-30-2020, 04:36 PM   #131
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Enem V15T acquired. Would like to measure it before it ends up in my car.
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Old 01-31-2020, 08:05 PM   #132
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Enem V15T acquired. Would like to measure it before it ends up in my car.
w00! Now I don't need to send in my broken V15 that I have lying around somewhere that I've been procrastinating on doing.
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Old 03-11-2020, 07:27 PM   #133
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Here's some info about the ENEM cams for fun. It has an RPM range listed for each of their cams which is kind of cool. The V15 is listed as a 2000-6000rpm cam, the V16 is 2500-6500, the K13, K14, K15 and C2 are listed as 3000-7500rpm cams, and there's more.

http://forum.vccn.no/dokumentasjon/c...d%20tabell.pdf

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Old 03-13-2020, 04:21 PM   #134
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klr142 View Post
Here's some info about the ENEM cams for fun. It has an RPM range listed for each of their cams which is kind of cool. The V15 is listed as a 2000-6000rpm cam, the V16 is 2500-6500, the K13, K14, K15 and C2 are listed as 3000-7500rpm cams, and there's more.

http://forum.vccn.no/dokumentasjon/c...loger/Kamaxlar med tabell.pdf
Fixed this link:

http://forum.vccn.no/dokumentasjon/c...d%20tabell.pdf

I like it.
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Old 03-13-2020, 04:25 PM   #135
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Oops, thanks.
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Old 03-13-2020, 04:32 PM   #136
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No, thank you. I've been looking for this rpm range info from them for some time.
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Old 03-25-2020, 02:13 PM   #137
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http://forum.vccn.no/dokumentasjon/c...olvokamaksler/

Now what's this?
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Old 03-25-2020, 03:03 PM   #138
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Cool find! It's odd that they have different exhaust and intake lobes shown for the V15NA cam and IPDT cam, considering both of those I think are supposed to be single pattern(also confirmed with your measurements).

And wow, that KG8 is serious!
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Old 03-25-2020, 03:35 PM   #139
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This is a good find. I notice these are from '07-08, and aren't we suspicious that the IPDT has gone through a change?

Yeah, that KG8 IS serious. I've said it before, the KG7 we had sounded like a two stroke. I can only imagine how this one runs (on carbs)!

Looks like our measurements are close(ish), particularly once you get off the ramps and onto the flanks.
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Old 03-25-2020, 03:43 PM   #140
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This is a good find. I notice these are from '07-08, and aren't we suspicious that the IPDT has gone through a change?
Nope.

At .050" the A cam numbers basically match yours, the K and T cam numbers are quite close as well with some slight variance. I can't explain the IPD or V15 differences that are shown on these spreadsheets, though.

Just think, the KG7 has only "304°" of duration as advertised, the KG8 has 315° and they also offer the KG9 with 324°. KG's camshaft designs just seem to be more of an old school design than the ENEM and AGAP offerings that go with more lift and less duration(relatively speaking, depending on your setup and how aggressive).

If the KG7's LSA was closer to a stock camshaft(108+), it likely would've operated better in a nearer to stock car. Oh well, that's where AGAP comes in, or a custom grind.

Last edited by klr142; 04-04-2020 at 01:09 AM..
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Old 03-28-2020, 07:07 PM   #141
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I had our KG7 ground on a 110 lobe sep. I think carbs would have been better, or if fuel economy didn't matter in our application. Makes me think about L98s in the late 80's, early 90's...the cams that places like Arizona Speed and Marine or Lingenfelter were all ground on 114 or MAYBE 112 lobe sep, so there was onlt so much total duration you could put in them. Couple that with poor head flow and a restrictive intake (sound familiar?) and you were only going to get so many rpm, and with that only so much hp.
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Old 04-04-2020, 01:31 AM   #142
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I pulled my broken V15 NA cam out today while organizing things. Should I send it in anyway? I know you have the V15 Turbo cam... and who knows when I would actually send it, considering the pandemic.

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hey I re-found the c2 whilst cleaning the shop last night. I'll work on getting it out the door.
Ready to send it yet?

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I had our KG7 ground on a 110 lobe sep. I think carbs would have been better, or if fuel economy didn't matter in our application.
I forgot to respond after reading this. That's just crazy that it had so little low end!
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Old 04-04-2020, 12:52 PM   #143
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Yeah Kyle, you can send it. We're getting to the time of the year when the weather is a crap shoot, but hey, it's broken, so I'd imagine there's no huge rush to get it back. Plus, I have very little else to do right now...

Oh yeah. It sounded SO AWESOME at idle, but as soon as we started the dyno pull, we all just kinda looked at each other and knew it was going to show poor numbers. It was so flat it was terrible. By flat I mean it didn't sound like it was accelerating with any kind of emphasis. I don't want it to reflect badly on the cam, it just wasn't appropriate for our application. We could have thrown a crapload of fuel at it, and who knows where it would have ended up, it could have been really good, absolute numbers wise. It would have been a waste of dyno time ($$$) for us to do that, though, so we just opted to call it quits. In retrospect, Cam and I both regret not tuning it and seeing what the results could have been.
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Old 04-04-2020, 05:16 PM   #144
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I'm curious how much the K-jet intake manifold makes a difference. When I put my big valve head back on my 244, I'll put in the K13 and see what it does again with the stock b230 intake. I have a better port job, I'll have more compression and a larger header than compared to the first time I had it in the car. Even then it wasn't bad, but now I'll be able to compare it to the k-jet intake(and stock valves, 405 head, stock exhaust manifold) we ran on the General with such great results.
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Old 04-08-2020, 06:09 PM   #145
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Camshaft is in the mail! It should be there next Wednesday or later on UPS ground.
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Old 04-09-2020, 12:04 PM   #146
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Might as well put this here. The only thing it needs right now is better numbers for the V15 camshafts.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing
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Old 04-09-2020, 03:56 PM   #147
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Might as well put this here. The only thing it needs right now is better numbers for the V15 camshafts.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...it?usp=sharing
Is it possible to make another one that is editable so we can plug in other information for our own specifications? Nice work!

Also, everyone should remember that we can run tighter and looser valve clearances to make camshafts act larger and smaller. I set up my T cam in my basically stock B230F 1987 244 at .012" or so, then retarded the cam 4 degrees, and it would pull past 5,000rpm(and did a 17.3 1/4 mile with an automatic). The M cam setup similarly but without the retardation was a 17.6 1/4 mile. Running stock clearances of over .016" would've been marginally slower. It can be a significant difference between setting valve clearances at .015"(or tighter) and .020", especially on some cams(Enem K13?!). That being said, on aftermarket camshafts you should probably listen to the cam builders and keep it at least close to what they recommend(especially if it's something more aggressive, like the Enem C2).

On that note, if you're having trouble getting passed emissions testing, loosen up those clearances. That got me through the local testing at idle more than once.

Last edited by klr142; 04-09-2020 at 04:02 PM..
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Old 04-11-2020, 01:10 PM   #148
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Quote:
Originally Posted by klr142 View Post
Is it possible to make another one that is editable so we can plug in other information for our own specifications? Nice work!

Also, everyone should remember that we can run tighter and looser valve clearances to make camshafts act larger and smaller. I set up my T cam in my basically stock B230F 1987 244 at .012" or so, then retarded the cam 4 degrees, and it would pull past 5,000rpm(and did a 17.3 1/4 mile with an automatic). The M cam setup similarly but without the retardation was a 17.6 1/4 mile. Running stock clearances of over .016" would've been marginally slower. It can be a significant difference between setting valve clearances at .015"(or tighter) and .020", especially on some cams(Enem K13?!). That being said, on aftermarket camshafts you should probably listen to the cam builders and keep it at least close to what they recommend(especially if it's something more aggressive, like the Enem C2).

On that note, if you're having trouble getting passed emissions testing, loosen up those clearances. That got me through the local testing at idle more than once.
I'll draw up a version where people can fork off copies of it. I think that may be difficult right now because there is a component that relies on a custom script. I also want to add something to account for different valve clearances.
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Old 05-01-2020, 06:35 AM   #149
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100,000 views. I guess you guys find this at least interesting, if not useful. Thanks!
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Old 05-01-2020, 09:44 AM   #150
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I dig it...I have no idea what I'm looking at, really, but I dig it . I've got a B21A with an A cam already in it on the stand, and am considering swapping it into a B230F I just acquired and going back to carbs. It's nice to see numbers so I can learn.
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