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Old 07-10-2017, 04:01 PM   #1
DavidSamuels
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Default Overload springs

Need to get some additional ride height in the back of a 245, but I'm told that the iPD wagon overload springs are really "trailer" stuff. Thinking of putting sedan overloads in. Anyone care to "weigh" in? I know the sedan springs give you a bunch more height....in a sedan.
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Old 07-10-2017, 04:28 PM   #2
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I bought my rear overload coils for my 245 from FCPeuro and have been using them for over ten years. They raised the back of the wagon a bit maybe an inch or so. Certainly more than the lighter overload springs for a sedan would raise it.
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Old 07-10-2017, 04:40 PM   #3
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Interesting. Any idea what the wire size is? I'm looking at iPD's offerings. Wonder how much difference there is. Off to FCP's site to see if there are specs. Thanks.
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Old 07-10-2017, 04:46 PM   #4
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My Wife's car has the ipd wagon overloads. I've been told there's a difference in load carrying ability between the sedan and wagon overloads offered by them; being the wagon holds more. Definitely helps with full trunks on trips and car loads of people. The springs have given her car some serious rake to it, which I plan on using to create a modest "lift" with. Just need to find some good "heavy duty" front springs to level it out.
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Old 07-10-2017, 04:55 PM   #5
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^

I've been told the diesel front springs are significantly stiffer, since the diesel engine was heavier and all. Alternately some people have put spacers in there. Too much and you start getting geometry / alignment issues though.
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Old 07-10-2017, 05:02 PM   #6
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Why not get kaplans adjustable kit? Pick your own spring rate
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Old 07-10-2017, 05:03 PM   #7
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Okay, found a bunch of stuff in the shed. My son's wagon came with overloads in the back. Took them out when we lowered it. Don't know who's, but they are 13.5mm diameter. I remember they were pretty tall, compared to the stock springs we used instead. I also just found a honking set of springs that are 15.8mm!!! Don't know what they came out of though. I don't have a set of stock wagon springs lying around to measure, both mine are on sport springs. Messaged iPD for info. As to FCP, they are no longer showing overloads that I can find. They have a spring they say was specifically designed for 240/260 and is HD for sedans and coupes, standard for wagon (chuckle). But then they have a 14mm diameter spring just for wagons. ProParts. This is interesting considering the tall overloads in my son's wagon are only 13.5. Anybody have a wire diameter on stock, wagon rear springs?
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Old 07-10-2017, 05:06 PM   #8
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^

I've been told the diesel front springs are significantly stiffer, since the diesel engine was heavier and all. Alternately some people have put spacers in there. Too much and you start getting geometry / alignment issues though.

Yeah, but everyone wants an arm and a leg for something they probably got for cheap. For the price most people are wanting for them, I could get some new 14.5mm wire Lesjofors front springs shipped to my door. Which is probably what I'm going to do...as soon as I check the wire diameter of the current springs.
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Old 07-10-2017, 05:37 PM   #9
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The front is definitely going to be more of a challenge, geometry considered. It's already so hard to get below positive camber on a 240 at stock height. Camber kit may be in the future of this project.
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Old 07-10-2017, 05:44 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by DavidSamuels View Post
Anybody have a wire diameter on stock, wagon rear springs?
Wagon rear spring wire diameters varied depending on year and market. Early wagons used 12.7mm springs. Depending on which catalog you look at, later wagons used either 12.95 or 13mm springs, although the part number is the same. In some markets like Australia, wagons were equipped with 13.8mm springs.
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Old 07-10-2017, 05:54 PM   #11
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Good info, but these 13.5s were definitely taller than stock.
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Old 07-10-2017, 05:54 PM   #12
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And the 16 mms are huge!
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Old 07-10-2017, 06:01 PM   #13
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Any of you know how these would compare to overloads?
https://www.amazon.com/Moog-CC217-Co.../dp/B000C57U88
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Old 07-11-2017, 03:13 AM   #14
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I put IPD overloads with Bilstein HD's in the back of my 245 a few months ago, They raised the back about .75" and are a little stiffer but not too firm when empty. I haven't tried pulling a trailer yet but they do feel better with a load in the car.




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Old 07-11-2017, 06:34 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by dl242gt View Post
I bought my rear overload coils for my 245 from FCPeuro and have been using them for over ten years. They raised the back of the wagon a bit maybe an inch or so. Certainly more than the lighter overload springs for a sedan would raise it.
+1

Ran a set of these as well, and they definitely stiffened up the arse end of my 245. I believe they were 14mm wire coils.... not as stiff as the IPD brutes but still a noticeable increase above the stocker vaggen springs.
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Old 07-11-2017, 08:27 AM   #16
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I have Moog overloads on my 245. It's a progressively wound overload spring. Raised it a bit - maybe 1/2-3/4". Little stiffer. Running them with "rally valved" Bilsteins and it's a good ride with improved roll resistance.

They are only $50 too, how can you go wrong

Edit: Rockauto says they are 14.2mm wire diameter.
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Old 07-12-2017, 06:59 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by tjanson View Post
I have Moog overloads on my 245. It's a progressively wound overload spring. Raised it a bit - maybe 1/2-3/4". Little stiffer. Running them with "rally valved" Bilsteins and it's a good ride with improved roll resistance.

They are only $50 too, how can you go wrong

Edit: Rockauto says they are 14.2mm wire diameter.
+1

Bang for buck here is great, I love mine. I'm running stock-valved HDs and it's a little bouncy, how'd you get this "rally" valving you speak of?
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Old 07-12-2017, 10:44 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tjanson View Post
I have Moog overloads on my 245. It's a progressively wound overload spring. Raised it a bit - maybe 1/2-3/4". Little stiffer. Running them with "rally valved" Bilsteins and it's a good ride with improved roll resistance.

They are only $50 too, how can you go wrong

Edit: Rockauto says they are 14.2mm wire diameter.
I'm looking for increased roll resistance and stock or slightly lower than stock ride height. I installed iPd 25/25 bars today but the roll is still insane. Do you think these springs with 1 coil or so cut off would stiffen this up? And how do you think they would pair with some bilstien HD's?
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Old 07-13-2017, 08:56 AM   #19
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iPD responded on their springs, but not with any really good information. Sedan are 14.2 mm wire dia. They say they don't publish spring rates (??!!). Also cautioned that using either spring in the wrong model voids warranty (of course). Said that even though they are both overload, (and the sedan spring is thicker wire than stock wagon springs) the sedan springs would result in a wagon with lower than stock ride height in back. That sure doesn't sound right. Just passing along the info.
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Old 07-13-2017, 01:10 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by muppetman342 View Post
+1

Bang for buck here is great, I love mine. I'm running stock-valved HDs and it's a little bouncy, how'd you get this "rally" valving you speak of?
I have the Bilstein "Rally" valved struts and shocks.

34-030837 Front struts 350/150 Valving
24-022118 rear shocks 275/200 valving

They both aren't far from your typical HD price. The rears and 1 front were in stock but it took about 9 months to get the last front strut. Basically Bilstein will do a run of them once they have a few orders but I was the only order with qty:1. Eventually the wonderful customer service coordinator at AJUSA (I ordered the struts through AJ) got Bilstein to revalve a standard HD to the 34-030837 specs at no additional charge.

Rather than buying them, you can also just have standard HDs revalved to match the specs.

I'm running the front struts with 175lb coilover springs. I think I'm gonna move up to 200lb/in springs. The 200 lb/in springs were too stiff for HD struts for the rough roads I drive but
now the 175s are too soft for the rally struts. I think the HD valving is stiff to compensate for a soft stock spring.

Bilstein catalog for 240s:
http://cart.bilsteinus.com/search/mm.../drivetype=RWD
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Old 07-13-2017, 01:18 PM   #21
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I've run the IPD overloads in the back, and it made the 245 finally sit close to level. It still rode decent, and didn't sag under load as badly as it did before.

Message me some time David and we can talk about easy solutions to fit your needs, but if Jason's old rear springs are overloads I'd throw those in and see what it does for you.
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Old 07-13-2017, 01:19 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by PromiseRing View Post
I'm looking for increased roll resistance and stock or slightly lower than stock ride height. I installed iPd 25/25 bars today but the roll is still insane. Do you think these springs with 1 coil or so cut off would stiffen this up? And how do you think they would pair with some bilstien HD's?
If a 25mm bar didn't do it for you I'm not sure these springs will. They will help though, how much, I have no idea. I never was satisfied with HD rears with stock springs and I never ran HDs with these overload springs. My idea of "performance" though, it being able to do 45 mph on snowy, frost-heaved dirt road with the car staying predictable and composed. (i.e. my daily commute)
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Old 07-13-2017, 01:54 PM   #23
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I've got stock wagon rear springs and HDs on my 242, along with IPD 25/25 bars. The back end is a bit stiff for my liking and rolls off speedbumps like jumping off a stool with your knees locked. Has a tendency for oversteer but it's just right when towing a trailer. I think if I were going to start over I'd try the stock springs with HDs and might consider one size smaller on the rear bar. 25mm in the front feels like a good setup though, corners nice and flat without being too harsh.
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Old 07-13-2017, 02:18 PM   #24
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Make coilovers for cheap and raise the height all the way up
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Old 07-13-2017, 11:02 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by DavidSamuels View Post
...As to FCP, they are no longer showing overloads that I can find. They have a spring they say was specifically designed for 240/260 and is HD for sedans and coupes, standard for wagon (chuckle). But then they have a 14mm diameter spring just for wagons. ProParts. This is interesting considering the tall overloads in my son's wagon are only 13.5. Anybody have a wire diameter on stock, wagon rear springs?
FCP had these on sale early this year and I bought a set and they are 14mm.
https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/vol...arket-43615816
In the ad they list the OE part #. Maybe you can look that up to find someone else selling them. What I like about the springs is that all the coils are evenly spaced. None are close to touching. I've seen some where near the top or bottom the coils touch or are damned close. I don't know for a fact that it's a bad thing but I always avoid that.
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