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Old 09-13-2017, 08:55 AM   #26
84 Blue 240
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Originally Posted by Lankku View Post
Rant(ish?).

It'll cost any way you want to do it. Valve job isn't the biggest expense but I'd say it's not wasted when going for bigger power. And a mild, even correctly homemade, porting is good too. Though you can always add more boost to achieve the goal?

For a 500hp 5-cyl I would use B5234T(81mm bore vs B5254 weaker 83mm bore). H-beams and custom exhaust manifold, everything else stock. Turbo pistons are fine for about 117hp/piece. Though I'm not 100% sure about how older or newer FWD intake flow. but I'd guess they'll be fine for that. I'm not that much into the details of the intake because 6-cyl is soo much easier to drop in.

I'd guess that B5254T is good for max 350-400hp with H-beams depending on the turbo size. The bigger turbo, the less torque on low rpm to brake cylinders if that's going to happen. Most if not all higher hp engines are built with 81mm bore because they are considered stronger. B I have no idea how well 83mm bore cylinders last with having grooves between cylinders filled(about that near the end).

As for 6-cyl, I find all round driveablity way better than 5-cyl and it's easier to make the same power.
B6284T needs just about rods, change of throttlebody, RWD oil pan & engine mounts and drilling & tapping one hole for left engine mount. After that it's ready to run and has exhaust VVT. Intake flows up to about 700hp. At least I couldn't get any more than that with a T6 intake.

If you want to fiddle around, use B6254 block, stock RWD intake, H-beams, B4194T(T4), B5234T or B6284T pistons, B6304 crankshaft and B6245 or B6304 head. 204hp B6304 cams have more lift and power comes a bit easier. B6254 cams can be used too and they have same lift as B6284T. Block is good for around 600hp or even more and RWD intake works at least up to 800hp.

For all the engines above. Fill the grooves between cylinders for example with feeler gauge slices or other material which is suitable thickness. This applies to any whiteblock until the latest ones(?). Without those cylinders could and will crack under higher pressure and temperature. Block casting is thinner, doesn't support cylinders that well and especially in overheated engines casting collapses in to the groove on its own. This can be seen even in stock engines and ultimately as cracked cylinders.

ps. B6284T block itself is good for ~1000hp just with grooves filled. Friend had his "B6284T" tortured in an engine dyno for a while. Just over 1000hp and ~1150Nm with no problems. I've had only 800hp so far on mine And due to trying to avoid problems with the engine my current block has a block reinforcement similar in the pic above. It also fills the areas between cylinders.
Awesome post!!
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I just wanted to know if the '87 740 turbo came with a differential? If so, which one?
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Old 09-13-2017, 08:59 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by 84 Blue 240 View Post
Awesome post!!
Yep and I found a 1999 6284T engine at a junkyard warehouse clearance for $500 with both turbos on!
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Old 09-13-2017, 09:00 AM   #28
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i want your yoshifab DSM CAS if you have!
I have but I will try to sell the whole setup as a package first before parting it out.
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Old 09-13-2017, 09:20 AM   #29
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;) i can understand that, but i dont like it.. :D
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Old 09-14-2017, 04:28 PM   #30
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Just trying to share some experiences

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Originally Posted by Vincent Gagnon View Post
Are you sure this dosen't have something to do with flame propagation rather than the solidity of the bloc?
Yes. I have seen many stock NA engines with blocks that have started to collapse between the cylinders. No headgasket damage or such needed, just time and use. Worst one was badly overheated B6304 with two cracked cylinders I haven't seen too many blocks that are completely in original form between cylinders. Minor collapse is not fatal in hard use if grooves are filled tightly.

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Originally Posted by poulrais View Post
Yep and I found a 1999 6284T engine at a junkyard warehouse clearance for $500 with both turbos on!
If turbos are fine, then you could make a great ~300hp daily/etc. out of that package I did a B6254 with T6 turbos and a M90 a couple years back into a 245 and it had the nicest behaviour yet.

You can use RWD intake manifold in T6 engine if you cut the T6 intake runners from correct spot. Suitable silicone hoses or similar to join them. Or weld. Then just make supports for fuel rail and under the plenum to stock place. No hassle with cables and linkages because 960 parts are direct fit.

With T6 intake you can use "bolt-on" 960 throttle cable, linkage and body if you flip the plenum upside down. Make an adaptor for the TB and stand for linkage. And of course fuel rail needs supports too. Something like this(partially finished at that point). This also creates a space issue on the steering pump side and you'll have to modify the plenum a bit. I'd go for the RWD intake for less hassle.
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Old 09-14-2017, 11:39 PM   #31
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Something like

this.
Guys be sure to click the 'Play' arrow at top right.

Have tissues handy.

Lankku.... Broken drivetrain parts to ya! Bravo Sir.
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Old 09-15-2017, 11:57 AM   #32
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This thread has me wanting to ditch the redblock in favor of a B6284 :\
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Nothing's black magic. Basics to moderate power levels are cake, period. Start off rich and retarded, like your president.
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Old 09-18-2017, 07:46 AM   #33
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This is the Whiteblock 5 cylinder engine I inherited... The exhaust valves are in a bad shape and one has a nice hole in it:



I think I'll just scrap it.
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Old 09-18-2017, 07:53 AM   #34
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what me bothers is that a pile of crap makes you want to swap out your 16v ;)

It's like.. 16v isnt cool anymore...
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Old 09-18-2017, 09:52 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by MadDog_945 View Post
what me bothers is that a pile of crap makes you want to swap out your 16v ;)

It's like.. 16v isnt cool anymore...
I've had my 16V +T running for like 5 years now. I just want to try something else but I want to stay with the Volvo engine and not the 2JZ or LS way.

My 16V is still running like a beast and it is pretty impressive for a 2.3 liter 4 banger.
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Old 09-18-2017, 09:56 AM   #36
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What is the weight difference between the 16V and the whiteblock 5cyl?
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Old 09-18-2017, 10:21 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lankku View Post
Just trying to share some experiences


Yes. I have seen many stock NA engines with blocks that have started to collapse between the cylinders. No headgasket damage or such needed, just time and use. Worst one was badly overheated B6304 with two cracked cylinders I haven't seen too many blocks that are completely in original form between cylinders. Minor collapse is not fatal in hard use if grooves are filled tightly.


If turbos are fine, then you could make a great ~300hp daily/etc. out of that package I did a B6254 with T6 turbos and a M90 a couple years back into a 245 and it had the nicest behaviour yet.

You can use RWD intake manifold in T6 engine if you cut the T6 intake runners from correct spot. Suitable silicone hoses or similar to join them. Or weld. Then just make supports for fuel rail and under the plenum to stock place. No hassle with cables and linkages because 960 parts are direct fit.

With T6 intake you can use "bolt-on" 960 throttle cable, linkage and body if you flip the plenum upside down. Make an adaptor for the TB and stand for linkage. And of course fuel rail needs supports too. Something like this(partially finished at that point). This also creates a space issue on the steering pump side and you'll have to modify the plenum a bit. I'd go for the RWD intake for less hassle.
Is it possible to use a 6 cylinder turbo engine with a 30-43 transmission? How did you solve the issue of engine control, which eсu used?
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Old 09-18-2017, 10:45 AM   #38
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What is the weight difference between the 16V and the whiteblock 5cyl?
They weight about the same and even a little less as the aluminum block compensates the extra cylinder...
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Old 09-18-2017, 12:14 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by poulrais View Post
They weight about the same and even a little less as the aluminum block compensates the extra cylinder...
I do not know about the 5 cyl.

I got rid of a whiteblock a few year ago that was in my 960. I assure you it's waaaaaaaaaay heavier than a redblock. I do not have the exact number, but I can lift a redblock to move it over short distances, but with the whiteblock me and my friend had touble just dragging it on the gound. I would be curious to know if anybody have actual numbers. Remember, there is a 200kg difference between a 740 and a 960... for essentially the same car.
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Old 09-18-2017, 01:31 PM   #40
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I do not know about the 5 cyl.

I got rid of a whiteblock a few year ago that was in my 960. I assure you it's waaaaaaaaaay heavier than a redblock. I do not have the exact number, but I can lift a redblock to move it over short distances, but with the whiteblock me and my friend had touble just dragging it on the gound. I would be curious to know if anybody have actual numbers. Remember, there is a 200kg difference between a 740 and a 960... for essentially the same car.
The whiteblock in the 960 is a 6 cylinder engine...

The 5 cylinder engine is rated at 153 kg or around 340 pounds. That is a dry weight and it holds like 6,2 liters or oil.
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Old 09-18-2017, 01:45 PM   #41
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The whiteblock in the 960 is a 6 cylinder engine...

The 5 cylinder engine is rated at 153 kg or around 340 pounds. That is a dry weight and it holds like 6,2 liters or oil.
Roger that.

And for the 16v setup... how much?

I need and engine. The stock na 8valves is crap for this :
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Old 09-18-2017, 02:14 PM   #42
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Roger that.

And for the 16v setup... how much?

I need and engine. The stock na 8valves is crap for this :
Je vais te caller ce soir... Mais ça te coûterait un peu cher juste pour tirer une roulotte!
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Old 09-18-2017, 02:30 PM   #43
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Je vais te caller ce soir... Mais ça te coûterait un peu cher juste pour tirer une roulotte!
C'est très mal me connaître!

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Old 09-18-2017, 02:44 PM   #44
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C'est très mal me connaître!

Tu vas devoir installer un spoiler sur ta roulotte pour lui donner un peu de downforce!
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Old 09-20-2017, 05:04 PM   #45
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Is it possible to use a 6 cylinder turbo engine with a 30-43 transmission? How did you solve the issue of engine control, which eсu used?
Haven't used any because an automatic doesn't fit in to my interests, but it's possible. Don't know if it can take (much)over 400hp. At least not drag use. Friend did use one and it's a bit slow when shifting up from 1st and 2nd. If I remember correctly he had Megasquirt driving secondary injectors along stock Motronic 4.4. He broke the transmission pretty fast while doing 1/4 mile passes with under 400hp. When using only an aftermarcet ecu you'll need MegaShift, Suprastick or similar.

I've used stock 1.8 Motronic for both under 300hp turbo engines and different Megasquirt versions for the other two.
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Old 09-21-2017, 03:41 PM   #46
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Haven't used any because an automatic doesn't fit in to my interests, but it's possible. Don't know if it can take (much)over 400hp. At least not drag use. Friend did use one and it's a bit slow when shifting up from 1st and 2nd. If I remember correctly he had Megasquirt driving secondary injectors along stock Motronic 4.4. He broke the transmission pretty fast while doing 1/4 mile passes with under 400hp. When using only an aftermarcet ecu you'll need MegaShift, Suprastick or similar.

I've used stock 1.8 Motronic for both under 300hp turbo engines and different Megasquirt versions for the other two.
Do you know a company that sells HBeam rods for the B6284T engine as well as forged pistons?

EDIT:// found these...

http://www.dli-teknik.se/index.php?s...=16860&lang=en

Around $750 USD...

Last edited by poulrais; 09-21-2017 at 03:59 PM..
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Old 09-21-2017, 05:00 PM   #47
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Do you know a company that sells HBeam rods for the B6284T engine as well as forged pistons?

EDIT:// found these...

http://www.dli-teknik.se/index.php?s...=16860&lang=en

Around $750 USD...
As for rods:

Got mine from Maxspeedingrods through some local (Estonia, EU) reseller. Just under 400€ for a set of 6 including ARP 2000 bolts, supposedly balanced to +/- 1g across set (haven't weighed them myself yet), small ends need some honing but I guess that's usually the case. I've read they're pretty much decent so I'd get in touch with them directly to get a balanced set put together (mine came straigh from the manufacturer as they don't normally balance sets of 6 and it took about a month but hey).

Also there's ACM... though bit pricier. Also L-M-R and KL-Racing in sweden.


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Old 09-21-2017, 06:06 PM   #48
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As for rods:

Got mine from Maxspeedingrods through some local (Estonia, EU) reseller. Just under 400€ for a set of 6 including ARP 2000 bolts, supposedly balanced to +/- 1g across set (haven't weighed them myself yet), small ends need some honing but I guess that's usually the case. I've read they're pretty much decent so I'd get in touch with them directly to get a balanced set put together (mine came straigh from the manufacturer as they don't normally balance sets of 6 and it took about a month but hey).

Also there's ACM... though bit pricier. Also L-M-R and KL-Racing in sweden.


Thanks for the infos... $580 CAD for the Maxspeedingrods vs $880 CAD for the ACM... Are they worth the price difference?
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Old 09-22-2017, 04:21 AM   #49
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Thanks for the infos... $580 CAD for the Maxspeedingrods vs $880 CAD for the ACM... Are they worth the price difference?
No idea, sorry. I'm on my first ever attempt at an engine build so I have no experience with either :P
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Old 09-22-2017, 10:28 AM   #50
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Haven't used any because an automatic doesn't fit in to my interests, but it's possible. Don't know if it can take (much)over 400hp. At least not drag use. Friend did use one and it's a bit slow when shifting up from 1st and 2nd. If I remember correctly he had Megasquirt driving secondary injectors along stock Motronic 4.4. He broke the transmission pretty fast while doing 1/4 mile passes with under 400hp. When using only an aftermarcet ecu you'll need MegaShift, Suprastick or similar.

I've used stock 1.8 Motronic for both under 300hp turbo engines and different Megasquirt versions for the other two.

In Russia it is very popular to use automatic aisin on Toyota for drag racing. And already quite a few cars are do 8-9 seconds with these transmissions. The Volvo has a very similar transmission, so I thought that it could be upgraded for use at high power.

You write that you are using the 1.8 mothronic for 300 hp cars. And how does this ECU understand that there is a boost? Or are you together with the standard ECU, use another megasquirt for the second row of injectors?
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