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Advance/retard timing on EZ116K

I think I want to try this out on my car while it's still NA... We'll see. I think I've heard some pinging in the past though on regular gas in the hot heat, but I haven't heard it lately and it's been even hotter, so... Yeah, I'll give it a whirl sometime, not sure when as I'm pretty busy lately. How are you guys grounding the pins? I just want to do the 18 and 19 in combo one, I'm pretty sure I don't want to run 6 or more advanced.
 
I still havent had a chance to play with these combinations and measure the effect. Tomorrow morning my car has the annual inspection, and tomorrow evening i go to sweden... :)
 
klr142 said:
I think I want to try this out on my car while it's still NA... We'll see. I think I've heard some pinging in the past though on regular gas in the hot heat, but I haven't heard it lately and it's been even hotter, so... Yeah, I'll give it a whirl sometime, not sure when as I'm pretty busy lately. How are you guys grounding the pins? I just want to do the 18 and 19 in combo one, I'm pretty sure I don't want to run 6 or more advanced.
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The N/A 2.4 comps were good at making the funky marbles and ping demon sounds. I have this suspicion that you may not want to do it on an N/A fuel box. Put a turbo fuel box on there and try it. And yes, you can run a turbo boxen without the turbo. I did for a couple of months before I got the snail on.
 
Yeah, I remember you and (possibly) someone else doing just that, and was highly considering it. I can't imagine why it'd be pinging though because on the dyno my car was running more rich than lean... Unlike most NA 2.2 cars I've seen. You think the turbo box would cause it to not detonate? Did you ever check mpg between the two(iirc something kept you from being able to compare the two)?
 
With the BS gas we get in the summer I get tip in PING, still would like to advance the timing for a little more torque B4 the boost kicks in. So if I read correctly grounding pin 18 and 19 will advance my timing by 3 degrees, across the board. I have lh 2.4, If I'm wrong let me know
 
BDKR said:
The N/A 2.4 comps were good at making the funky marbles and ping demon sounds. I have this suspicion that you may not want to do it on an N/A fuel box. Put a turbo fuel box on there and try it. And yes, you can run a turbo boxen without the turbo. I did for a couple of months before I got the snail on.
Click to expand...
So do I ground the pins on the fuel box? or ign box.
 
k4dje said:
So do I ground the pins on the fuel box? or ign box.
Click to expand...
Ignition box.

Can someone please try all the mentioned combinations? My car is still inoperable...
 
Arrrggh! I forgot and spent the evening under the rear of my car instead of in the passenger's footwell where I would have probably soaked the carpet with sweat.

I will do this today after work since I have pretty much completed work on the rear suspension. Sorry, Fred.
 
Thats what im screaming

I went about all this a total differnt way. I have modified the bracket for the flywheel pickup and notched the bellhousing so i can adjust the timing, utelizing a sawzall.

However im intrigued!
After installling the b234 in my 1990 ti 740 last week, im curious to see how both mods will work-first my own -then of course i will try this theory.


Ive already used the pot to control the fuel with 440 cc supra (mk3) injectors on past na+t setups with fantastic results. Also for you gurus out there i actually have an old jacobs timing controller off an na supra -not sure on how it wires up but i have it if it would be of use to anyone to experiment with this let me know.It has rev limit knob -turbo timer knob and advance retard knob...

Now ive got to weld up some pipes to attatch to the stock b234 exhaust manifold, and a turbo(ct26 stock supra turbo) and fire it up....Is there a market for this piece?


Great info guys-i love the research that is going on here!

http://home.comcast.net/~volvo4life/Index.html

Kris Weldy
1990 740ti now b234 t (will run soon)
1989 supra turbo hdtp t4 cartech turbo kit, haltech and 24psi of fury, many other mods true to era...Back from houston supra meet txtk6
2002 dodge pu 4x4 1500
2002 bonniville supercharged
1996 dodge avenger es
 
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i know this can be done , since the 480 can be made to run high boost without the cut , whilst using the original boost solenoid , bosch made it all possible .

unfortunately i dont have the nitty gritty since somebody wanted to keep it for himself .
 
I had this all typed out and it went to the internet gods arrrgh.....

I'm using a snap-on dial back light, analog not digital,.so my numbers could be off a couple degrees either way. I did repeat every number 3 times. The first thing I noticed is the initial advance remains un-changed, mine is reading 15 degrees with all combos. When I started grounding pins and nothing changed I thought I wasted 2 hours. anyway when I reved the motor the advance curves did change. The initial retard at the hit of the throttle remained the same with all, about 8 degrees. I did not have a helper or a tach that I could see, I'm guessing the the curve is all in around 4000 RPM.

No pins grounded = 42 degrees total advance

GND 18 = No change (could be the error of the dial on the light)

GND 19 = 40 degrees total

Gnd 21 = 45 degrees

Gnd 25 = 45 degrees

Gnd 18 & 19 = 50 degrees

Gnd 18, 19 & 21 = 50 degrees

Gnd 18,19,21,& 25 = 50 degrees

Gnd 18 & 21 = 43

19 & 21 = 40

21 & 25 = 46

25 & 18 = 44

25 & 19 = 41

At this point I decided to quit Hope this helps
 
Did you measure the advance at the same rpm for all combos? The results seems a little sporadic.

I really appreciate the time you have put in to this :) .

I still really want more people trying the combinations and confirming it though (maybe with a better light and someone to help out), just to get everything right.

EDIT:// I am glad that the 18+19 combo gave you better power. That is very good. It is a step in the right direction.
 
klr142 said:
...You think the turbo box would cause it to not detonate?
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The 2.4 turbo boxes seem to deal with needed accelleration enrichment better then the N/A boxes. Mine used to initially ping for a second or two when flooring the pedal. That all cleared up when going to the turbo box.

HOWEVER, I have never seen this behaviour on my wifes car, which is a bone stock '89 244. The only difference being that she has allways had a 3 row while I've come to realise that my cooling system was allways marginal.

So take this with a grain of salt.

klr142 said:
Did you ever check mpg between the two(iirc something kept you from being able to compare the two)?
Click to expand...

No, I never did, but it certainly didn't harm it one bit.
 
frpe82 said:
Did you measure the advance at the same rpm for all combos? The results seems a little sporadic.

I really appreciate the time you have put in to this :) .

I still really want more people trying the combinations and confirming it though (maybe with a better light and someone to help out), just to get everything right.

EDIT:// I am glad that the 18+19 combo gave you better power. That is very good. It is a step in the right direction.
Click to expand...
I don't see what is erratic. I tested at total advance wherever that ended up being, I'm guessing 4000 RPM I left the wires hooked up so it will be fairly easy to plot curves, I just need a helper it is not easy holdint the throttle and the timing light and then adjusting the dial, ended up doing that with my mouth. The second time through was easier cause I had the numbers wrote down and all I had to do was set the dial then rev the engine and wait for the advance to max out. The numbers I gave were repeatable. The 18 & 19 curve is quicker and advances farther like putting lighter springs and making the slots longer in an old style dizzy. I'm happy with the mod, glad I found this thread the increase in power is noticable B4 standing on the gas would get no tire spin till boost, now it chirps, and boost comes on quicker. Well worth the effort.
 
k4dje said:
I don't see what is erratic. I tested at total advance wherever that ended up being, I'm guessing 4000 RPM I left the wires hooked up so it will be fairly easy to plot curves, I just need a helper it is not easy holdint the throttle and the timing light and then adjusting the dial, ended up doing that with my mouth. The second time through was easier cause I had the numbers wrote down and all I had to do was set the dial then rev the engine and wait for the advance to max out. The numbers I gave were repeatable. The 18 & 19 curve is quicker and advances farther like putting lighter springs and making the slots longer in an old style dizzy. I'm happy with the mod, glad I found this thread the increase in power is noticable B4 standing on the gas would get no tire spin till boost, now it chirps, and boost comes on quicker. Well worth the effort.
Click to expand...
Now I get you.

I still want more people trying it and posting their results though, just to confirm the numbers.

Once again, great work! :cool:
 
I would bet all the boxes will have slightly diffrent responses. Hopefully they will all have the same trends. I have another ezk and fuel box I might swap them and see if the results mirror.
 
BDKR said:
So take this with a grain of salt.
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My cooling system as far as I know is all original... And when sitting relatively still for over 5-10 minutes near idle in 90+ degree heat makes my temp guage go up to just barely under the red... When normally it doesn't really EVER go abov half way. Which is probably because of that stupid stabilizer thing that Volvo has... I want to get rid of that, will have to look it up. So, I do indeed think it may help and sounds like something I'd like to do.

The more and more I learn about these things, the more and more I want to stay NA and see what I can do with it... Because here in the US it's like (almost) no one's really tried relatively smartly/hard to make NA power. And I'd have immediate throttle response, less weight(specifically in the FRONT of my ALREADY front heavy car...), better gas mileage for the most part, and adequate power for being a DD. But then I think about the extra 100+hp I'll have if I toss on a 15g... But then I might almost have to worry about upgrading the brakes further, and etc. It is a DD/trip car after all.
 
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