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Megasquirt installation, looks like spaghetti

I thought I was going to get mail when there was a reply, must have missed something.

culberro said:
We all started somewhere...
But if you?re going to do it, do it right.
https://flic.kr/p/2ivdyzn

https://flic.kr/p/2ivb12Y
Click to expand...
That's very nice, I poked holes in the rubber-thing where the AC-lines go, if one has AC. Not so nice.

Victorrr said:
Wow, I thought I was the only one with the idea of putting MS into the glovebox. Planning on doing a neat MicroSquirt install in there, with relays N wires ect.. MAP sensor too, I can already feel the laugh generator asking passenger to "Hey can you grab something in the glovebox please" :rofl:

OP, just a question, what flexfuel sensor are you running ?
Click to expand...
It's the "usual" Continental sensor, I can't find where i bought it. It just works with standard settings (and 5v pull-up in ms).
I have not tested more than reading the % of normal gasolin, which in Sweden has ~5% etanol (E5).
In Tunerstudio I see 5-6% reading, sounds right.
<a href='https://www.bildtagg.se/bild/h7u87mi90p3cc8udfleke3tu' target='_blank'><IMG src='https://www.bildtagg.se/file/thumb/h7u87mi90p3cc8udfleke3tu' /></a>

I have made an attempt at making things in the glovebox more tangible. It's at least better, and now I know what the fuses are for, and how many there actually are :roll:
<a href='https://www.bildtagg.se/bild/olio5kkwpji31mgkd4mcq' target='_blank'><IMG src='https://www.bildtagg.se/file/thumb/olio5kkwpji31mgkd4mcq' /></a>
I moved the relay-coil-thing down where the original fuelbox was, still get cutouts on the fuel relay.
There is the possibility that I have managed to set more than one I/O on the same pin, I read that somewhere. Going through the settings but my laptop died yesterday.
 
Hilding said:
I thought I was going to get mail when there was a reply, must have missed something.


That's very nice, I poked holes in the rubber-thing where the AC-lines go, if one has AC. Not so nice.


It's the "usual" Continental sensor, I can't find where i bought it. It just works with standard settings (and 5v pull-up in ms).
I have not tested more than reading the % of normal gasolin, which in Sweden has ~5% etanol (E5).
In Tunerstudio I see 5-6% reading, sounds right.
<a href='https://www.bildtagg.se/bild/h7u87mi90p3cc8udfleke3tu' target='_blank'><IMG src='https://www.bildtagg.se/file/thumb/h7u87mi90p3cc8udfleke3tu' /></a>

I have made an attempt at making things in the glovebox more tangible. It's at least better, and now I know what the fuses are for, and how many there actually are :roll:
<a href='https://www.bildtagg.se/bild/olio5kkwpji31mgkd4mcq' target='_blank'><IMG src='https://www.bildtagg.se/file/thumb/olio5kkwpji31mgkd4mcq' /></a>
I moved the relay-coil-thing down where the original fuelbox was, still get cutouts on the fuel relay.
There is the possibility that I have managed to set more than one I/O on the same pin, I read that somewhere. Going through the settings but my laptop died yesterday.
Click to expand...

Sweden ! I'm from France, nice to know we can locate these things in Europe. Hope it doesn't cost much, I'm buying lots of things from KG Trimning and completely forgot to factor in the 25% VAT... shieetdd !

You used the fuel relay as a main power source for the MS box ?
I think I'll rewire from the battery to a separate relay. I'll have two parallel systems and fusebox, one for the car (lights, wipers ect..) and the other one for MS, injection and ignition. I don't have the time for a complete re-wire but I really don't want to use anything from the stock harness. Despite being an 88 and not having the bio-degradable harnesses, I've had too much trouble with it already, can't trust it anymore (especially the fuel relays)
 
Victorrr said:
Sweden ! I'm from France, nice to know we can locate these things in Europe. Hope it doesn't cost much, I'm buying lots of things from KG Trimning and completely forgot to factor in the 25% VAT... shieetdd !

You used the fuel relay as a main power source for the MS box ?
I think I'll rewire from the battery to a separate relay. I'll have two parallel systems and fusebox, one for the car (lights, wipers ect..) and the other one for MS, injection and ignition. I don't have the time for a complete re-wire but I really don't want to use anything from the stock harness. Despite being an 88 and not having the bio-degradable harnesses, I've had too much trouble with it already, can't trust it anymore (especially the fuel relays)
Click to expand...

I managed to find where i bought it:
https://www.speeding.nu/p/motorstyr...fuel-etanolgivare/etanolgivare-flexifuel.html
not sure if it helps you but there it is at least.

I have 2 relays, one "main" that then feeds the fuel pump relay (which is grounded by the MS).
The MS is on the "main" relay and everything else is on the fuel pump relay.
So the MS doesn't go down when the relay clicks, but everything else does. Most noticeable the wide band lambda.


Saved a copy of my .msq and opened it with kate (notepad) and searched f?r JS7 (the pin I use for flex fuel). There are several functions that have JS7 as the default, but none of them are active (launch control, idle up AC, nitro) in my settings. seems strange if they would interfere despite that.
I have now activated the other functions and changed the pin to JS11 (not used at all by me) and then deactivated the functions again.

The other change since getting these issues I've done is using JS10 for Tach output, I can't find that any other function has JS10.

I'm gonna give it a go with these changes, if this doesn't help I'll deactive Tach output and the flex fuel sensor and see if that helps.



I find the lack of revealing pictures disturbing.
 
Hilding said:
I managed to find where i bought it:
https://www.speeding.nu/p/motorstyr...fuel-etanolgivare/etanolgivare-flexifuel.html
not sure if it helps you but there it is at least.

I have 2 relays, one "main" that then feeds the fuel pump relay (which is grounded by the MS).
The MS is on the "main" relay and everything else is on the fuel pump relay.
So the MS doesn't go down when the relay clicks, but everything else does. Most noticeable the wide band lambda.


Saved a copy of my .msq and opened it with kate (notepad) and searched f?r JS7 (the pin I use for flex fuel). There are several functions that have JS7 as the default, but none of them are active (launch control, idle up AC, nitro) in my settings. seems strange if they would interfere despite that.
I have now activated the other functions and changed the pin to JS11 (not used at all by me) and then deactivated the functions again.

The other change since getting these issues I've done is using JS10 for Tach output, I can't find that any other function has JS10.

I'm gonna give it a go with these changes, if this doesn't help I'll deactive Tach output and the flex fuel sensor and see if that helps.



I find the lack of revealing pictures disturbing.
Click to expand...


A hundred euros... Damn. I'm really getting pissed of by the fact that in Europe we gotta pay twice the money to get things.

Clever on the relay here, that's kinda what I plan on doing ! Good to see that it works.
What's the issue with the Tach output ?
 
Victorrr said:
A hundred euros... Damn. I'm really getting pissed of by the fact that in Europe we gotta pay twice the money to get things.

Clever on the relay here, that's kinda what I plan on doing ! Good to see that it works.
What's the issue with the Tach output ?
Click to expand...

weeell, I figured that one or both of the changes I've made since it started having trouble with the relay clicking might be the cause.
Tested yesterday to deactivete both flex and tach out, even pulled the fuses. But the issue remains.
Logging points towards losing the crank sensor. I'm going to check the wiring.
I had some difficulty with getting the signal shielded when installing a year ago or so. Maybe something is no longer connected fully.
It still is a mess further in the glovebox.
 
Hilding said:
weeell, I figured that one or both of the changes I've made since it started having trouble with the relay clicking might be the cause.
Tested yesterday to deactivete both flex and tach out, even pulled the fuses. But the issue remains.
Logging points towards losing the crank sensor. I'm going to check the wiring.
I had some difficulty with getting the signal shielded when installing a year ago or so. Maybe something is no longer connected fully.
It still is a mess further in the glovebox.
Click to expand...

VR sensors are fiddly yeah, are you using the stock 60 - 2 flywheel and sensor setup ?

Make sure your shield is grouned where it should (Idk where it is on MegaS, but ik its right on the board on MicroS).

If you have access to an O'scope I'd recommend you check the signal on it, No need to be fancy here, I picked an old old O'scope, the ones from tech schools that weighs a ton (CRT, 80s tech ahah).

I will go 36 - 1, bigger tooth with a brand new sensor = cleaner signal.

Also make sure the wires don't go near anything "high tension"
Check for ground loop too. My 2 cents, I'm no expert

Maybe try to clean things up..? Check every damn connection, esp where the fab/DIY harness connects with stock OE parts.

The issue is fuel cutouts caused by your fuel relay clicking on/off while the car is running, right ?

Also, it is not a bad idea to have the wideband on it's own circuit, with the only connection to MS being the 5V signal for the lambda readings. Do you have some kind of wiring diagrams you made when doing the install or is it all in your head ?

I know I'm the kind of guy who forgets everything - note to myself - when I'll MS swap the old K Jet - grabbing a big paper sheet and laying down the wiring
 
The fuel pump relay clicking on and off while running is usually caused by sync loss.
If sync loss is showing in TS that is the cause.

NO sync loss is acceptable.
It is usually caused by problems with the crank triggering setup.
 
Was it you Dirty Rick that advised me to go with a 36 - 1 teeth setup over the 60 - 2 ones ?
My memory is "average" I'd say.

I've read quite a lot of peoples having issues with sync using the stock flywheel and VR sensor.
 
I don't think the tooth count has anything to do with sync loss.

A VR on any system may need a little rubbing to get it happy.
Plus a Microsquirt and a MS2 have different VR conditioners and the approach is different.
So it can be confusing as what works on one does not work well on the other.
An MS2 needs resistance in series with the sensor and a Microsquirt uses a shunt type resistor.
The Microsquirt actually has a solder bridge switch on the board to enable a built in shunt.
See the bottom of section 5.2.2 of the Extra hardware manual
Resistance values are not written in stone though.
VR sensors are very durable and rarely fail, most failures are mechanical damage to the sensor, like if it hits the wheel.
 
Last edited:
Dirty Rick said:
A 36 tooth wheel is a better choice for a MS2/MicroSquirt as a 60 tooth wheel is pushing the processors capabilities.

60 teeth comes real close to "to much information" for a MS2 but a MS3 will not be bothered.

60 teeth "works" with MS2 but at high RPM it will slow down the code by updating faster than the MS2 can process.
Click to expand...

I knew you said that ^^

OP, looks like we are getting towards VR signal issues.

VR sensor reacts to ferrous materials right, the sensor detects the change in presence or proximity of ferrous objects. This means dirty teeth wont bother it right. But an irregular distance will. I don't think this is going to be an issue if you are using the flywheel location, as, well, the flywheel is round and doesn't wobble. Now, if the sensor is a bit too far from the flywheel, you'll get a lesser than ideal signal. Now add in interference caused by bad shielding, bad wiring (using the correct resistor as stated above).

It would be great if you could have access to an oscilloscope, now, does your issues comes only at higher RPMs or is it present all across the range ?
 
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