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Old 06-23-2020, 11:18 AM   #526
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Originally Posted by Broke4speed View Post
Is there something I'm missing? What's so special about the NA 2JZ, I mean, outside of the fact that anything 2J has a massive amount of scene tax applied to it now. Nobody up here wants them even though the local junkyard chain sells all engines for $399 tax in. The one near my house has three or four IS300s of various years, and the engines are all still untouched.
You can add a turbo to an NA 2j and make enough power.
But, since you got speeduino back, stay the white block course!
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Old 06-23-2020, 11:21 AM   #527
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I think so. I have nothing against the whiteblock, and it certainly makes more than enough power for me. Major issues tend to send the mind whirling off into the ether, thinking that MAYBE another swap would solve all problems. We all know that's pretty much a lie, but it sounds very convincing at the time, lol.
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Old 07-04-2020, 07:33 PM   #528
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The other day I picked up a decent M46, and have a big order from IPD coming to fix it up. It sounds counter-productive to possibly swap back to the original engine, but I tend to swap engines every couple of years just to keep from getting bored. I have everything I need to swap to manual, since it was originally a BW55 car, so I may start that in the fall. That would mean I'd have some whiteblock swap stuff for sale...if anyone's interested ;). Homer mounts, a functional (but basic) +T6 log manifold, etc etc. It still all depends on my whims I guess, but it's looking likely.

...oh yeah...carb(s) would be involved too.
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Old 07-05-2020, 11:30 AM   #529
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Killen me here.

But i could be into that turbo manifold
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Old 07-05-2020, 06:46 PM   #530
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Nothing is definite, but I know myself pretty well. When boredom sets in...engine swaps happen. It's running really well right now, and I'm enjoying using it, but...y'know...idle hands...

The biggest part of all this is that I want to swap to manual. Whiteblock manual swaps are NOT cheap, but swapping in a readily-available redblock/M46 combo, is. All OEM parts, bolt-in simplicity.
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Old 07-06-2020, 03:43 AM   #531
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Why not buy a bmw gearbox and adapter plate?

These bmw boxes are quite cheapie and good, adapter plate etc shouldn't be to difficult.
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Old 07-06-2020, 04:07 AM   #532
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Yes, you could go back, but, why? Just either do the BMW swap or maybe go with a CD009, if you don't want to get a M90.

If you do decide to revert the car to a redblock, I would seriously consider not going back to carbs. Find a nice B230F, drop a K cam into it, drop it in with LH 2.2 and your M46. It'll be nowhere near as fast as the whiteblock, but it'll be somewhat fun to drive. About 123-125 hp net. Had that exact setup in my parents' old '85 245DL, but with the 3.31 rear axle. It was quite fun to drive from 2000 rpm on up to the 5800 rpm rev limiter, whereas the stock M cam runs out of steam around 4500 rpm.

Something that can't be said about a 102 horsepower carbed B21 that requires fiddling every once in a while to get it to kinda run well.
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Old 07-06-2020, 07:14 AM   #533
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Why not buy a bmw gearbox and adapter plate?

These bmw boxes are quite cheapie and good, adapter plate etc shouldn't be to difficult.
We don't get the good BMW boxes like you guys do, and the ones we do get come from cars with 2.95:1 rear end gears usually. A standard 5spd from any BMW post-E36 would have me cruising at 3000+ RPM at 100 kph :(.
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Old 07-06-2020, 07:30 AM   #534
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Yes, you could go back, but, why? Just either do the BMW swap or maybe go with a CD009, if you don't want to get a M90.

If you do decide to revert the car to a redblock, I would seriously consider not going back to carbs. Find a nice B230F, drop a K cam into it, drop it in with LH 2.2 and your M46. It'll be nowhere near as fast as the whiteblock, but it'll be somewhat fun to drive. About 123-125 hp net. Had that exact setup in my parents' old '85 245DL, but with the 3.31 rear axle. It was quite fun to drive from 2000 rpm on up to the 5800 rpm rev limiter, whereas the stock M cam runs out of steam around 4500 rpm.

Something that can't be said about a 102 horsepower carbed B21 that requires fiddling every once in a while to get it to kinda run well.
It wouldn't be about power, cause if it was, there would be no way a non-turbo Redblock would be an option, lol. It's about the sound. I've had dual-carbed cars in the past, and even the sound at low RPM makes me giggle in happiness.

With the 3.73 rear end in my car, any BMW swap (while interesting), would have me cruising at 3000rpm+ at 100kph. From where I live to virtually anything of interest (or even uninteresting), I have highways to take. A CD009 up here goes for $1k, which, when added to an $800 adapter kit, an $800 flywheel, and a $700 clutch kit (not to mention the hydro conversion bits), is cost-prohibitive. I'm done spending thousands of dollars for something that I'll eventually swap out anyway, lol.

Nothing is definite yet, and the car is running great right now, so I'm just currently talking to hear myself talk I guess.
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Old 07-06-2020, 08:35 AM   #535
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I did the T5 conversion to my whiteblock. $250 adapter plate, $300 for a V8 T5, $25 for a flat 850 flywheel, $55 for the disc, and i think $80 for a NOS 850 pressure plate. pilot bearing $20ish. You do have to come up with a clutch actuation solution for it, I think most people are using hydro throwout bearings.

Later on i did score 3 V8 T5's for $150 for all. If you shop around alot you can score deals.

CD009's blow up too, they aren't bulletproof like everyone says they are. At least with T5's you can buy the rebuild parts.
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Old 07-06-2020, 10:49 AM   #536
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Awesome Project. Inspiring.

Just Saying Hi!

Looks like we're into the same stuff, 3D printing, electronics, 240s, and also in Ontario.
I'm planning on making my own Speeduino board at some point instead of re-installing my MS3x, think it would make a fun video. Plus I'm going to add some other stuff to it. Maybe we could bounce some ideas around.

Here are some of my builds, haven't done any videos about my 240 yet though. https://www.youtube.com/seanhodgins
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Old 07-06-2020, 11:53 AM   #537
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I'm way, way behind you on the whole "whiteblock in a 240" track (hey, at least the engine is in the car), but that hasn't prevented me thinking about how I'd get a manual behind it, and from what I've read, there are some decent BMW-sourced options that we actually got here in North America.

See if my benchracing makes any sense:

I'm running a 225/50R16 on my car (24.9" diameter), the stock E90 335i runs a 225/40R18 (25.1") and the difference in tire diameter seems comparable enough to my admittedly ignorant self. The final drive from the 335i is a 3.08 (though the M3 runs the same gearbox with a 3.85). To the best of my knowledge, the highest ratio Volvo offered in the 240 was 3.31, but I believe you can get aftermarket Dana 35 3.08 sets as well. Plugging the GS6-53BZ gearbox ratios into here:

https://www.blocklayer.com/rpm-gear.aspx

With a 3.31, that'd put you at almost exactly 2500rpm @ 100kph in 6th gear, which seems pretty reasonable for highway speeds.

This option does, of course, require cutting and welding together the AW30-40 bellhousing to the BMW transmission, and I'm sure that's not trivial depending on the tools you have access to. But the overall cost would likely be well less than a CD009, it sounds like it fits without tunnel bashing and you can even buy a bolt-on transmission cross member from the Swedes:

https://www.anderssonsteelspeed.se/l...240?tm=webshop

No way it's as cheap as an M46, but at least you get the keep the sweet inline six you spent so much effort getting into your car.
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Old 07-06-2020, 12:24 PM   #538
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I did the T5 conversion to my whiteblock. $250 adapter plate, $300 for a V8 T5, $25 for a flat 850 flywheel, $55 for the disc, and i think $80 for a NOS 850 pressure plate. pilot bearing $20ish. You do have to come up with a clutch actuation solution for it, I think most people are using hydro throwout bearings.

Later on i did score 3 V8 T5's for $150 for all. If you shop around alot you can score deals.

CD009's blow up too, they aren't bulletproof like everyone says they are. At least with T5's you can buy the rebuild parts.
Up here in salty Canada...WC T5s from foxbodies are ~750-1000 CAD. They're not readily available, so a cheap T5 is never an option. It would be a rebuilt one, because there's no way I'm buying a 1000 dollar used box. Anything pre-2000 is a no-show in any of our yards, and manual is even rarer. It may be a cheap swap in other parts of the world, but it isn't here. Remember, our dollar is only worth 0.70 when compared to yours, so a 250 dollar adapter is 400 here.
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Old 07-06-2020, 12:38 PM   #539
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Originally Posted by thatcher.hubbard View Post
I'm way, way behind you on the whole "whiteblock in a 240" track (hey, at least the engine is in the car), but that hasn't prevented me thinking about how I'd get a manual behind it, and from what I've read, there are some decent BMW-sourced options that we actually got here in North America.

See if my benchracing makes any sense:

I'm running a 225/50R16 on my car (24.9" diameter), the stock E90 335i runs a 225/40R18 (25.1") and the difference in tire diameter seems comparable enough to my admittedly ignorant self. The final drive from the 335i is a 3.08 (though the M3 runs the same gearbox with a 3.85). To the best of my knowledge, the highest ratio Volvo offered in the 240 was 3.31, but I believe you can get aftermarket Dana 35 3.08 sets as well. Plugging the GS6-53BZ gearbox ratios into here:

https://www.blocklayer.com/rpm-gear.aspx

With a 3.31, that'd put you at almost exactly 2500rpm @ 100kph in 6th gear, which seems pretty reasonable for highway speeds.

This option does, of course, require cutting and welding together the AW30-40 bellhousing to the BMW transmission, and I'm sure that's not trivial depending on the tools you have access to. But the overall cost would likely be well less than a CD009, it sounds like it fits without tunnel bashing and you can even buy a bolt-on transmission cross member from the Swedes:

https://www.anderssonsteelspeed.se/l...240?tm=webshop

No way it's as cheap as an M46, but at least you get the keep the sweet inline six you spent so much effort getting into your car.
When I build stuff, I try really hard to keep from having to order hard parts or rely on machine shops. It's a personal choice, because I've been scammed too many times over the decades, lol. The Canadian dollar is also 0.70$ when compared to USD, so even getting stuff from europe becomes cost-prohibitive for us here.

As far as gearboxes go, here's my (and only my) logic: I can get BMW 5 speeds from the local yard, they're quite frequent and easy to get. 6 speeds are a no-go :(. My rear end gear ratio is a 3.73, and I can't find a 3.31 near me. I'd prefer a full rear axle housing/diff so I didn't have to get anything set up by a shop. The 3.08 rear gears are for the 1030 diff carrier/housing, so essentially the smaller gear/pinion setup. Not sure I want to pay the big bucks getting one from Bakaxel.se, then getting it set up and installed, then worry about it breaking.

I try to minimize costs when I can (see username), but at the same time indulge my obsession with building cars for myself. That's why I swap engines frequently, lol.
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Old 07-06-2020, 12:39 PM   #540
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Originally Posted by Hodginsa View Post
Awesome Project. Inspiring.

Just Saying Hi!

Looks like we're into the same stuff, 3D printing, electronics, 240s, and also in Ontario.
I'm planning on making my own Speeduino board at some point instead of re-installing my MS3x, think it would make a fun video. Plus I'm going to add some other stuff to it. Maybe we could bounce some ideas around.

Here are some of my builds, haven't done any videos about my 240 yet though. https://www.youtube.com/seanhodgins
Howdy, fellow Ontarian!
Sure, glad to help .
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Old 07-06-2020, 05:14 PM   #541
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The world works in insanely mysterious ways...

I decided to go to the local picknpull to check out a couple of volvos they got recently (94 850 and 98 S70) and while wandering my way to the back where they were, I detoured through the Domestics. I NEVER do that, and of course, today of all days, the day I say T5s don't show up in the local yards....I find a 95 Mustang V6 with a T5. The tag said 1352-238, and when I googled that...sigh...WC with the longer input shaft. The 94-95 V6 boxes were rated for 260 ft/lbs, which is still pretty darn good IMO, but I'll have to shim any adapter I get, or make, so no biggie. Or...I have to trim the input shaft, which is even easier .

While I was feeling pretty chuffed with myself, I went down to the volvos I was originally there for...and the 94 is a F**KIN MANUAL. DAMMIT. There's a high possibility that it's a single-mass flywheel. Looks like I'm going back! It's a heatwave here currently too, so that should suck pretty bad.


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Old 07-06-2020, 10:17 PM   #542
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hahaha.

You should be able to get a foxbody V8 input shaft and swap it. That has the 3.35 first gear set which is the same as a foxbody v8 trans. Should work great with the 3.73 rear gear too.

Well, actually, if you could make your own adapter, then you could design in the correct spacing for that input shaft to work.
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Old 07-07-2020, 12:31 AM   #543
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I think I have a 3.35 input shaft from a V8 that you could have. I'm swapping a 2.95. Just don't know when...

Jordan
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Old 07-07-2020, 09:40 AM   #544
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hahaha.

You should be able to get a foxbody V8 input shaft and swap it. That has the 3.35 first gear set which is the same as a foxbody v8 trans. Should work great with the 3.73 rear gear too.

Well, actually, if you could make your own adapter, then you could design in the correct spacing for that input shaft to work.
I had thought about that. It looks like the mustang guys use 5/8" worth of spacer to a fox bellhousing when they don't want to use the SN95 one (or don't have one).

Anyone have the thickness of the common, off-the-shelf adapters handy? lol.

I'm probably still going redblock though, it feels more....right...for the car? Every couple of years I go through phases where I just want simplicity. Turn key, no need for wideband gauges, just vroom. Even slow vroom is good. After that, there's usually a need-for-speed that pops up, and that's when turbos and V8 swaps appear, lol.

It sounds silly, but I miss the B21A (although it would have a different carb, sold the OG stuff)...or carbs, depending. I always wondered what the car could have been like with the stock engine and a manual swap, because it was HORRIBLE with the BW55. I got like 12-14L/100km (19-17 MPG) with that silly Zenith single because it cruised at 3000 RPM @ 100kph (60mph).

So, short story long, now I have an M46 (and a boatload of parts for it on the way from IPD) and a T5. Two weeks ago I didn't have ANY manual transmissions, lol. When it rains, it pours.
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Old 07-07-2020, 09:41 AM   #545
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I think I have a 3.35 input shaft from a V8 that you could have. I'm swapping a 2.95. Just don't know when...

Jordan
Well, I would gladly buy that off ya when you do. Keep me posted, please .
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Old 07-07-2020, 02:50 PM   #546
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Hmmm...I had forgotten about the 1030/1031 ring gear differences, so yeah, you'd have to find a good 3.31 axle or pay Sellholm through the nose to get that ratio. Six speed BMW boxes aren't exactly thick on the ground here in the US either, but I do see them pop up on cars being parted out every so often.

If you were going for a built B21A, it seems like the M46 would be the lower-effort choice. I can see the appeal in a tuned old-school setup.
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Old 07-07-2020, 03:17 PM   #547
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A mild B21A, but I'll be keeping the Speeduino for ignition and datalogging. There's no reason carbs have to be full-on caveman, and when I've done this in the past, it's so nice to see exactly where the mains come in or the secondary opens. Makes jet choice much easier, and improves economy by leaps and bounds on a street car.

I found the T5 after my M46 refresh kit shipped from IPD...so I guess I'll have my choice of gearboxes for the conversion. It will be very handy to have a complete M46 for measurements when I make the adapter plate for the T5 (I also have a spare M47 bellhousing). I have started cleaning up my spare B230 in order to have an engine for mockup, because my B21A only has 128k KM on it and is in awesome shape. It's tucked away safe until needed again.

If I actually go through with all this, I will have whiteblock swap parts to sell I guess. Might be some extra goodies too, like the water/meth kit and boost controller...but I'm loathe to sell those just in case ;).
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Old 07-07-2020, 04:45 PM   #548
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It sounds silly, but I miss the B21A (although it would have a different carb, sold the OG stuff)...or carbs, depending. I always wondered what the car could have been like with the stock engine and a manual swap, because it was HORRIBLE with the BW55. I got like 12-14L/100km (19-17 MPG) with that silly Zenith single because it cruised at 3000 RPM @ 100kph (60mph).
The difference is not that big until 60-70 kph comparing my b19 bw55 to a 1977 b21 m46. The m46 keeps accelerating after that while the bw55 just kind of stops. The 1977 was a factory m46 without overdrive so it had a 3.31 diff which could explain the slower acceleration.
Fuel usage was about 10L/100km and could comfortably cruise at 120. Top speed was about 170 where the b19 was 130-140. The b19 sat rock solid at 12L/100km btw.

Keep in mind of you don't have the overdrive, 4th on the m46 is 1.0 ratio just like 3rd on a bw55.

Had a 940 with a b230fb (130 hp, 531 head)/m47 once, that was kind of fun.


But a b6304 is much faster though... Mine has been dead reliable with stock ecu's. If also heard people putting a carb on them here for banger usage.
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Old 07-08-2020, 10:28 PM   #549
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Well well...


Found this in a buddy's junkyard, which made me pretty giddy. Pulling it from a boat resting on the ground sucked 100%, especially since it was 33*-35*C, with unrelenting sun and no shade or wind. It's a bit of a mystery though, since the boat is marked '2.3L', and the date stamps say the engine is a B21 from 1975. There is no steel sleeve in exh port #4, and there's virtually no rust or dirt on the engine. It's a dual carb setup, and they're PLASTIC...which definitely means they've been replaced at some point in the recent past. The outdrive is a 275, and the tag on the engine states it should have been mated to a 280. The insane marine exhaust manifold came off super easy, and none of the other bolts were trouble either. I think I lucked out on this score .

Honestly, if it turns out to be nice inside (going to start inspecting it tomorrow), I'll probably use it instead of the mega-crusty and oil-charred 1993 B230 I was starting on.
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Old 07-09-2020, 06:14 PM   #550
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So...I hoard redblocks now? There's a third under the cardboard, lol.

The B21 in front is the AQ140A I got yesterday, and the crusty B230 behind it is a squirter block from a 92. I was going to tidy up the squirter block and use it, but the AQ140A is in AMAZING shape...and turns smooth as butter. I know it's smaller displacement, and is a 160 head (big coolant passages)...but it's practically factory fresh. I plan on popping the head off and seeing how it looks inside, but I really think it'll be the best option. It's virtually the same as the B21A under the cardboard (126k), but...I guess I can save that for much later, lol.





I'm not sure if this is an important thing or not, or if I'm just learning it now vs. everyone else in the late 2000s...but boat motors come with un-machined flat flywheels? When I pulled the outboard bellhousing off, I was faced with a crazy thing that looked like a clutch hub, and it was bolted to a completely fresh flat flywheel. The ridge in the pic (the one on the bottom) is how thick the surface is when compared to the old flat flywheel on the top. One is flush, one is not. I'm wondering if I could get the boat one machined at the local clutch shop so I could use it vs. the rusty one.

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