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Old 05-25-2019, 01:21 PM   #651
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Default Catching up

Got the Miata AC down to 52 degrees. Don't have a factory spec on vent temp but that meets the Volvo one so I will leave it for a while.

Picked up an AW70 from a '82 265 that has both the PRV bellhousing and a cable speedometer connection. That combination only occurred in '82 and '83 so they are a little rare. Thanks to WREN who was parting out the car and lives close enough to avoid shipping. The BW55 was going to have to come out anyway because of leaks.



The question is whether I need to go beyond gaskets and seals to freshen it up. I have always wanted to rebuild an auto transmission and I have a high mileage AW70 to practice on. WREN reported that the car had 130k miles and ATF was still red when he pulled it. The car failed due to engine issues not transmission.
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Old 05-25-2019, 01:46 PM   #652
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What’s the difference between the two trannies?
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Old 05-25-2019, 02:35 PM   #653
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55 = 3 speed 70 = 4 speed
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Old 05-25-2019, 04:48 PM   #654
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Default Sad tale of dispare

All the following is covered in another post with about the third time through the CIS system found here:

https://forums.turbobricks.com/showthread.php?t=348861

But I will post a few of the highlights in this thread which is my diary of my life with a Bertone.

Where I left off in about post 648 in this thread was that I had lost fuel pressure.

Hooked up the TurboBricks brand fuel pressure test equipment and only get 20 psi at the Control Pressure Regulator with the valve open and that is close . . . but . . . with the valve closed I get the same reading. Should be 70 psi. Both pumps are running in 'start' and jumpered at the fuel pressure relay.

Both lift and pressure pump have been replaced since I tried to pump 20 years of gas tank rust through them some years ago. Remember, it ran 40 miles to/from the paint shop since anything was done to affect the fuel system.

Other than spraying gas everywhere the fuel distributor to CPR connection is the only place I know to open the system to test pressure. A hose blew off the V8 conversion project at 90 psi and dumped a gallon of gas in about 5 seconds so I am aware of what that much pressure will do. I ran.

Since I replaced the original completely failed pressure pump with a cheap universal pump that probably cost $20 on ebay that didn't even physically fit I upgraded to a $30 pump that did fit the mounting hardware. Bench tested it before installation. It is marked + and - so got that correct and it is pumping some gas.

CPR reading with valve closed remains 20 psi. My logic process says that even if severely restricted the pressure should have gone up over a minute or two.

The only thing that I can think of that would maintain a steady inappropriate pressure is that the fuel distributor pressure regulator is stuck open to some extent and dumping all the pressure back into the tank.

I put a new pressure pump in and the guage displays the same pressure the previous pump did. Car ran before and without changes to fuel system except that I put another 5 gallons of fresh gas in the tank.

Set up to drain the tank with the tank pump. Nothing comes out. I can hear the pump running but nary a drop of gas.

Pulled the lift pump and found the hose between the pump and exit tube had dissolved. Yeah, it looked like a butyl hose expected to work submerged in gas. Even the rubber top cover of the pump was distorted.



It didn't appear to have been able to pump much gas before completely failing and I can only hope that the fuel filter caught most of anything that moved.

Got a new Delphi, made in America, pump in hand. From the looks of the age of the box this guy may have been manufactured when Delphi was part of General Motors.

But . . . it came with with a 2" piece of non-reinforced hose that looks far more like extruded butyl than the 30R-10 spec submerged fuel hose. It also came with squeeze clamps for the extra large diameter hose.



With this experience it would make me feel better to have the SAE code printed on the hose. The local NAPA store did not stock the 30R-10 but can get it. Ebay sellers included several marine supply stores which I have a couple around Lake Blue Ridge.

OK, the $4 an inch hose arrived. It did not have the SAE 30R-10 printed on it but it did have 'submersible fuel hose' there.

Siphoned the gas out of the tank and only got less than 6 gallons, 5 of which I had put in only a couple weeks ago. Interior of the tank looks OK. at least no rust areas. I will get some brand new gas tomorrow, get the pump in and expect nirvana. Often disappointed.

One last question: Is the pictured wiring correct? The replacement pump terminals are not marked and this is sorta how I remember it. The yellow ground wire was probably brown 30 years ago.



Cranked right up! Responds to throttle.

Been here before . . . several times.

The control pressure is reading the expected fuel distributor regulator pressure of about 70 psi. Should be low 20's with a cold engine. Appears that the CPR is blocked or at least is not regulating.

Off it comes . . . again . . . probably for about the 4th time.

But the rest of the fuel system seems to be working as intended. Both pumps now known new and a new filter.

Are we having fun yet?


I have had the CPR apart since the last post and did not find anything of significance but upon reassembly I am still getting system pressure.



One strange thing is a little quarter inch piece of what I thought was an O ring was in the CPR input screen. It had a hole and therefore tubing so it had to have been inside something else. Didn't seem like fuel distributor O rings. I have been there also some time ago.

The one thing I have not done is dig out the filter screens on the input. Air blows through just fine so one might think that fuel would pass the other way. The screens are 4 or 5 layers and appear to be held in place by a tiny retaining washer. I suspect that digging out the fine screen mesh may significantly damage it but that may be the next step.

I will try to get it apart again tomorrow and see if there is some bockage there.

It cranks and responds to throttle but 70 psi control pressure is, indeed, going to lean out the air/fuel mixture.

Took the CPR apart again and the screens are the only next step. The control pressure is reading the 70psi of the fuel distributor regulator which everyone seems to say is a sure sign of blocked screens. Since the original fuel issue was rust everywhere it seems appropriate to have a go at it even though failure here could be terminal for any potential rebuild.

I may have killed my WUR today.

With the unit disassembled on the bench I was able to force brake cleaner through the screens both ways. It leaked slowly inlet to regulator nozzle and I was able to squirt brake cleaner through from the nozzle side out with some force.

That had to mean that the thing was clean enough to pass gas but no such luck. Upon reinstalling the gauge was reading the 70psi system pressure. Took it off for the fourth time.

After debating with my self over some of my souvenir bourbon from the trip I got the pick out and dug out the screens. No saving them as they were firmly clamped into place. After carefully cleaning out all the trash that I could see, blowing with air gun and brake cleaner put it back together and back on.

Started right up with 22psi control pressure. I didn't wait until it went through the warm up routine. That would seem to be a clear indication that clogged screens was the issue.

Now I have to wonder if there is enough trash left in the system to foul up the regulation shortly. Failure symptom is running lean but it does run.

I am going to explore obtaining a bench rebuilt and tested WRU but initial searches put that as unlikely or expensive. A review of the rebuild kits determined that the only thing in the $50 kits of any value is the regulation disk. None supplied the nozzle or the filter screens.

Anyway, I think it will regulate through warmup and run now.

Found a company in Texas that rebuilds the WUR for under $200. Bosch does not appear to sell the critical parts outside their internal rebuild services. Wonder what the situation is with replacing the screens.

DeLorean Auto Parts - https://www.deloreanautoparts.com/wa...egulators.html

Yesterday afternoon the control pressure cold and warm was just right. Engine warmed up to the middle of the temp gauge. I went out this afternoon with the intention of ending the detention on HF jack stands and found the pressure at about 10psi and a very rough idle.

Appeared that some of the destroyed screen is now in a critical point in the regulator. I just packed my WUR up in a box for an all expense paid trip to Texas.

Tired of screwing with it.

Off to see the wizzard!

Last edited by TestPoint; 05-25-2019 at 06:57 PM..
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Old 05-26-2019, 08:14 AM   #655
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TestPoint View Post

The question is whether I need to go beyond gaskets and seals to freshen it up. I have always wanted to rebuild an auto transmission and I have a high mileage AW70 to practice on. WREN reported that the car had 130k miles and ATF was still red when he pulled it. The car failed due to engine issues not transmission.
I always trust what an old sage autotragic rebuilder told me..... if it doesn't smell "burnt" and the color is still normal, it is typically good to go.

If you just got to know.... tear apart the worn out AW70. This should expose any "special tools, special skills" needed. Once you've been to the bottom of the practice box, you'll know what to do
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Old 05-26-2019, 09:28 AM   #656
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If you're not sure of condition or this is the first one you've ever rebuilt Tom, then I think the calculus on this is pretty straightforward. How much do you relish the possibility of having to pull it back out and either 1) rebuild it, or 2) rebuild it again?
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Old 05-27-2019, 06:51 PM   #657
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I say if it had red fluid and was working I'd put gaskets and seals on and go. In my experience those transmissions are super bulletproof... unless someone screws with it.
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Old 05-27-2019, 08:11 PM   #658
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Default Dear Diary . . .

Put another half can of R134a in the Miata. Vent temp now 46 degrees. That's all it gets until it leaks down.

Installed the WUR back from the spa treatment in Texas. Before final hookup dropped fuel line from the fuel distributor into a clear plastic bottle. Gas came out clear with no visible particles. System pressure 70psi. Cold (78 degrees) pressure was 22psi . . . perfect. At the end of the heat cycle which only took about 30 seconds pressure was 43psi . . . perfect. I am going to talk to John tomorrow to see if he actually 'fixed' anything or just did the book refresh.

Engine starts instantly, responds well to throttle, idles a little high, about 1100 but I have chased that rabbit before. Going to go back through the O2, dwell, and frequency valve tests.

The Jeep has to get out of here before I can get the Bertone out of the garage. Dropped the drive shaft and got the console shift stuff ready to drop the transmission. Bad clutch bearing. Simple issue, difficult job.

Anyone want a '95 Cherokee, 2.5L manual 2 door? 200k on car, 40k on engine. No dents, no dings, no rust. All my Grand kids have cars so this one will have to find a new home.
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Old 06-01-2019, 07:35 PM   #659
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Default Transmission inventory

Company over this weekend. Had to sneak around to inventory the transmission situation.

First is the AW70 that I recently acquired from Wren. Obviously from a slant 4 but is reported to be a 'good' used transmission with the cable connected speedometer.



Second is the high mileage AW70 acquired from ......... reported from a very high mileage 740 that failed when the engine seized. Obviously the bell housing will not work and neither will the tail housing because of the lack of a speedometer connection. This is/was intended to be an educational project that is probably beyond my current interest/capabilities. Free to a good home.



Third is a real PVR bell housing obtained from 77Volvo245 Shipped via USPS to my surprise. Picked up at the Post Office.



I think I can use the stand-alone correct bell housing with the sorta OK AW70 with the mechanical speedometer cable connection to have a replacement for the BW55 in the Bertone.

My wife of 55 years works picture puzzles for a hobby and doesn't understand why I don't have any interest in that.

A question for the few that continue to monitor my ramblings and diary posts: Will the BW55 bell housing bolt to one of the AW70 transmissions?

If so, I will have a 25k mile BW55 transmission with a 4 cylinder bell housing available. Unfortunately, without a cable speedometer connection. That has got to be a truly unusal setup.

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Old 06-01-2019, 08:42 PM   #660
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Quote:
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My wife of 55 years works picture puzzles for a hobby and doesn't understand why I don't have any interest in that.......
.......Unfortunately, without a cable speedometer connection. That has got to be a truly unusal setup.
Based on this post, I'd say you're all in on picture puzzles Tom. In a world of multiple options for GPS driven speedos, no cable connection is no big deal.
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Old 08-28-2019, 08:45 PM   #661
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Default Kristina's coming out party . . . .

After a couple months detour to the world of Jeep I am back in the Bertone garage.

She got down off the jack stands today for the first time in about 3 years. A little heart surgery and torn rotator cuff got in the way.

Got some cleaning and polishing to do but Kristina starts instantly, timing good, dwell good, fuel pressure regulator pressures good. Idle at about 1000 rpm. Moves under her own power.



Location photo shoot tomorrow if the weather holds up.

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Old 08-28-2019, 09:26 PM   #662
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Was just thinking about you today. I think maybe I'm "it" on our e-mail exchange.
I dusted off Nanci's Bertone and drove it to a cruise in Saturday night, on the way home it was bucking, more surging? Yet to look at why. Hope its simple like a burnt plug wire? Always something!
.
Looking forward to the photo shoot!
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Old 08-29-2019, 07:30 AM   #663
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How long had it been sitting Brad - how old was the gas?
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Old 08-31-2019, 11:59 PM   #664
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Quote:
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How long had it been sitting Brad - how old was the gas?
Filled up in April, pulled codes tonight PO305, misfire cyl. 5. List of things to check. Hope its simple.
.
Hoping for good weather Tom! Thinking you are far enough inland not to get much bother from Dorian?
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Old 09-01-2019, 08:31 AM   #665
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Depends on the path it finally takes Brad. If the eye never makes landfall (that was the predicted path last night) - then probably no effect for Tom. It's big enough, though, that with the current path, we could see tropical storm force winds in Charlotte - and I'm a 4 hour drive from the beach.

Jeez -- category 5 this morning - 160 mph winds.....

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Old 09-14-2019, 07:30 AM   #666
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Tom -- if you're making it to Eurofest -- John and I will arrive Friday. We're without the wives this year, so we'll have more flexibility this year to visit some. Perhaps dinner Friday night. We're staying Fri and Sat night at the host hotel.
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Old 09-14-2019, 08:26 AM   #667
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I have reservations at the host hotel also. Yes, Friday and Sat.

Bertone got washed after climbing off the jack stands and runs at the moment. Lots of little things to do.
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Old 09-15-2019, 06:22 AM   #668
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Pulling for you to make it! We'll see you there...
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Old 09-17-2019, 08:25 PM   #669
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Default Oh . . . Nooooooooooooo, Mr. Bill!

Snake bit again.

Rack blew the right side seal . . . and it is only 38 years old. Leaks all over the place.



Anyway, its on the floor. Now the scavenger hunt.

The rack is tight as new except for the seal. RockAuto doesn't even carry the rebuild seal kit anymore.

None of the major AP stores carry this on-line now. I will contact a couple store managers locally and see if they can get me something. Couple on ebay. Better contact my BFF Bill at Voluparts before I do anything else. These cars are about to pass into the real historical parts category.

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Old 09-17-2019, 08:56 PM   #670
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I got 3 different ones at Advance Auto and finally one that would fit (with the Converse kit -- of the 6 possibilities only 2 fit) at a local import auto parts place - all 4 remanufactured units within a few days when mine went out back in 2014/15. Hope you find it. I'd replace high pressure and return hoses while you're at it. They deteriorate from within and the debris doesn't do the pump/rack any good at all.

Could you take the good one out of the wagon just for the trip, until you get a replacement?
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Old 09-17-2019, 08:59 PM   #671
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It's always something, isn't it?
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Old 09-17-2019, 09:01 PM   #672
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Quote:
Could you take the good one out of the wagon just for the trip, until you get a replacement?
Of course, but that would be very painful plus 2 alignments. Boy, is it getting difficult to get up off the floor from under a car. Perhaps it is time to take up another hobby.
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Old 09-17-2019, 10:50 PM   #673
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Ugh! Hoping for a quick fix.
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Old 09-18-2019, 08:23 AM   #674
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Understand. We need to take up a collection and get you a lift.....get me one too while we're at it.
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Old 09-18-2019, 09:42 AM   #675
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If it's a CAM rack I think I've got a rebuild kit on the shelf
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