Advance/retard timing on EZ116K

07-15-2006, 12:39 PM

I have been thinking about the EZ116K ignition ECU´s (LH2.4) for a while and I thought that this was the time to bring this up. This is interesting for many of you so please bare with me...

When it is "chipped" with my chips it gets a more ideal ignition curve to make power. The EZ117K (LH2.2) is not chippable with better maps yet, but it will be sorted in the future. The EZ117K/LH2.2 however can be statically advanced/retarded by turning the distributor as you may know. But what I am about to say may also apply to EZ117K...

Well, it would be nice to get the same possibility of statically advancing/retarding the EZ116K as well. And I beleive it is possible. All that is being said below will of course apply to all EZK´s, not only the chipped ones (even though this will have the best maps to alter) or the turbo ones. The NA EZK´s should have the same capabilities.

Why advance/retard the EZ116K timing?

* Advancing the entire map may be beneficial to power on some occations. For example when driving on high octane gas at the strip or track, when taking advantage of Somender Singh´s groove theory, and/or when you have converted to E85 (like me).

* When the EZ116K is chipped it already has a very good map for making power, but unfortunately it is not as smart as the LH2.4 ECU. It adapts a little, but not much. The map is ideal when running 91-93 octane gas but when you want to make some power and go beyond the 100 octane mark you really want to make use of it by advancing the timing, even when not under full boost.

* The option of advancing/retarding will be very beneficial when you have raised the compression or if you are using another head (16v perhaps? maybe not ideal but could be made pretty good).

* An easy way of retarding the entire map in the EZ116K may be desired when driving the car on bad gas or in very hot weather. And an easy way of advancing the entire map in the EZ116K may be desired when driving on high octane gas or other mods have been done to the engine. This is possible to do if you install a few easy accessible buttons in your car.

How to change the statical advance/retard:

* The EZ116K has 4 pins in the 25-pin connector called "selector pins" on pin 18, 19, 21 and 25.

* The EZ116K also has 2 pins that are internal analog/digital ground on pin 11 and 12. The flywheel sensor is grounded on pin 11 and the knock sensor is grounded on pin 12. They can still be used as common grounds if desired.

* By grounding one or more pins you will be able to get -6° to +12° in 3° increments.

This I know:

* By grounding pin 18 you will get -3° (retard).

* By grounding pin 19 you will get -6° (retard).

* By grounding pin 18 and 19 you will get +3° (advance).

But here is where I need some help from you guys:

* I don´t know which of the pins mentioned (or combination of pins) to ground to get the other presets...

* How much advance/retard will you get if you ground the other two pins (21 and 25) respectively?

* Is it possible to ground more than one pin at the same time to get a specific advance?

* The big question is: Which pins do what and how much to the retard/advance???

All the mentioned pins (18, 19, 21, 25) are protected so you won´t get a short-circuit if you do anything wrong.

Anyone who wants to try it out? I want to know what grounding all combinations of pins will do?

Test if grounding pin 18 and 19 respectively, and grounding pin 18 + 19 will do what I have claimed they would do?

Grounding pin 18 + 21?
Grounding pin 18 + 25?
Grounding pin 18 + 19 + 21?
Grounding pin 18 + 19 + 25?
Grounding pin 18 + 21 + 25?
Grounding pin 18 + 19 + 21 + 25?
Grounding pin 19 + 21?
Grounding pin 19 + 25?
Grounding pin 19 + 21 + 25?
Grounding pin 21?
Grounding pin 21 + 25?
Grounding pin 25?

It would really be nice to have a button on the dash where you could choose the ignition advance/retard, don´t you think?

Morley · 07-15-2006, 04:27 PM

What are the pins called?

I'm counting binary in my mind now....$5 says it's that easy. 4 binary digits equals 16 options.

blarf · 07-15-2006, 05:06 PM

#12 is the knock sensor ground, #11 is the crank position sensor ground. I'm unsure about the others, as they're not shown on any of the wiring diagrams I'm looking at.

07-15-2006, 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morley

What are the pins called?

I'm counting binary in my mind now....$5 says it's that easy. 4 binary digits equals 16 options.

Yes, 16 options:

Grounding pin 18
Grounding pin 19
Grounding pin 18 + 19?
Grounding pin 18 + 21?
Grounding pin 18 + 25?
Grounding pin 18 + 19 + 21?
Grounding pin 18 + 19 + 25?
Grounding pin 18 + 21 + 25?
Grounding pin 18 + 19 + 21 + 25?
Grounding pin 19 + 21?
Grounding pin 19 + 25?
Grounding pin 19 + 21 + 25?
Grounding pin 21?
Grounding pin 21 + 25?
Grounding pin 25?
And no grounded pins.

That´s 16. Please try it!

And the pins 18, 19, 21 and 25 is not mentioned anywhere. Neither the name or the function. Not mentioned in any circuit diagram at least.

JW240 · 07-16-2006, 08:58 AM

awesome. So, when u use a chipped EZK on LH 2.4 and you wanna use RON 95 instead of RON 98, thats possible if you use these options? (less timing advance so no pinging?)

EDIT: I just looked at the plug of the EZK in my 240. The empty spots are the ones you are looking for. The number of each pin is visible when you open the connector (3 philips screws)

(1 second exposure time ftw btw)

The little connector inserts look familiar. Maybe the ones from the ISO radio connectors or some computer related thingies are the same... Then plug those in, connect a wire to a ground connection and ready..

EDIT2:

Just been searching through my piles of wires and connectors. The ISO radio adapters of the newers volvo's use the same little connectors..

(at least, they look the same, just gotta find out if they fit..)

klr142 · 07-16-2006, 11:44 PM

Cool...

JW240 · 07-17-2006, 03:18 AM

i now have 4 extra wires sticking out of the EZ box connector. Time to add a couple of switches and find a timing light!

boosted12a · 07-17-2006, 12:29 PM

hmm, what about the ez118 box? it would be coll to mess with the timing on the b280 with out going ms.....

benflynn · 07-17-2006, 12:38 PM

I can't belive that no one has done this before, you should delete this thread and build and sell an ezk timing master

thelostartof · 07-17-2006, 01:18 PM

and how the hell does one even find out that grounding those does anything in the first place? part of a volvo test procedure on something??

stylngle2003 · 07-17-2006, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thelostartof

and how the hell does one even find out that grounding those does anything in the first place? part of a volvo test procedure on something??

i'd wager that grounding a pin while watching a timing light for any changes would tell you if anything happened

thelostartof · 07-17-2006, 03:11 PM

iknow that ... but how does one figure out that in the first place

U.N.C.L.E. · 07-18-2006, 03:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thelostartof

iknow that ... but how does one figure out that in the first place

TPC

07-18-2006, 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by U.N.C.L.E.

TPC

No, my tuner actually told me about the retarding/advancing functions.

And Bosch also has this neat pinout chart with listed functions... I´ve seen it but I don´t have it.

I looked at TPC and they don´t mention anything other than pin 18 and 19, and that is common knowledge at the Volvo shops.

JW240 · 07-18-2006, 08:55 AM

I have the wires added, but i have no timing light...
I'll connect em to some switches and go for a drive first, to see if there is a difference in power...

smosit · 07-18-2006, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JW240

I have the wires added, but i have no timing light...
I'll connect em to some switches and go for a drive first, to see if there is a difference in power...

unless you have some amazing seat-o-pants dyno and can confidently detect differences of 3* and 6* of advance/retard just driving around, i'ld find a timing light. surely, you know someone with one. 16 potential settings....you'ld be done testing them in less than 5 minutes.

07-18-2006, 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smosit

unless you have some amazing seat-o-pants dyno and can confidently detect differences of 3* and 6* of advance/retard just driving around, i'ld find a timing light. surely, you know someone with one. 16 potential settings....you'ld be done testing them in less than 5 minutes.

There are really only 6 settings out of the possible 16 that has any effect (as far as I know).

-6°
-3°
+3°
+6°
+9°
+12°

And of course, 0° with no pins grounded.

boosted12a · 07-18-2006, 12:48 PM

im willing to be that the 118 box will do the same thing, but ill wait and see. im kinda scared to smoke my icu.....

07-18-2006, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boosted12a

im willing to be that the 118 box will do the same thing, but ill wait and see. im kinda scared to smoke my icu.....

Just measure the voltages on the pins with a multimeter when the engine is running. That won´t harm anything.

And I beleive that EZ210K, EZ115K and EZ117K share the same pinout when it comes to pin 18 and 19, but not 21 and 25.

BDKR · 07-18-2006, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frpe82

...and that is common knowledge at the Volvo shops.

Not over here.

07-18-2006, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BDKR

Not over here.

No, but here in the motherland it is.

But the Volvo mechanics/fault-tracers never mention the possibility of advancing the ignition. It seems like they only know about pin 18 and 19 and what they do respectively (-6° and -3°), but not what they can do together, or what they can do in combination with other pins...

Morley · 07-18-2006, 03:23 PM

What's the purpose behind those pins?

My dads '87 Opel Omega had a jumper in the trunk, to select the octane rating of the fuel...I think it was L-Jetronic too. 2.0i.

07-18-2006, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morley

What's the purpose behind those pins?

My dads '87 Opel Omega had a jumper in the trunk, to select the octane rating of the fuel...I think it was L-Jetronic too. 2.0i.

Purpose: Being able to run a car on lower octane fuel by grounding pin 18 or 19.

The combination of 18+19 and other pins is probably not known by the shops. They only use those pins to stop pinging, never to increase the power and lower the tolerance for bad gas.

The Opel/Vauxhall Omega was equipped with an early version of Motronic (ML1.5), and all Motronic 1.x ECU´s has a switch or a jumper setup that can increase/decrease both ignition timing and fuel. Volvo also used those switches/jumpers on the Motronic equipped 740/760 with B230ET.

Morley · 07-18-2006, 03:51 PM

Hmm.....VADIS has no description of those pins...9, 18, 19, 21, 24 and 25 are "blank".

JW240 · 07-18-2006, 04:32 PM

i just drove home (70 miles) with pin 18 and 19 grounded. car ran great, but impossible to tell if it was from the advance. I'll try to go to my volvo mechanic and borrow the timing light..

07-15-2006, 04:27 PM	#2
Morley Barbie Ken Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Norway	What are the pins called? I'm counting binary in my mind now....$5 says it's that easy. 4 binary digits equals 16 options. __________________

07-15-2006, 05:06 PM	#3
blarf Board Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: disabled account land	#12 is the knock sensor ground, #11 is the crank position sensor ground. I'm unsure about the others, as they're not shown on any of the wiring diagrams I'm looking at. __________________

07-16-2006, 08:58 AM	#5
JW240 visst Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: The Netherlands, Europe	awesome. So, when u use a chipped EZK on LH 2.4 and you wanna use RON 95 instead of RON 98, thats possible if you use these options? (less timing advance so no pinging?) EDIT: I just looked at the plug of the EZK in my 240. The empty spots are the ones you are looking for. The number of each pin is visible when you open the connector (3 philips screws) (1 second exposure time ftw btw) The little connector inserts look familiar. Maybe the ones from the ISO radio connectors or some computer related thingies are the same... Then plug those in, connect a wire to a ground connection and ready.. EDIT2: Just been searching through my piles of wires and connectors. The ISO radio adapters of the newers volvo's use the same little connectors.. (at least, they look the same, just gotta find out if they fit..) __________________ 240 \| 1991 \| 257 KKm \| B230F+T \| M90H \| fuel:E85 Amazon \| 1968 \| bare chassis \| rust fixed \| finished 2015+?.... My Gallery, Volvo and other stuff... Last edited by JW240; 07-16-2006 at 01:46 PM..

07-16-2006, 11:44 PM	#6
klr142 Wants u 2 use your brain. Join Date: May 2004 Location: OR	Cool... __________________ Kyle - 244? - Oregon Volvo Tuners? - For Sale?

07-17-2006, 12:29 PM	#8
boosted12a Board Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: back roads of gloucester Va.	hmm, what about the ez118 box? it would be coll to mess with the timing on the b280 with out going ms..... __________________ 91 245 DD, GOLD 90 740Ti wit some chit done to eet, GOLD 05 S80(bone stock with 30K miles!) RED 85 RX-7 GSL SE(efi'ed) BLACK 76 Suzuki RE5, BLACK 07 Suzuki SV1000S, BLACK 83 242 group A Homoligation EVO special(DOA may 20 2010) parts to the wolves!

07-15-2006, 12:39 PM	#1
frpe82 Guest	Advance/retard timing on EZ116K I have been thinking about the EZ116K ignition ECU´s (LH2.4) for a while and I thought that this was the time to bring this up. This is interesting for many of you so please bare with me... When it is "chipped" with my chips it gets a more ideal ignition curve to make power. The EZ117K (LH2.2) is not chippable with better maps yet, but it will be sorted in the future. The EZ117K/LH2.2 however can be statically advanced/retarded by turning the distributor as you may know. But what I am about to say may also apply to EZ117K... Well, it would be nice to get the same possibility of statically advancing/retarding the EZ116K as well. And I beleive it is possible. All that is being said below will of course apply to all EZK´s, not only the chipped ones (even though this will have the best maps to alter) or the turbo ones. The NA EZK´s should have the same capabilities. Why advance/retard the EZ116K timing? * Advancing the entire map may be beneficial to power on some occations. For example when driving on high octane gas at the strip or track, when taking advantage of Somender Singh´s groove theory, and/or when you have converted to E85 (like me). * When the EZ116K is chipped it already has a very good map for making power, but unfortunately it is not as smart as the LH2.4 ECU. It adapts a little, but not much. The map is ideal when running 91-93 octane gas but when you want to make some power and go beyond the 100 octane mark you really want to make use of it by advancing the timing, even when not under full boost. * The option of advancing/retarding will be very beneficial when you have raised the compression or if you are using another head (16v perhaps? maybe not ideal but could be made pretty good). * An easy way of retarding the entire map in the EZ116K may be desired when driving the car on bad gas or in very hot weather. And an easy way of advancing the entire map in the EZ116K may be desired when driving on high octane gas or other mods have been done to the engine. This is possible to do if you install a few easy accessible buttons in your car. How to change the statical advance/retard: * The EZ116K has 4 pins in the 25-pin connector called "selector pins" on pin 18, 19, 21 and 25. * The EZ116K also has 2 pins that are internal analog/digital ground on pin 11 and 12. The flywheel sensor is grounded on pin 11 and the knock sensor is grounded on pin 12. They can still be used as common grounds if desired. * By grounding one or more pins you will be able to get -6° to +12° in 3° increments. This I know: * By grounding pin 18 you will get -3° (retard). * By grounding pin 19 you will get -6° (retard). * By grounding pin 18 and 19 you will get +3° (advance). But here is where I need some help from you guys: * I don´t know which of the pins mentioned (or combination of pins) to ground to get the other presets... * How much advance/retard will you get if you ground the other two pins (21 and 25) respectively? * Is it possible to ground more than one pin at the same time to get a specific advance? * The big question is: Which pins do what and how much to the retard/advance??? All the mentioned pins (18, 19, 21, 25) are protected so you won´t get a short-circuit if you do anything wrong. Anyone who wants to try it out? I want to know what grounding all combinations of pins will do? Test if grounding pin 18 and 19 respectively, and grounding pin 18 + 19 will do what I have claimed they would do? Grounding pin 18 + 21? Grounding pin 18 + 25? Grounding pin 18 + 19 + 21? Grounding pin 18 + 19 + 25? Grounding pin 18 + 21 + 25? Grounding pin 18 + 19 + 21 + 25? Grounding pin 19 + 21? Grounding pin 19 + 25? Grounding pin 19 + 21 + 25? Grounding pin 21? Grounding pin 21 + 25? Grounding pin 25? It would really be nice to have a button on the dash where you could choose the ignition advance/retard, don´t you think? Last edited by frpe82; 07-15-2006 at 08:23 PM..

07-17-2006, 03:18 AM	#7
JW240 visst Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: The Netherlands, Europe	i now have 4 extra wires sticking out of the EZ box connector. Time to add a couple of switches and find a timing light!

07-17-2006, 12:38 PM	#9
benflynn bigpimpin740t@yahoo.com Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Birmingham Al	I can't belive that no one has done this before, you should delete this thread and build and sell an ezk timing master __________________ think you got shorted? belive me, we have piles of turbos and ms units, email me w/what ever the hell you think we have of yours and when i am not on a river ill dig it out and send it to ya for shipping, one shotbigpimpin740t@yahoo.com one down, whose next?

07-17-2006, 01:18 PM	#10
thelostartof unbalanced chemical Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Apache Junction, AZ	and how the hell does one even find out that grounding those does anything in the first place? part of a volvo test procedure on something??

07-17-2006, 03:11 PM	#12
thelostartof unbalanced chemical Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Apache Junction, AZ	iknow that ... but how does one figure out that in the first place

07-18-2006, 08:55 AM	#15
JW240 visst Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: The Netherlands, Europe	I have the wires added, but i have no timing light... I'll connect em to some switches and go for a drive first, to see if there is a difference in power...

07-18-2006, 12:48 PM	#18
boosted12a Board Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: back roads of gloucester Va.	im willing to be that the 118 box will do the same thing, but ill wait and see. im kinda scared to smoke my icu.....

07-18-2006, 03:23 PM	#22
Morley Barbie Ken Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Norway	What's the purpose behind those pins? My dads '87 Opel Omega had a jumper in the trunk, to select the octane rating of the fuel...I think it was L-Jetronic too. 2.0i.

07-18-2006, 03:51 PM	#24
Morley Barbie Ken Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Norway	Hmm.....VADIS has no description of those pins...9, 18, 19, 21, 24 and 25 are "blank".

07-18-2006, 04:32 PM	#25
JW240 visst Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: The Netherlands, Europe	i just drove home (70 miles) with pin 18 and 19 grounded. car ran great, but impossible to tell if it was from the advance. I'll try to go to my volvo mechanic and borrow the timing light..

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