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244Ti Stage Rally Project

Viel gr??er als die TD04HL-Serie. Die TD05-16G sollte ungef?hr der Selbstegr??e als der Cosworth TB03-Lader sein. Warum sie so langsam zu spulen w?ren ist eine Question der Tuning und Qualit?t der Handwerkskunst der Motoren.

Kannst du noch mir erz?hlen, warum meinen GTX nur am ungef?hr 3700 Drehzahl Oberdruck sieht?

In stock form, the 16T connected to a whiteblock 5 cylinder generates up to 260 horsepower with modest boost levels and a stock tune. Crank the boost to 12 psi or more, and you'll get 300+ HP from that set up.
 
In stock form, the 16T connected to a whiteblock 5 cylinder generates up to 260 horsepower with modest boost levels and a stock tune. Crank the boost to 12 psi or more, and you'll get 300+ HP from that set up.

This.

I'm only shooting for 200whp with the 16T and I don't really feel like that is asking too much out of it.

More focused on making the car fairly easy to drive so I can finish rallies. That's really my only goal for the time being
 


Went up and worked on the car today.



Almost the whole cage is mocked up and ready to be welded in



Proceeded to take all the bars out and went to removing the hump in the floor where the factory seats mount. My first time using a spot weld drill bit. Some of the angles can be a pain in the butt, but got it out after about an hour and a half later.
 
I am actually the gentlest and kindest of souls, you know that...I wish peace and happiness to everybody...And I know every poster ever here have all been brilliant posts with wonderful and brilliant ideas, every single one..Its just a question of how brilliant one idea is compared to other brilliant ideas...

sigged
 
That main hoop is super far back.

The small door openings on a 244 exaggerate it a good amount especially in terms of distance to the b pillar which is irrelevant from what I understand, but from my prespective (not an engineer or cage builder) I'm pretty sure there are two ideal spots to place the main hoop and it's either snug right up in front or on top of the bump in the floor for the backseat (or if you are from the underside the front of the rear trailing arm) with it well plated around it. I could be wrong but having it on top seems more ideal for a rally car considering what it is doing. My 244 road race car has it in front of the bump and this is maybe 6 inches back.
 
Here's a finished example of a 244 rally car up in Canada campaigned by Eric Ewert with similar main hoop placement

25485829372_01c750cb12_b.jpg
 


Been busy with the holidays myself but Al sent me this update.

I also received an official response from the ARA in regards to whether or not I will be able to run Group 5

"On the question of whether you can enter in a Group 5 car, that is being debated by the ARA Board right now. We should see an announcement in early Jan. We do have the ability to grant exemptions based on previous motorsport experience so I guess you will be one of the first candidates for the soon to be appointed ARA Competition Director. "
 
Keeping it fairly simple for now - have a line on some Bilstein UMS struts with modified knuckles from another rally car that is upgrading to E36 stuff.
 
Cool build, I envy your rules, if we want to run turbo here we have to stick strictly to group 2 or group A rules. Group 2 is no fun and group A is impossible to find parts as almost nothing is made these days.

Look over here in Sweden for suspensionstuff that is tested, proven and works, you can make a 240 fast on gravel but it takes some work.
The front is easy, bolt on parts work great, like this: http://www.motorsportshop.nu/epages...rtshop.nu/Products/100042/SubProducts/100042R

and this: http://www.motorsportshop.nu/epages...op.nu/Products/100027-1/SubProducts/100027-1L

The back is harder, without making some room for coilovers in the frame its hard to get the suspensiontravel you need to get good grip.

A good start in the back is a decent diff that releases when not under load and locks up good when you are on the throttle.
We used this as a budget alternative before, it worked good but was a bit fragile. http://bakaxel.se/lamelldiff-rally-rallycross-drifting-volvo.html

If you want the best, this is it: http://www.tractive.se/products/differentials
very expensive but unbreakable and awesome, we also use a Tractive transmission.
 
Make sure you box the lower arms. Front and back. They like to bend on 240s.

Yup! We were planning on doing that. I have an extra set of Josh's plates but Al said we need to go even thicker!

Cool build, I envy your rules, if we want to run turbo here we have to stick strictly to group 2 or group A rules. Group 2 is no fun and group A is impossible to find parts as almost nothing is made these days.

Look over here in Sweden for suspensionstuff that is tested, proven and works, you can make a 240 fast on gravel but it takes some work.
The front is easy, bolt on parts work great, like this: http://www.motorsportshop.nu/epages...rtshop.nu/Products/100042/SubProducts/100042R

and this: http://www.motorsportshop.nu/epages...op.nu/Products/100027-1/SubProducts/100027-1L

The back is harder, without making some room for coilovers in the frame its hard to get the suspensiontravel you need to get good grip.

A good start in the back is a decent diff that releases when not under load and locks up good when you are on the throttle.
We used this as a budget alternative before, it worked good but was a bit fragile. http://bakaxel.se/lamelldiff-rally-rallycross-drifting-volvo.html

If you want the best, this is it: http://www.tractive.se/products/differentials
very expensive but unbreakable and awesome, we also use a Tractive transmission.

Thanks for the links! I had mostly been eyeballing the Sellholm stuff but if I am seeing things right, that stuff is cheaper & pretty much the same.

For the rear, I will eventually go with JVL's suggestion of shock towers to solve the rear travel but that will probably come next year along with a big fuel cell.

Those diff options look nice, I was thinking of trying a welded diff from the get go to see how I like it. Have not heard much bad things about going that route.
 
Welded diff works but its not fast, a diff that releases to fully open when not under load works much better, with a welded diff you cant let of the throttle in a turn without loosing a lot of time.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dno0ON1Cj9k
Good example of how our diff works, very different then a solid diff, it is very noticeable when the road is bad.
Nice and steady with powertransfer to the wheel that needs it, fast.

We use Reiger suspension from http://tech-pro.se/, not cheap but very awesome and Micke that runs the place is a great guy with lots and lots of knowledge.
 
The welded diff definitely isn't ideal, but if you have limited funds, it takes about an hour to install. We finally (after 3 years) broke an axle on the rally car with a welded diff. It was a full throttle shift (that was pretty abrupt) mid corner and the outside axle broke at the splines.

I know that there are a few RWD rally guys that used to use locking differentials with good success (not the G80, those are not worth it). They're not nearly as nice as a good LSD, but for $250 new, they're about 1/5th the price.

You still might be able to pick up a Gripper diff for ~$1100 USD with whatever ramp angles you spec, FYI.
 
The welded diff definitely isn't ideal, but if you have limited funds, it takes about an hour to install. We finally (after 3 years) broke an axle on the rally car with a welded diff. It was a full throttle shift (that was pretty abrupt) mid corner and the outside axle broke at the splines.

I know that there are a few RWD rally guys that used to use locking differentials with good success (not the G80, those are not worth it). They're not nearly as nice as a good LSD, but for $250 new, they're about 1/5th the price.

You still might be able to pick up a Gripper diff for ~$1100 USD with whatever ramp angles you spec, FYI.

I'm also thinking the Wavetrac might not be a bad option. Has a lifetime warranty. Sub $1k too

We'll see how my budget looks come March or so. It was with a totally different car doing a different type of racing on a similar surface, but my stock car had a spool and I thought it was predictable enough so I don't think a welded diff will be too bad, I definitely know there are better options.

Made a few trips up to Novato this week to work on the car with Al.

Getting it cleaned up for seam welding, found a couple of cracks here and there.





Yesterday we got the gas tank, rear axle and front crossmember out. Just about ready to go on the rotisserie next time I'm up there.


 
You are killing it with the progress!
I wish my shop wasn't 20deg currently. It really makes playing with race cars difficult when you're dressed up like the Michelin man.

Since you came from a circle track background, I doubt you'll have trouble pitching the car into corners with a welded diff.
My only hesitation with the wavetrac is the durability of the locking mechanism and how well it will hold up to repeated abuse. It's a twirly gear diff which is somewhat decent for road racing if the tires stay on the ground and loaded, but worthless for rally as they get really funky as grip changes from one wheel to the other rapidly. The price difference between the Wavetrac and a Gripper is about a month of Top Ramen...
 
You are killing it with the progress!
I wish my shop wasn't 20deg currently. It really makes playing with race cars difficult when you're dressed up like the Michelin man.
..

Downside of my shop is the roof leaks, upside is that means the landlord pays for infinite heat, its 75 degrees in there right now. Take that, carbon footprint!

Indeed, Pat is killing it. Every time he comes up, he gets about a weeks work done in a day.
 
Downside of my shop is the roof leaks, upside is that means the landlord pays for infinite heat, its 75 degrees in there right now. Take that, carbon footprint!

Indeed, Pat is killing it. Every time he comes up, he gets about a weeks work done in a day.

You should come up and cage the Moostang for me. I can provide you a dry workplace that's about 20 degrees right now. I'll feed you unlimited tacos and coffee. I'll sit in the house being warm.
 
I always feel like I could get more done - but for living 100 miles away, trying not to get too dirty [I've been visiting my sick grandmother each time I come up - so I don't want to go into the nursing home looking like a bum], not having my toolbox there, shooting the **** a bunch and having to eat a burrito with a fork and knife at lunch I am satisfied enough with the progress.

Al is killing it too.

Reminds me a lot of the conditions and workspace when I was dealing with building my other 244 race car. Except that shop was cold & wet.
 
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