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b230R build

Bloody244

Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2019
Location
Germany
So i just blew up my daily driver 138k km b230f+t at 20ish psi trying to overtake a mk3 golf number 4 rod came outside to say hello.

im currently building a new engine its a 92 b230R block
i want it to be bulletproof for 300hp

stock b230 crank
acm.se forged h-beam
mahle cast piston
gasket matched 531 head
v16t cam
also planning to go with a haltech elite 1500

i have heard that the mahle pistons hold 400hp is that true?
 
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If you search around you'll find plenty of testimonials of the stock pistons handling a lot of power. But a proper tune is what will make the engine last. If you don't know what happened to cause the engine failure. It would be wise to make sure things are well sorted out. Injectors flowing to rated flow, fuel supply up to the engines needs, and a stable good tune on the engine.
 
the engine was hurt because the cam plug blew out and because of that i ran the car with .5 liter oil for 40-45km. i think the rods were bent already because a year ago the boost solenoid didnt work. the boost was around 28 psi with stock lh2.2 sounded like firecrackers. it never ran right after that and huge pressure in the crankcase

Fuel pump is rated for 550 hp
injectors a flow tested and flow 550cc
AFR stayed at 12-11.5 during boost
 
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The stock mahle pistons are forgiving but only give you a little leeway to detonation.


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So i just blew up my 138k km b230f+t at 20ish psi trying to overtake a mk3 golf number 4 rod came outside to say hello.

im currently building a new engine its a 92 b230R block
i want it to be bulletproof for 300hp

stock b230 crank
acm.se forged h-beam
mahle cast piston
gasket matched 531 head
v16t cam
also planning to go with a haltech elite 1500

i have heard that the mahle pistons hold 400hp is that true?
'
If you are building an engine from the bottom up I suggest you don't use stock Mahle pistons as the tech has come a long way since then. It not just about holding up. Avoiding detonation is the goal no matter what piston you have in there. The head design also plays a huge part in detonation. What would be nice is a toroidal head design. I wonder would a 4 stroke love it as much as a two stroke does. With such a head the CC can be tightened to the mechanical squish in a 2 stroke and it wont knock and pepper the head and piston. A gas ported skirted piston would be an upgrade to a Mahle. The Pistons ImportTuning used on his build I like alot as they appear to have a high wrist pin mounting location which help to stabilize the piston in the cylinder. The reversed dome petal top piston also looks promising as a piston performance upgrade in an engine build.

Regards
Hubert
 
'
If you are building an engine from the bottom up I suggest you don't use stock Mahle pistons as the tech has come a long way since then. It not just about holding up. Avoiding detonation is the goal no matter what piston you have in there. The head design also plays a huge part in detonation. What would be nice is a toroidal head design. I wonder would a 4 stroke love it as much as a two stroke does. With such a head the CC can be tightened to the mechanical squish in a 2 stroke and it wont knock and pepper the head and piston. A gas ported skirted piston would be an upgrade to a Mahle. The Pistons ImportTuning used on his build I like alot as they appear to have a high wrist pin mounting location which help to stabilize the piston in the cylinder. The reversed dome petal top piston also looks promising as a piston performance upgrade in an engine build.

Regards
Hubert

you are back haha. I hope it stays that way and i will look it the pistons more
 
I would get a turbo with a bigger turbine on it, the stock pistons will be fine for your power level of that is cheapest and easiest for you to get. Just get a reliable tuner and a good fuel system behind it and you will be fine. Linuxman on the forum here crested 700whp on stock pistons recently.
 
the problem is that i made the tests needed to make my car street legal with the 19t so im stuck with it, if i get a hx30 i have to pay around 1500€ just for tests and still have to register it to the T?v and insurance.
 
So i just blew up my 138k km b230f+t at 20ish psi trying to overtake a mk3 golf number 4 rod came outside to say hello.

Sure hope it was a turbo vr6 :oops:

im currently building a new engine its a 92 b230R block
i want it to be bulletproof for 300hp

gasket matched 531 head

i have heard that the mahle pistons hold 400hp is that true?

Skip the gasket matching, you're only going to make things worse for flow. Send the head to a knowledgably porter, or open the chamber and port the exhaust bowl and SSR yourself.

Stock turbo pistons will be fine for your power levels. Forged pistons will take ever so slightly more abuse, but you can still kill them in a few seconds with bad tuning. Forged pistons can also wear out faster depending on a few things.
 
Sure hope it was a turbo vr6 :oops:

Skip the gasket matching, you're only going to make things worse for flow. Send the head to a knowledgably porter, or open the chamber and port the exhaust bowl and SSR yourself.

Stock turbo pistons will be fine for your power levels. Forged pistons will take ever so slightly more abuse, but you can still kill them in a few seconds with bad tuning. Forged pistons can also wear out faster depending on a few things.

+1

Also, forged pistons usually run looser piston>wall, so more cold piston slap, more cold blowby, more possibility of bad/initial tuning to cause catastrophic engine failure if your not on top of things.
 
On the plus side, if you do have some issues along the way, you'll probably have to pull the motor apart and replace things, but there's a far better chance that it won't completely self destruct and require an entire new motor.

I pinged one set of forged pistons to death due to a lack of fuel pump capacity - broke the top ring, collapsed the top ring land... but the pistons hung together, so I was able to take it apart and rebuild it due to low compression, not due to it throwing a rod and scattering bits all over the road. And another time (which I can't really believe happened) when a wrist pin broke, I drove it a decent number of miles (even with some full boosty pulls) with a 'lifter tick'. Could a stock cast Mahle piston hang together with only one half of the pin holding it in? Probably not.
 
you are back haha. I hope it stays that way and I will look it the pistons more


Thanks! That's politics for ya....but it doesn't truly stop anything. Were still building and sharing inclusively with our real friends here and abroad. Im very happy in my life and nothing can change this or how things really work. Please take an in depth look at modern piston tech. There's alot of improvement to be had there.

Good luck
Hubert
 
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Sure hope it was a turbo vr6 :oops:



Skip the gasket matching, you're only going to make things worse for flow. Send the head to a knowledgably porter, or open the chamber and port the exhaust bowl and SSR yourself.

Stock turbo pistons will be fine for your power levels. Forged pistons will take ever so slightly more abuse, but you can still kill them in a few seconds with bad tuning. Forged pistons can also wear out faster depending on a few things.

it was a 90 hp tdi haha
it was gasket matched when i got it. im going to order from overboostracing.se a stage 2 or 3 ported 531 head with larger valves
 
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it was a 90 hp tdi haha
it was gasket matched when i got it. im going to order from overboostracing.se a stage 2 or 3 ported 531 head with larger valves

I'm not sure you'll get much out of a ported head with the 19t, the problem is the hotside is fairly restrictive on even the biggest td04's. I'd save that money for now, and if you decide to re-cert it later with a more modern turbo, re-visit it if you feel it's a restriction. At 300hp however, even a stock 530 head isn't really much of a holdup. I would second the longer rod/higher pin thought process, there are trade-offs that some folks will argue until they're blue in the face (and you can probably search those threads out if you'd like), and I believe you can bump the rod c2c up from the stock 152mm to 160 or a little more, and still retain a decent ring pack. It's been admittedly a while since I've looked at the specific numbers, but the long rod 2.5 I put together in 09 did quite well until the block itself decided to spoil the fun.

On the subject of stock pistons (Since you asked), I've personally had the NA pistons in my 16v car up to 670whp at around 40psi, any number of people have made over 300whp for quite some time with na and turbo pistons, so if you were required to use them (doubt tuv would open the engine up though) I wouldn't really worry about it, but if you can run newer stuff I think you'll like how it performs a bit better over the OE stuff.
 
Also, forged pistons usually run looser piston>wall, so more cold piston slap, more cold blowby, more possibility of bad/initial tuning to cause catastrophic engine failure if your not on top of things.

100% this.
Old rally race motor sat for ~ 4 months and got some rust in the bores in that time. Upon start up, the rust chewed up the thin ring pack which caused excessive blow by. Engine made it about 3 min of racing before it holed 2 pistons and pushed most of the oil out through the breather.
 
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