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Old 09-16-2022, 11:38 AM   #26
wht_245wagoon
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Yea IPD was stating that the B21 and B23 had the washers and some B230s did. I ordered one but will check all my clearances without and see if it needs it or not. Need to wait till stuff arrives.
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Old 09-16-2022, 11:56 AM   #27
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You are on the right track. The thing that concerned me when we spoke on the phone was that you said the cam bolt just tightened when you tried to turn the cam clockwise, and then just loosened when you tried turning the cam the other direction.

Even without a roll pin, the cam should be able to be turned clockwise with that bolt pretty easily.
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Old 09-16-2022, 12:30 PM   #28
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If I had over torqued the cam covers could that have prevented it from spinning? Or if the clearances were too tight with the shims?
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Old 09-16-2022, 12:50 PM   #29
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Over tightened cam caps will definitely cause binding with the cam. It's easy to go over the 14ftlb they are supposed to be tightened to.
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Old 09-16-2022, 12:53 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZVOLV View Post
I don't really recall there being a washer that goes behind the cam gear in B230F.
Washer on back side of cam gear? So like Gear > Washer > Camshaft

Never ever seen that....

The washer most likely caused the cam pin failure by not allowing it to sit down properly and caused to much load on too small an area of the pin
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Old 09-16-2022, 01:09 PM   #31
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Yeah ^^^

I edited my post, but I originally declared there is no washer behind the cam gear, but I thought I've seen one before on old models. I can't remember.

That still doesn't explain why the cam wouldn't turn.

OP told me he put a T cam from a different engine in this head.
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Old 09-16-2022, 01:17 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philski o'flood View Post
Washer on back side of cam gear? So like Gear > Washer > Camshaft

Never ever seen that....

The washer most likely caused the cam pin failure by not allowing it to sit down properly and caused to much load on too small an area of the pin
The washer is a factory part that was only used on certain B230 engines.

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Fits 240, 740, 760

B200E, B200F, B200K. B200E, B200F. B200ET. B200ET 1289134 ENG -1797. B200ET 499782, 1289066. B200K. B200K 1289214 ENG -1275. B200K 1289216 ENG -1701. B200K 1289217 ENG -562. B200K 1289218 ENG -920. B230 EXC B230K. B230 EXC B230K 1987. B230A, B230E, B230F. B230E, B230F, B230FX. B230ET. B230F. B230F 1289143 ENG -33869. B230F 1289168 ENG -32805. B230F 1289186 ENG -21458. B230F 1289187 ENG -30799. B230F, B230FT. B230FT. B230FT 1289149 ENG -5506. B230FT 1289159 ENG -5496. B230FT 1289160 ENG -301. B230FT 1289161 ENG -2829. B230FT/GT. B230K 1987. B230K.
Although IPD says it fits B21/B23 it doesn't appear in the parts catalog for those engines.

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Yeah ^^^

I edited my post, but I originally declared there is no washer behind the cam gear, but I thought I've seen one before on old models. I can't remember.

That still doesn't explain why the cam wouldn't turn.

OP told me he put a T cam from a different engine in this head.
Maybe he put the #2 cam cap on backwards and seized the cam?
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Old 09-16-2022, 01:32 PM   #33
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I opened the picture on a real computer (not a phone) and the bearing damage on #2 looks worse than I thought. The cam bearing surface looks even worse!

You likely have a clearance issue, or a lubrication issue. As I mentioned, Plastiguage is the way to go for a quick clearance check. I put an IPD cam in my head and the rear bearing is wiped and so is the cam, but I put it back together that way and I am still running it like that. I was in a rush to get it back together and off the rack.
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Old 09-16-2022, 01:48 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hiperfauto View Post
The washer is a factory part that was only used on certain B230 engines.



Although IPD says it fits B21/B23 it doesn't appear in the parts catalog for those engines.



Maybe he put the #2 cam cap on backwards and seized the cam?

does it have a notch for the pin?
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Old 09-16-2022, 01:52 PM   #35
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the older ones have the large belt guide pieces on either side of the gear no washer behind them
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Old 09-16-2022, 02:14 PM   #36
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The washer did have a notch for the pin on the cam. The caps were on the correct way. I will check the Plastigauge for the clearence. I have another set of caps from another head.
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Old 09-16-2022, 02:25 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMenaceSD View Post
The washer did have a notch for the pin on the cam. The caps were on the correct way. I will check the Plastigauge for the clearence. I have another set of caps from another head.
can you repair the cam? as in replace the pin? Marshall's Hardware on Miramar Rd. should the correct size roll pin for it

Forget checking the clearance it doesn't matter since you can't change it anyways and also forget using caps from the other head... line bored head and caps only work well with their mates.

Just clean up the cam, wire wheel if you have one, and use a green scotch-brite on that cap. Ditch the washer, check valve lash and button it back up
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Old 09-16-2022, 02:30 PM   #38
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On this old engine, I would just clean it up somehow and then run it. Do NOT use scotchbrite pads.

Check the clearances with plastiguage for good measure, set the valve lash, then make sure the cam spins before putting the belt on. If the clearances are too tight you gotta try another cam, or just get a junkyard head/cam combo that hasn't been tampered with (yeah right)

I think you should be good to go.

Do NOT use caps from a different head.
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Old 09-16-2022, 02:35 PM   #39
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do you know "escoboy" Neil? he is a real knowledgable mechanic and lives in Esco
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Old 09-16-2022, 02:42 PM   #40
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I have pins in the mail coming and also getting a belt. I have a wire wheel and the green scotch-brite. Do you happen to know the size of the pin? I can pick up one so I can check the valve lash and order any shims that will be needed.
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Old 09-16-2022, 02:45 PM   #41
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I do not, I haven't really met anyone local on the forums. Been flying solo for majority of the time.
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Old 09-16-2022, 03:23 PM   #42
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I have been trained to NEVER use scotch brite on internal engine components. It leaves abrasive dust.

IPD sells solid dowel pins. I have a couple in my stash if you need one.
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Old 09-16-2022, 03:37 PM   #43
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I have 2 on the way, should be here next week. What would be another option to smooth out the cam and the cap?
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Old 09-16-2022, 03:59 PM   #44
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I said use a scotch brite on that one cap and then, obviously ,
you wash away any dirt grime grease or left over bits of green scrubby before you install it

wire wheel on cam
green scrubby on jacked up aluminum piece
emery cloth to clean up iron block, should you need to do a head gasket

you want to clean aluminum with something softer than aluminum
tooth brush, your finger nail, a popsicle stick, maybe a plastic spoon, old green scrubby from under the kitchen sink

this isn't a space shuttle, it's an old 240
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Old 09-17-2022, 02:45 PM   #45
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Quote:
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I have been trained to NEVER use scotch brite on internal engine components. It leaves abrasive dust.

IPD sells solid dowel pins. I have a couple in my stash if you need one.
This stupid myth needs to die. Go to a crank shaft shop sometime and check out what is used to polish a crankshaft after grinding it.
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Old 09-17-2022, 02:47 PM   #46
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OP, do not reassemble the cam/sprocket without the washer. The washer is what locates the cam sprocket in the right place relative to the idler shaft and crank sprocket.
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Old 09-17-2022, 04:17 PM   #47
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Can I install the cam by itself just to check valve lash or do I need to wait for the washer and install everything?. I just finished fishing out the pin from the cam.
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Old 09-17-2022, 04:24 PM   #48
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Quote:
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Can I install the cam by itself just to check valve lash or do I need to wait for the washer and install everything?. I just finished fishing out the pin from the cam.
No problem doing that. Without the washer the sprockets will not be aligned and at high speed, the belt may want to wander. It also might be fine, hard to say, not worth taking a chance running it that way. For just setting things up, go ahead with what you are doing.
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Old 09-17-2022, 07:47 PM   #49
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If the intermediate shaft spins and no oil comes up does that mean the oil pump isn't connected correctly? Don't want to go through all the trouble of putting it all back together if there is a oiling problem and it happens again.
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Old 09-17-2022, 08:18 PM   #50
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If you are spinning the intermediate shaft clockwise facing the engine and you are turning it fast enough with an air ratchet or electric drill, oil should be coming out of the cam journal supply holes. If not, that’s why you have a scored cam journal and broken cam sprocket dowel pin.
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