home register FAQ memberlist calendar

Go Back   Turbobricks Forums > Mechanical > projects & restorations

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 11-16-2020, 07:33 PM   #751
Duder
Comes with a free Frogurt
 
Duder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Torrance, CA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Buchka View Post
Thanks! I can't imagine it either, if my mind wanders in that direction it reminds me of how much work is left and I get depressed. Just eating this elephant one bite at a time.
You can borrow my Miata again if you need to get behind the wheel of a purebred track beast. I'm sure the driving experience will be identical to the FRC.

I need to make it out to the shop more often - you guys are killing it. Also I hadn't realized how low this thing will be, but it makes sense. Slammed AF.
Duder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2020, 07:42 PM   #752
Tfrasca
Board Member
 
Tfrasca's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Ben Lomond, CA
Default

This will be the best car in the world.
Tfrasca is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2020, 07:45 PM   #753
Harlard
Hurlurd?Harland?Bueller?
 
Harlard's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: PDX
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tfrasca View Post
This will be the best car in the world.
Bet it gets air conditioning, cut wool pile carpets, and leather padded touch points on the spaceframe too.
__________________


Herr Harlard am Erstens

1979 242 DL

Quote:
Originally Posted by t8fanning View Post
My knob has a big chunk of steel on it
Harlard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-19-2020, 06:07 PM   #754
tjanson
Board Member
 
tjanson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Underhill, VT
Default

Do you treat the wood build table as a rigid fixture or is primarily to support the chassis and act as a reference plane? I've thought about making a welding table out of engineered lumber, topped with 12 gauge steel because it seems easier to make flat without the warpage that comes with welding.
__________________
1993 245 DL; LH2.4, M47 - DD & Winter Beater
1978 242 GT - To Be Restored, someday
1993 245 DL - OEM+ Project
tjanson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-20-2020, 07:51 PM   #755
Alex Buchka
8 cylinders
 
Alex Buchka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Los Angeles
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duder View Post
You can borrow my Miata again if you need to get behind the wheel of a purebred track beast. I'm sure the driving experience will be identical to the FRC.

I need to make it out to the shop more often - you guys are killing it. Also I hadn't realized how low this thing will be, but it makes sense. Slammed AF.
I would be honored to try and ruin your track beast again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Harlard View Post
Bet it gets air conditioning, cut wool pile carpets, and leather padded touch points on the spaceframe too.
Don't forget the TV's, champagne chiller, and sno-cone maker.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tjanson View Post
Do you treat the wood build table as a rigid fixture or is primarily to support the chassis and act as a reference plane? I've thought about making a welding table out of engineered lumber, topped with 12 gauge steel because it seems easier to make flat without the warpage that comes with welding.
It's mostly the latter. The table does have more compliance than I would like so as long as you're cognizant of how much weight you're putting on there it should stay flat enough. This table was always a temporary structure and we're nearing the end of its useful life. It'll get scrapped soon and the chassis will sit on jack stands for the remainder of the build.


Control arm fixture is ready for action. Each counter-bored pocket gets a brass spacer slug that presses into a uniball weld cup, those will then get connected with 4130 tubing. The two rectangular plates in this pic suit the four left hand arms, there's another pair of mirrored plates for the right hand arms.




Got the first corner's worth of suspension brackets tacked in place. Getting the fixture lined up took a few hours of adjusting and careful measuring. This first corner was pretty time consuming since I was essentially establishing the datum for the other three corners, the remaining tabs should progress pretty quickly. Having the mounting tabs laser cut to near net shape was also a big time saver.




The steering rack set the fore-aft position of the suspension mounting locations so I took the opportunity to finish up the attachments for it as well. The machined clamp collars that go on the rack were done a while ago so all I had to do here was transfer punch, drill the front bulkhead, and weld in four pieces of tubing the rack bolts to.
Alex Buchka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2021, 04:50 PM   #756
Alex Buchka
8 cylinders
 
Alex Buchka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Los Angeles
Default

Got a big box of 3x.035" inconel 625 tubing for the exhaust. Going into this I was intending to make it all stainless but I made a throw away phone call to Woolf Aircraft to see if they had any surplus and I ended up getting everything we needed in inco for 321 stainless prices. Some of the bends are a little wrinkled but it doesn't really matter to me.


Exhaust manifolds came back from welding. Couldn't be more satisfied with how the welding came out, the guy who did the work is an ace with the TIG. All the joints are welded in one pass and look phenomenal.




Fit checked the blurbos and everything is looking really good so far. All the clearances are as expected, really excited to build the exhaust and get some plumbing on these things.



Alex Buchka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2021, 05:30 PM   #757
blkaplan
50 shades of beige
 
blkaplan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Rockville, MD
Default

amazing
__________________
www.BEIGEPOWER.com
Kaplhenke Racing Facebook
Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkKratoz View Post
The only safe bet is Ben.©
blkaplan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2021, 05:39 PM   #758
Stiggy Pop
Board Member
 
Stiggy Pop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Granville, MA
Default

I can certainly understand why you made the comments elsewhere that this is a "motor swap only a mother could love". I'm glad you guys are taking it on.

I've been interested in the additive processes you've used, and chatted about it with some with buddies at work (I'm in manufacturing). I'm curious if you've taken that route out of design requirements, equipment access, a desire to experiment, or some combination of all? Some of those pieces represent some pretty significant amount of machine time! We have started getting more involved with additive inconel processes with some heat exchangers.
__________________
'79 242
943 pickup
Stiggy Pop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2021, 06:38 PM   #759
redblockpowered
cone dodging dilettante
 
redblockpowered's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: In bed, probably
Default

What are the advantages of an inconel exhaust?
__________________
1993 944 B230FT/M90 thread here: http://forums.turbobricks.com/showthread.php?t=345277
2x 1991 245 B230F/M47 (LeMons car, street car)
I sell chips for LH 2.4!
redblockpowered is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2021, 06:58 PM   #760
Alex Buchka
8 cylinders
 
Alex Buchka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Los Angeles
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stiggy Pop View Post
I can certainly understand why you made the comments elsewhere that this is a "motor swap only a mother could love". I'm glad you guys are taking it on.

I've been interested in the additive processes you've used, and chatted about it with some with buddies at work (I'm in manufacturing). I'm curious if you've taken that route out of design requirements, equipment access, a desire to experiment, or some combination of all? Some of those pieces represent some pretty significant amount of machine time! We have started getting more involved with additive inconel processes with some heat exchangers.
Thanks dude. We're all in on the B8444s sunk cost fallacy at this point.

The additive stuff was initially driven by machine access. We've been fortunate enough to build a relationship with a local shop that does really high end work and the owners are sympathetic to the FRC cause. The headers and intake manifold were definitely tough packaging problems that were a bit easier to solve with the "free" complexity of DMLS. Another big part was the design challenge, I'm heavily accustomed to designing 3+2 machined parts so I had to unlearn a lot of that mindset when designing for printing. I like solving problems and this was a big nut to crack. You really have to think of the end-to-end process in the design phase so you don't paint yourself into a corner.

Feel free to PM me if you want to chat more about it. Additive is not a replacement for machining but it can be extremely cost effective in the right application.

Quote:
Originally Posted by redblockpowered View Post
What are the advantages of an inconel exhaust?
Over 321 stainless, not a whole lot. Post-turbine EGT is low enough that it's not really necessary but it will make the exhaust lighter and more durable over time. Especially when you start applying thermal barrier coatings to the outside of the tube that drive the material temperature up.
Alex Buchka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2021, 10:54 PM   #761
Duder
Comes with a free Frogurt
 
Duder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Torrance, CA
Default

When you already have a tube chassis, Indycar transaxled, twin turbo V8 242, it would be rude not to use Inconel for the entire exhaust system!
Duder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-15-2021, 03:26 AM   #762
Alex Buchka
8 cylinders
 
Alex Buchka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Los Angeles
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duder View Post
When you already have a tube chassis, Indycar transaxled, twin turbo V8 242, it would be rude not to use Inconel for the entire exhaust system!
Seconded!


Got some more parts in the mail. Ordered a couple v-band flanges for the downpipes:


Got a few really slick oxygen sensor bungs from Reid Washbon. It's the little details and these things are primo. Also came with a free notepad:


Lunched this bearing taking it off. Cost me $80 and a bruised ego. This is the back business end of a torque tube from a C5 vette and is part of what makes the xtrac magic happen:


Pulled the drop gear cover off the xtrac to machine a hole in it for the reverse lockout. The small post to the left of the center shaft is the reverse selector shaft, this is what the lockout mechanism blocks from moving.


The insides of this gearbox are amazing. It's like a jewelry box.


Had to stop and check wipe a few times during this operation. Screwing it up would have been grounds for ritual suicide.


Then Karl and I had a potential Corona exposure event so we've been locked in the apartment for the last week. I took the time to order up a mountain of laser cut brackets that arrived today. I've been using sendcutsend.com for the last few orders and they really kick ass. Super clean cuts, excellent prices, and crazy fast delivery. This entire pile took four days from order to arrival.

This heap is mounting brackets for the dash display, current sensor, yaw sensor, heat exchangers, and wastegate actuators, end tanks for the rad, oil cooler, and intercooler, main hoop bulkhead panels, wiring bulkhead brackets, and weld-on rivet strips for various things.

Last edited by Alex Buchka; 01-15-2021 at 03:43 PM..
Alex Buchka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2021, 05:08 AM   #763
towz-T
EL hipo explosive
 
towz-T's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Belgium
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by redblockpowered View Post
What are the advantages of an inconel exhaust?
Pro: Super light, heat resistance properties.
Cons: PITA to work with (apperently). Very expensive.

F1 (and some others high end race cars) exhausts at Inconel 625. They can be made extremely thin and therefore light, and also because of the great heat resistance properties.

Also used in nuclear reactor cores and spacemachineshiprocketthings
__________________
'00 V70 2.5TDI <= stored until i sell it
'04 V70 2.4TDI <= exploded in norway
'10 V70 2.0TDI <= DD
'89 745 B204GT <= project moneypit
my introduction thread that i am desperately trying to keep alive


Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Bondo View Post
cuz on turbobricks, posting about something and not doing it counts as quitting a project halfway through. Quitting a project halfway through counts as finishing it.

Yay you finished it!
towz-T is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2021, 04:25 PM   #764
liamcafs
Newbie
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Default

I love this thread, its such a great read........ Oh and by the way, completely by coincidence, I just bought a B8444s to swap into my 240 wagon.

https://imgur.com/nfUzXAk
liamcafs is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2021, 05:18 PM   #765
HiSPL
Board Member
 
HiSPL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: College Station, TX
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by liamcafs View Post
I love this thread, its such a great read........ Oh and by the way, completely by coincidence, I just bought a B8444s to swap into my 240 wagon.

https://imgur.com/nfUzXAk
I hope you've got the skills to pay the bills. It's an incredible motor for a 240, but its so hard to make it work. It's also easy to find and cheap to buy since the transmissions grenaded on so many of them.

Keep us up to date!
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by 240240 View Post
Beets taste like buttfeet.
88 244
06 XC90 V8
03 V70
HiSPL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2021, 05:36 PM   #766
Wilford Brimley
Is posting from the grave
 
Wilford Brimley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Marysville, wa
Default

Everything you guys do is the sexiest thing ever
Wilford Brimley is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-04-2021, 11:56 PM   #767
Alex Buchka
8 cylinders
 
Alex Buchka's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Los Angeles
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by liamcafs View Post
I love this thread, its such a great read........ Oh and by the way, completely by coincidence, I just bought a B8444s to swap into my 240 wagon.

https://imgur.com/nfUzXAk
Thanks! You should make a project thread, I'd love to see your progress.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilford Brimley View Post
Everything you guys do is the sexiest thing ever
That's debatable, but thank you!

Ran low on motivation for a stretch but we're back at it now. I had the previous week off in between jobs so I made a big push to finish up the control arms.

I was a little worried I'd gone overboard on the fixture for the arms but after using it for the past few days I actually could have made it a bit more rigid. Welding distortion can exert tremendous force and the 1/4" aluminum base plate does get a little bendy at times.







The outer pivot is located on the smaller common plate. The larger plates are made in unique pairs for each side of the car. The bearing cups get pressed on to some brass standoffs that both locate the endpoint at the right height and keep the ID from distorting during welding.

Arm construction is fairly simple. 4130 tubes and spherical bearing weld cups. The lower arms have some sheet metal gussets where the damper mounts will get welded on.

Took a few arms to get the process dialed. All the tubes are larger OD than the height of the bearing cups so the ends all got smashed down in the press, then trimmed with the notcher until they fit nicely.





Welds got progressively nicer as i got into the process. I don't fabricate stuff for a living so I'm really happy that I can maintain reasonable consistency even after a month+ hiatus from the TIG.

So far I have six out of eight complete less damper mounts. The remaining two rear upper arms are a bit more complex to accommodate some less than ideal damper packaging. They will get some additional taco gussets for peace of mind. I fabricated this forming tool out of literal trash I found laying around the shop. It's not the slickest thing to use but I'm only forming a handful of gussets so it does the job.






Welded up the yaw sensor mount.


Started adding some paneling.



Made some jack-screw doodads for the xtrac. Everything on this gearbox has threaded inserts to aid removal, pretty slick.



Picked up a flush mount fuel filler.


Spent a bunch of time welding and blending this sweet mounting bracket for the stack dash, then i sat in the car and realized the rim of the wheel blocks the view of the entire tach. Derp.



Picked up this carbon diffuser from an NSX GT3. It's a bit rough but all the bad parts will get trimmed off anyway. It will actually fit with the bodywork pretty well. Having this part is a welcome constraint to the design space of the rear of the car. It's a good forcing function to derive the design of the rear structure.


Alex Buchka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2021, 09:54 AM   #768
Mueller
Board Member
 
Mueller's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Antioch, CA
Default

Hot Rodders Hall of Fame car right here. ^
__________________
.........
Mueller is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2021, 10:11 AM   #769
blkaplan
50 shades of beige
 
blkaplan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Rockville, MD
Default

slick!
blkaplan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-05-2021, 09:59 PM   #770
Duder
Comes with a free Frogurt
 
Duder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Torrance, CA
Default

You guys should take a break from all of this FRCing so we can finally finish the pickup bed.

I am still looking forward to never being allowed to drive it!
Duder is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-07-2021, 10:01 AM   #771
Hank Scorpio
Chubfest 2009 Survivor
 
Hank Scorpio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: The neighborhood with the ******* guitar player.
Default

Ugh. Freaking epic! That diffuser is bad ass!!
__________________
Hank Scorpio is from the Simpsons. You can call me Doug ;)
Will trade guitars/guitar parts for go fast goodies or stuff I need. Just PM.
www.kauerguitars.com the second best way to upset neighbors and alienate people.
History: Car 1 (242) | Car 2 (t5r) | Car 3 (255)
Hank Scorpio is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:15 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions Inc.