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Old 10-26-2021, 10:53 PM   #1
TruthOrBlair
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Question Please Help with Engine Decision

Hi Everybody,

I'll tell you up front, I know just enough to get into trouble -- I'm by no means up to the level of most of you. Thank you all in advance for your patience -- I just want to do this right.

Last week I bought a 1982 Volvo 245 GLT, manual transmission with overdrive. The car has 274K miles, and a notebook of receipts and documentation that's at least three inches thick. Very detailed, and great to have. I've even gotten to speak with a few of the previous owners, all of whom maintained the documentation. Pretty incredible, actually.

The last owner parked the car at his dental practice, and it sat there for ten or twelve years. When they tried to start it, the motor was seized. I am now in the process of trying to free it up, and have been able to gain a little bit of ground combining "Breaker-Loose" lubricant through the spark plug holes, and a breaker bar. It's the original B21FT.

My questions are:

1. Would I be decreasing the value of the car if I change engines?
2. If I do change engines, should I find another B21FT?
3. Would I be better off getting a B23F and adding the turbo from the current engine?

I'm into the car for relatively little, and can spend about $4,000 in getting it back on the road.

Seriously -- my thanks to everyone for their knowledge and their willingness to share with folks like myself!

Blair
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Old 10-27-2021, 08:29 AM   #2
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Congrats on the Volvo adoption! If the car has been sitting that long its likely you are going to have some kjet related issues to deal with as well. Whether or not you want to continue down the kjet path or opt to go some other way (LH, aftermarket, etc) is up to you and there is a lot of good info here to help you out with that decision.

Other opinions may vary, but unless it is a concourse condition super low mile original vehicle the value isn't really going to matter much if you decide to go with more modern EFI and/or engine assembly from a later model.
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Old 10-27-2021, 11:48 AM   #3
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dlot (Dave Lotman) has some B21s for sale in new jersey if you go that way. I'm a fan of cobbling, but it sounds like it wants to be original (that would make redwood ken very happy, btw)
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Old 10-27-2021, 12:32 PM   #4
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Put a 50/50 mix of atf and penetrating oil in the cylinders and let it sit for a week. The kjet fuel system is going to need complete refurbishing. The brake system is going to need refurbishing. You have a decent budget for bringing it back on the road if you diy.

Thanks for the shoutout Mike!
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Old 10-27-2021, 06:51 PM   #5
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I keep forgetting all the name changes. You were dlot when we met.
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Old 10-29-2021, 06:58 PM   #6
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First off, get the Bentley 240 Service Manual - it has lots of good info on K-Jet. You can also find factory "greenbook" manuals on the ozvolvo.org site.

Secondly, what's your ability level for car repairs and modifications? Are you comfortable swapping and refurbishing an engine? Can you follow a wiring diagram and troubleshoot electrical issues?

K-Jet continuous fuel injection is an electro-mechanical marvel and works fine when maintained and not parked for long periods of time. Good condition used parts are becoming harder to find for reasonable $$$, and most of the K-Jet wizards at the Volvo shops retired years ago.

A B21FT at 274K miles is getting up there in usable age. The B21/B23/B230 redblock engines all swap fairly easily. If K-Jet isn't your thing, you can convert to LH2.2 EFI (used up to ~1989) or LH2.4 EFI (used through the mid 1990s on the 940s).

What's your end goal with the wagon?
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Old 10-29-2021, 07:55 PM   #7
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The factory turbo cars are getting hard to come by and it makes sense to keep a nice example original at this point. I'd have the engine rebuilt if the bores aren't too far gone.
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Old 10-29-2021, 08:08 PM   #8
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Scott at STS Machining has a freshly rebuilt b21ft for sale. I bet he'd even help get it shipped to you as well.
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Old 10-29-2021, 09:06 PM   #9
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Thank you all for the great insight! Bobxyz, I'm off in search of those manuals you suggested. And Culberro, I've just sent a message to Scott at STS Machining.

What would you guys think of a 24-valve inline 6?

Again, thank you guys so much for all your help. I sincerely appreciate this!
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Old 10-29-2021, 09:12 PM   #10
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It's going to take 4k to get it to a reliable status. If the car is nice(exterior/interior), keep it original. Source a b21ft. Source intercooler parts as well(82 would not be intercooled unless it was dealer added).

You can source b21fts in the $300-700 range. Try to get the lowest mileage possible. Then proceed to refurbish engine. Clean/degreaser, paint block. Replace all seals gaskets. Drop off head on the machine shop for a rebuild. Get yourself a new clutch for transmission. Then comes all the kjet parts(big money). You'll need engine/ignition harness. I personally would buy refurbished fuel distributor, and warm up regulator. Buy new injectors. You'll for sure need a new tank and fuel sender. So you can see how this can add up very quickly and you haven't touched on suspension/brakes or anything else. It's a full refurb.
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Old 10-30-2021, 04:52 PM   #11
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Maybe not what you want to hear.

I’d throw that b21 and it’s kjet/Chrysler system into the woods. Find a 90+ b230. Microsquirt harness and be on my way. No rebuild needed. You could spend thousands rebuilding that kjet system and it will still not run that great.
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Old 10-30-2021, 07:53 PM   #12
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Maybe not what you want to hear.

I’d throw that b21 and it’s kjet/Chrysler system into the woods. Find a 90+ b230. Microsquirt harness and be on my way. No rebuild needed. You could spend thousands rebuilding that kjet system and it will still not run that great.
That makes a lot more sense if it is not a GLT.
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Old 10-30-2021, 08:10 PM   #13
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That makes a lot more sense if it is not a GLT.
I mean, if it was one of real homologated 240’s I could see trying to keep it original. And while 240 turbos aren’t as common as an 86+ 240 they’re by no means rare.

I’m just saying If I was going to spend the money I’d stick something that is mostly a straight bolt in, that I could throw some boost at without having to rebuild, and have it be reliable. You could even get the ac to work again if you really wanted.
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Old 10-30-2021, 08:27 PM   #14
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Find a donor 89+ motor,

get the turbo bits,

megasquirt with LS coils.

Don't look back.
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Old 11-01-2021, 12:11 AM   #15
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UPDATE:

Okay -- So here's the latest.

I thought I had freed the original engine in my 82 GLT wagon today. Turns out, I just sheered off the crankshaft pulley bolt. I guess it's really, really stuck. (Or, I'm really, really strong! Ha ha)

I'm taking that as a sure sign that I should move away from this engine and replace it.

I've found a 1993 940 engine -- it is the B230F REGINA.

Should I avoid it because of the Regina system? It was pulled as a running engine with 148,000 and the seller is asking $350. Another bonus is that it is local.

The other option is a 1984 VOLVO 240 2.3L engine, pulled with only 55,723 MILES. The Vin shows that it was a turbo, according to the Volvo VIN decoder. This one is on eBay for $1349.93. I would also incur shipping charges. And again, I'd probably have to deal with the whole expensive k-jet system.

And finally I found a 1996 Volvo 960 with the 24-Valve Inline 6. I can get that entire car for $2K. HOWEVER, it also has 275K miles.

Do any of these three stick out to you guys as the best possible option?
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Old 11-01-2021, 12:29 AM   #16
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An 84 turbo would be a B21FT and as the nomenclature would suggest 2.1 liters.

An 84 naturally aspirated engine would be a B23F and as the nomenclature would suggest 2.3 liters.

You could run some tests on the k-jet system and probably determine it's viability without running an engine with it.



In the good old days a cheap B230FT engine and ancillary parts from a 740 Turbo donor car would be the call but they're pretty dried up now too.
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Old 11-01-2021, 10:33 AM   #17
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I'd see what STS wants for that rebuilt B21FT.
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Old 11-01-2021, 05:25 PM   #18
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I'd see what STS wants for that rebuilt B21FT.



Much easier to repair a factory system than engineer a new one.
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Old 11-03-2021, 08:50 PM   #19
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Working things out on that engine right now. Thanks for the heads up on STS!
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Old 11-06-2021, 02:10 AM   #20
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Happy to tell you we'll be building an all-Volvo beast. I bought the B21FT from Scott at STS, and it's shipping out Tuesday. Huge thanks to everyone, especially to culberro for the initial lead! You all are awesome!
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Old 11-06-2021, 06:23 AM   #21
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Easy route would be following:
Short block from B230 Regina. Add B21FT cylinder head on to of that. Little work with turbo lubrication, otherwise just bolt on.
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Old 11-06-2021, 04:57 PM   #22
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save your money and get an LS style V8. Better mpg, reliability, more herspers, ease of modification

v8 or you might as well crush it

my swap cost about $4k total and I went the expensive route.
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Old 11-06-2021, 08:17 PM   #23
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I didn't mean to be so negative, lots of ptsd from my last 245 build...
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Old 11-07-2021, 12:23 PM   #24
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I didn't mean to be so negative, lots of ptsd from my last 245 build...
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Old 11-08-2021, 11:11 AM   #25
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save your money and get an LS style V8. Better mpg, reliability, more herspers, ease of modification

v8 or you might as well crush it

my swap cost about $4k total and I went the expensive route.
What are you running for a transmission on the $4k LS build?
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