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Old 02-08-2022, 11:46 AM   #1
rb92673
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Default LH 2.2 dist hall sensor plus crank

I have a B230FT running on Microsquirt for a few years now. I use a LH 2.2 hall sensor in the head mounted distributor for engine timing. I also have an underdrive crank pulley that is tapped for a trigger wheel, but I have never added a trigger wheel or sensor.

Is there any reason I should add a trigger wheel to the crank as a second source of engine timing?

Track only car.
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Old 02-08-2022, 12:18 PM   #2
cwdodson88
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I have a B230FT running on Microsquirt for a few years now. I use a LH 2.2 hall sensor in the head mounted distributor for engine timing. I also have an underdrive crank pulley that is tapped for a trigger wheel, but I have never added a trigger wheel or sensor.

Is there any reason I should add a trigger wheel to the crank as a second source of engine timing?

Track only car.
It would increase resolution and allow you to run wasted spark, or wasted COP, and timed injection. Basically, right now, you have a signal saying yes every 90*, so its guessing where your ignition timing is BTDC. Adding say a 36-1 to the front of the engine gets you down to 10* with no idea what portion of a 720* rotation, but less guessing. Snip a few triggers off the distributor and leave one as a cam "reset" marker and now you have the ability to run full sequential injection and spark and the ecu would know were each cylinder is, so 1, 3, 4, 2,(reset) 1, 3, 4, 2, probably way betterer than what you have now, 90...90... 90...90...
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Old 02-08-2022, 01:14 PM   #3
rb92673
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It would increase resolution and allow you to run wasted spark, or wasted COP, and timed injection. Basically, right now, you have a signal saying yes every 90*, so its guessing where your ignition timing is BTDC. Adding say a 36-1 to the front of the engine gets you down to 10* with no idea what portion of a 720* rotation, but less guessing. Snip a few triggers off the distributor and leave one as a cam "reset" marker and now you have the ability to run full sequential injection and spark and the ecu would know were each cylinder is, so 1, 3, 4, 2,(reset) 1, 3, 4, 2, probably way betterer than what you have now, 90...90... 90...90...
Thanks, I give it a try. I don't really know if I want to do sequential injection, but COP might be useful.
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Old 02-08-2022, 02:37 PM   #4
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If you do the 36-1 (without EDIS) please consider posting the details and parts used and circuit destinations. TB is a virtual desert for this particular kind of info that might be useful for those who don't already know or those who might have done this and are keeping it to themselves. Lots of info on EDIS, CAS and using an LH 2.4 CPS, but zippo on setting up a 36-1 crank wheel.
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Old 02-08-2022, 02:52 PM   #5
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If you do the 36-1 (without EDIS) please consider posting the details and parts used and circuit destinations. TB is a virtual desert for this particular kind of info that might be useful for those who don't already know or those who might have done this and are keeping it to themselves. Lots of info on EDIS, CAS and using an LH 2.4 CPS, but zippo on setting up a 36-1 crank wheel.
Dave B
it's all pretty well covered in the MSExtra stuff. And anyone who is thinking about using megasquirt/micro should really try to get familiar with the manuals, and that forum. A quick google search for Generic wheel modes, 36-1, on MSExtra, there are tons of breakdowns of what sensors/inputs/settings and dos and donts. What it doesnt explain without digging, is every possible coil choice and the individual settings for each.
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Old 02-08-2022, 03:02 PM   #6
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it's all pretty well covered in the MSExtra stuff. And anyone who is thinking about using megasquirt/micro should really try to get familiar with the manuals, and that forum. A quick google search for Generic wheel modes, 36-1, on MSExtra, there are tons of breakdowns of what sensors/inputs/settings and dos and donts. What it doesnt explain without digging, is every possible coil choice and the individual settings for each.
I guess I should have emphasized Volvo redblock specific.
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Old 02-08-2022, 03:05 PM   #7
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If you do the 36-1 (without EDIS) please consider posting the details and parts used and circuit destinations. TB is a virtual desert for this particular kind of info that might be useful for those who don't already know or those who might have done this and are keeping it to themselves. Lots of info on EDIS, CAS and using an LH 2.4 CPS, but zippo on setting up a 36-1 crank wheel.
Dave B
If I do it and get it working I certainly will.
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Old 02-08-2022, 03:34 PM   #8
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I guess I should have emphasized Volvo redblock specific.
That’s just it, there’s nothing about it that’s really redblock specific. Typically these wheels are getting pulled from 90s Ford escorts or just buying generic trigger wheels off the net. So really all you’re doing is telling the ms I have X cylinders, and when you see a missing tooth, that means we have spun 360* and tdc is A* away from the missing tooth(and if you have a cam trigger, you’re saying count til I tell you to restart and cyl 1 is at Y degrees, 3 is at Y+90, etc ), and then you’re asking ms to drive injectors and a coil or 2 or 4.
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Old 02-08-2022, 04:20 PM   #9
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That’s just it, there’s nothing about it that’s really redblock specific. Typically these wheels are getting pulled from 90s Ford escorts or just buying generic trigger wheels off the net. So really all you’re doing is telling the ms I have X cylinders, and when you see a missing tooth, that means we have spun 360* and tdc is A* away from the missing tooth(and if you have a cam trigger, you’re saying count til I tell you to restart and cyl 1 is at Y degrees, 3 is at Y+90, etc ), and then you’re asking ms to drive injectors and a coil or 2 or 4.
Uh-huh . . . more conspicuously non-specific generic stuff. If you've done this on a Volvo engine, maybe you can answer.
Which SPECIFIC wheel was used and how was the wheel adapted to the Volvo crank pulley or balancer or aftermarket pulley? Let's see some pics.
How was the SPECIFIC bracket made or sourced and how was it mounted for the sensor? Pics?
Was a VR or Hall sensor used and where was it SPECIFICALLY sourced from? Pics?
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Old 02-08-2022, 04:42 PM   #10
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In my case a previous owner changed out the crank pulley and made a bracket.

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Old 02-08-2022, 05:12 PM   #11
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parts list is pretty generic.. mostly since this has been the go to for megasquirt triggers since the beginning of MSnS. See here https://www.diyautotune.com/support/...crank-trigger/ and here https://www.diyautotune.com/shop/sen...rigger-wheels/

36-1 trigger from anywhere that has one in a suitable size to clear your accessories. Necessary spacers to get it there. Long enough bolt to make up for the added stuff. In his case, I'm guessing that his pulley is set up for a 90s for EDIS wheel. So 1991 ford escort 1.9L.
Hall geartooth sensor for DIY.
Piece if angle iron or suitable chunk of metal big enough to hit 2 bolts somewhere in the front of the engine while clearing the accessories and having suitable space to mount sensor.

TOOLS REQUIRED:
www.google.com
8oz ball peen hammer, center punch.
drill and drill bits
wire strippers/crimpers
wrench/pliers/visegrips
feeler gauges

Its not exactly rocket surgery. If anyone needs more detail that that, id recommend a yoshifab DSM CAS. Bulletproof, and really straight forward.
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Old 02-08-2022, 05:15 PM   #12
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In my case a previous owner changed out the crank pulley and made a bracket.

looks like you have a pulley made to accept a Ford escort EDIS wheel. Same as what I used.
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Old 02-08-2022, 05:17 PM   #13
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https://www.summitracing.com/parts/r...gaAnShEALw_wcB

I have just the wheel if you want it, lmk.

mark your pulley according to the manual, drop that pulley in the freezer overnight, put the wheel in the oven (mark it on both sides in case you freak out at the last second) heat at 350f for about 20 minutes, pull frozen pulley, take heated ring, align and drop. Doesnt need to be 100% exact, just in the neighborhood. Keep the ball peen on stand by in case you need to ring the bell to get it to seat.

Last edited by cwdodson88; 02-08-2022 at 05:23 PM..
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